IXIboneheadIXI
Well-Known Member
does anyone have a recipe they have tested for dr pepper clone? i would love to see tested recipes before i go ahead and make some
Dr. Pepper Clone
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Here's what I put together today. This is the result of about 3 hours of experimentation. I do not consider this to be a finished recipe, but it's on the right track. I noted exactly what brands I used of most things, in case someone wants to duplicate this exact recipe.
1 quart black cherry juice. Just Black Cherry, R.W. Knudsen Family brand.
2 quarts filtered water. My tap water tastes bad, hence the filtered.
1 cup granulated sugar.
2 tbs molasses. Brer Rabbit; all natural, unsulphured, full flavor.
1/4 tsp rum flavoring. Watkins imitation rum extract.
1/4 cup lemon juice. ReaLemon 100% juice.
2 tsp vanilla extract. I used really cheap imitation vanilla extract.
1/4 tsp almond extract. Great Value Pure Almond Extract.
I did a fair amount of fiddling around with small samples to get that far. The result isn't exactly what I wanted, but it's drinkable.
The main flaw is that the black cherry flavor is to strong. In the next batch I will mix all of the other ingredients first, then add the black cherry juice a 1/2 cup at a time until it's right.
The second flaw I believe is the molasses. The molasses I used is not fiery at all, and has a very complicated flavor. I thought this would be perfect for the mix, but it turned out to be overly complicated. In the next batch I will use the more fiery, but less complicated Grandma's Orignal molasses.
The third is the rum flavoring. This type of rum flavoring is a "sharp" flavoring. Although I believe rum flavoring to be important to this recipe I think a "soft" rum flavoring would be more approriate. Ironically, that's what you get from very cheap rum flavorings. I have a bottle of Kroger rum flavoring I will try next time.
I will probably continue to use the cheap imitation vanilla extract for the time being. Once some of the other issues are figured out I'll then give real vanilla extract a chance. I'm thinking the difference is liable to get lost in a drink with so many strong flavors in it though.
Prune juice, one taste and my taste buds told me very firmly that prune juice was not in Dr Pepper.
Black strap molasses.... Yeah, no. If you've ever tasted this molasses, you already know why. If you haven't, then please don't.
I was planning on trying another batch with the blueberry juice instead of the black cherry or prune juice, but I ran out time to experiment.
1 quart black cherry juice. Just Black Cherry, R.W. Knudsen Family brand.
2 quarts filtered water. My tap water tastes bad, hence the filtered.
1 cup granulated sugar.
2 tbs molasses. Brer Rabbit; all natural, unsulphured, full flavor.
1/4 tsp rum flavoring. Watkins imitation rum extract.
1/4 cup lemon juice. ReaLemon 100% juice.
2 tsp vanilla extract. I used really cheap imitation vanilla extract.
1/4 tsp almond extract. Great Value Pure Almond Extract.
I did a fair amount of fiddling around with small samples to get that far. The result isn't exactly what I wanted, but it's drinkable.
The main flaw is that the black cherry flavor is to strong. In the next batch I will mix all of the other ingredients first, then add the black cherry juice a 1/2 cup at a time until it's right.
The second flaw I believe is the molasses. The molasses I used is not fiery at all, and has a very complicated flavor. I thought this would be perfect for the mix, but it turned out to be overly complicated. In the next batch I will use the more fiery, but less complicated Grandma's Orignal molasses.
The third is the rum flavoring. This type of rum flavoring is a "sharp" flavoring. Although I believe rum flavoring to be important to this recipe I think a "soft" rum flavoring would be more approriate. Ironically, that's what you get from very cheap rum flavorings. I have a bottle of Kroger rum flavoring I will try next time.
I will probably continue to use the cheap imitation vanilla extract for the time being. Once some of the other issues are figured out I'll then give real vanilla extract a chance. I'm thinking the difference is liable to get lost in a drink with so many strong flavors in it though.
Prune juice, one taste and my taste buds told me very firmly that prune juice was not in Dr Pepper.
Black strap molasses.... Yeah, no. If you've ever tasted this molasses, you already know why. If you haven't, then please don't.
I was planning on trying another batch with the blueberry juice instead of the black cherry or prune juice, but I ran out time to experiment.
I decided to go ahead and ferment this stuff. Extra cherry flavor won't hurt it for that purpose anyway. I don't really feel like drinking it all before running a second version of the soda recipe anyway.
Pitched 4 grams of distillers yeast, 1/2 tsp yeast nutrient, and 1/4 tsp pectin enzyme into 2 quarts of the stuff. It's chilled now, so it will probably be a slow starter. It was 13.5 brix or 1.055 OG. That means it could finish at as much as 10% abv, though I'm expecting more like 6%.
Pitched 4 grams of distillers yeast, 1/2 tsp yeast nutrient, and 1/4 tsp pectin enzyme into 2 quarts of the stuff. It's chilled now, so it will probably be a slow starter. It was 13.5 brix or 1.055 OG. That means it could finish at as much as 10% abv, though I'm expecting more like 6%.
Fermentation went fairly quickly. The gravity is down to 1.004. That would put it at 6.8% abv. I'll give it a few more days just to be sure. Tasting a sample gave me a fairly dry black cherry wine. It has lost almost all of the flavor complexity from the original recipe. Once I refine the recipe a bit, I'll try fermenting the base without any of the flavor additions and more sugar. Then add the flavorings post-fermentation.
jprice
Well-Known Member
Do you think you will back-sweeten it?
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I probably will, I'm not really a fan of red wine. That's pretty much what this tastes like. Since black cherries don't have all the tannin of red wine, the flavor is pretty mild though. It's also fairly one dimensional. All the complexity from the flavor additions went bye bye in primary.
jprice
Well-Known Member
Sounds like a pretty cool idea though, hard Dr. Pepper. I would hit it with some super kleer and then add some wine conditioner to cut the dryness and bring back the flavors.
It sounded interesting to me too. 
I want to see what it does without any clarifiers first. I can do the unflavored gelatin thing if I need to. I've also got baking splenda on hand to back-sweeten, though that gets a little pricey. I'll probably back-sweeten with table sugar, and then bottle pasteurize immediately thereafter.
I did the second batch of the Dr Pepper clone today. It was closer. Reduced the black cherry juice a great deal, and made the other changes to flavoring brands I talked about earlier. Recipe as follows:
1/2 cup black cherry juice. Just Black Cherry, R.W. Knudsen Family brand.
2 quarts filtered water. My tap water tastes bad, hence the filtered.
1 cup granulated sugar.
2 tbs molasses. Grandma's original, unsulphured.
1/4 tsp rum flavoring. Kroger imitation rum extract.
1/4 cup lemon juice. ReaLemon 100% juice.
2 tsp vanilla extract. I used really cheap imitation vanilla extract.
1/4 tsp almond extract. Great Value Pure Almond Extract.
It's still missing something. I'm fairly confident that what it is missing is kola.
The molasses flavor is still to strong, I'll cut the molasses down in the next batch.
I want to see what it does without any clarifiers first. I can do the unflavored gelatin thing if I need to. I've also got baking splenda on hand to back-sweeten, though that gets a little pricey. I'll probably back-sweeten with table sugar, and then bottle pasteurize immediately thereafter.I did the second batch of the Dr Pepper clone today. It was closer. Reduced the black cherry juice a great deal, and made the other changes to flavoring brands I talked about earlier. Recipe as follows:
1/2 cup black cherry juice. Just Black Cherry, R.W. Knudsen Family brand.
2 quarts filtered water. My tap water tastes bad, hence the filtered.
1 cup granulated sugar.
2 tbs molasses. Grandma's original, unsulphured.
1/4 tsp rum flavoring. Kroger imitation rum extract.
1/4 cup lemon juice. ReaLemon 100% juice.
2 tsp vanilla extract. I used really cheap imitation vanilla extract.
1/4 tsp almond extract. Great Value Pure Almond Extract.
It's still missing something. I'm fairly confident that what it is missing is kola.
The molasses flavor is still to strong, I'll cut the molasses down in the next batch.
Your welcome. It's an interesting challenge.
The first batch that went in the fermenter is clearing nicely, though a bit slowly. I just decanted that again, so more of the solids will drop out. The top 2/3 of the bottle were nice and clear.
SWMBO liked the latest mix with no cherry juice in it at all. She thought it tasted a little like cough medicine with the cherry juice.
I just ordered some kola nut powder. I'll make a flavor extract from that and give it a try. I could have just bought kola nut extract, but it's expensive for what you are getting. 1lb of kola nut powder was like 13 bucks. I can make around a gallon of extract from that and some everclear. The liquid extract was 4 bucks, or more, per ounce.
The first batch that went in the fermenter is clearing nicely, though a bit slowly. I just decanted that again, so more of the solids will drop out. The top 2/3 of the bottle were nice and clear.
SWMBO liked the latest mix with no cherry juice in it at all. She thought it tasted a little like cough medicine with the cherry juice.
I just ordered some kola nut powder. I'll make a flavor extract from that and give it a try. I could have just bought kola nut extract, but it's expensive for what you are getting. 1lb of kola nut powder was like 13 bucks. I can make around a gallon of extract from that and some everclear. The liquid extract was 4 bucks, or more, per ounce.
I made the first kola nut flavor extract. Everclear on kola nut powder, let it sit for about a day. It wasn't really what I was looking for. The flavor was to spicy. The closest thing I can compare it to would be real cinnamon. A reasonable spiciness, and lots of earthy flavor. Raw kola nut powder also has a dry aftertaste.
With some spices, you can take the edge off of them by cooking them. Ginger being a prime example. So I cooked some kola nut powder in a pan in water. There must be starch in the kola nut powder, as it turned into kola nut gravy. I ended up having to add more water so it didn't completely gel. That did take the spiciness out. Almost completely removed it from the flavor. Still earthy and dry.
Mixed some of that with the liquid from the last attempted batch. The taste was closer, but still not nearly enough of a bite to it. I'm thinking the acid in the mix needs to go way up. Two, maybe three times as much lemon juice. The other problem was that the kola nut gravy left a lot of particulate in the glass. I don't really want that in my drink. So, I'm letting the gravy sit in a glass bottle with an equal volume of everclear.
I probably will not do another experimental batch until next week. I don't think the alcohol will have had enough time to do a good flavor extraction on the cooked kola nut by tomorrow.
With some spices, you can take the edge off of them by cooking them. Ginger being a prime example. So I cooked some kola nut powder in a pan in water. There must be starch in the kola nut powder, as it turned into kola nut gravy. I ended up having to add more water so it didn't completely gel. That did take the spiciness out. Almost completely removed it from the flavor. Still earthy and dry.
Mixed some of that with the liquid from the last attempted batch. The taste was closer, but still not nearly enough of a bite to it. I'm thinking the acid in the mix needs to go way up. Two, maybe three times as much lemon juice. The other problem was that the kola nut gravy left a lot of particulate in the glass. I don't really want that in my drink. So, I'm letting the gravy sit in a glass bottle with an equal volume of everclear.
I probably will not do another experimental batch until next week. I don't think the alcohol will have had enough time to do a good flavor extraction on the cooked kola nut by tomorrow.
IXIboneheadIXI
Well-Known Member
I'm sorry everybody. My recipe just isn't a match. It tastes fairly good, but it's just not Dr. Pepper. It does remind me of Dr. Pepper, but that's about it. At this point, I'm at something of a loss. I'm still missing something from the recipe that I can't seem to nail down. The kola nut extract is similar, but not exactly right. Here's what will be the final version of the recipe for a while.
1/2 cup black cherry juice. Just Black Cherry, R.W. Knudsen Family brand.
2 quarts filtered water. My tap water tastes bad, hence the filtered.
1 cup granulated sugar.
2 tsp molasses. Grandma's original, unsulphured.
1/4 tsp rum flavoring. Kroger imitation rum extract.
1/2 cup lemon juice. ReaLemon 100% juice.
2 tsp vanilla extract. I used really cheap imitation vanilla extract.
1/4 tsp almond extract. Great Value Pure Almond Extract.
3 tbs cooked kola nut extract See above. Probably won't need as much as the extract ages.
1/2 cup black cherry juice. Just Black Cherry, R.W. Knudsen Family brand.
2 quarts filtered water. My tap water tastes bad, hence the filtered.
1 cup granulated sugar.
2 tsp molasses. Grandma's original, unsulphured.
1/4 tsp rum flavoring. Kroger imitation rum extract.
1/2 cup lemon juice. ReaLemon 100% juice.
2 tsp vanilla extract. I used really cheap imitation vanilla extract.
1/4 tsp almond extract. Great Value Pure Almond Extract.
3 tbs cooked kola nut extract See above. Probably won't need as much as the extract ages.
I tried a bit of sassafras tea concentrate in a glass with some tonic water and black cherry juice. I believe that is one of the missing ingredients. Or rather, I believe sassafras extract was in the recipe for some time and replaced with a synthetic flavoring when safrole oil was shown to cause cancer. Sassafras tea concentrates free of safrole have only been back on the market since 1994. It's still incomplete, even with the sassafras tea concentrate though. There is something in it that is altering the mouthfeel that I can't seem to pin down.
MrFoodScientist
Well-Known Member
Have you tried using gentian root? It's the flavoring component of angustora bitters and fits nicely in a cola recipe to get closer to a pepsi profile rather than a coke profile. It's also the flavoring component in Moxie.
Gentian is in the D Peppers Pepsin Bitters formula that surfaced a few years ago, and it seems like I had read somewhere else that it was an ingredient in Dr. Pepper.
A little goes a long way, so be careful with it. It's the most bitter thing I've ever tasted. I think it kind of replaces some of the phosphoric acid flavor that you're likely missing from the commercial version, though it's not really the same flavor as phosphoric.
Gentian is in the D Peppers Pepsin Bitters formula that surfaced a few years ago, and it seems like I had read somewhere else that it was an ingredient in Dr. Pepper.
A little goes a long way, so be careful with it. It's the most bitter thing I've ever tasted. I think it kind of replaces some of the phosphoric acid flavor that you're likely missing from the commercial version, though it's not really the same flavor as phosphoric.
I have not. That sounds like a another ingredient of interest though.
There is an astringency to Dr. Pepper I haven't been able to match. I've actually been kicking around with the idea of trying some wine tannin too.
I should probably mention that I've now got a functional keezer, and a carbonator cap. So future recipe versions will be tested with full carbonation. That will at least remove the carbonic acid flavor variant.
I've got wine tannin shipping, but I haven't found a gentian root supplier I'm really happy with yet.
I've got wine tannin shipping, but I haven't found a gentian root supplier I'm really happy with yet.
the_ginger_ninja
Member
For a 'quick and dirty' version of Dr. Pepper take some lager, and roughly the same amount of Coke, put in a large glass. Then take a shot of Amaretto (in the UK it's a brand called Dissarono) and drop it in as a depth-charge.
Freakishly similar.
FWIW almonds are typically used to mimic cherry flavour in the drinks world.
Freakishly similar.
FWIW almonds are typically used to mimic cherry flavour in the drinks world.
Here's the latest version of the recipe. I would say it's moving in the right direction.
1/2 cup black cherry juice. Just Black Cherry, R.W. Knudsen Family brand.
scant 2 quarts filtered water.
1 cup granulated sugar.
1 tsp molasses. Grandma's original, unsulphured.
1 tsp rum flavoring. Watkins
1/2 cup lemon juice. ReaLemon 100% juice.
2 tsp vanilla extract.
1 tsp wine tannin.
The wine tannin does add to the missing astringency nicely. The fresh mix is not as astringent as I would like, but I'm thinking the tannin is likely to extract into the liquid more as it sits, so I'm reserving judgement. The cherry flavor index is a little to high. To much "stone fruit" flavor. The almond flavoring was a straight up flavor miss, so I dropped it this time. The kola nut seemed like it would be right, but it wasn't. It's flavor profile was to spicy. Rum flavor is a bit over the top.
It's hard to judge the acid profile at this point, it tastes completely off right now. However, I think most of the acid profile is actually from the carbonic acid from the carbonation. I won't be able to tell how close things are until the mix has chilled and I can carbonate it. That won't be until tomorrow.
I'm actually fairly pleased with how this latest batch is going. It's still not right, but it's much closer then any of the other attempts.
1/2 cup black cherry juice. Just Black Cherry, R.W. Knudsen Family brand.
scant 2 quarts filtered water.
1 cup granulated sugar.
1 tsp molasses. Grandma's original, unsulphured.
1 tsp rum flavoring. Watkins
1/2 cup lemon juice. ReaLemon 100% juice.
2 tsp vanilla extract.
1 tsp wine tannin.
The wine tannin does add to the missing astringency nicely. The fresh mix is not as astringent as I would like, but I'm thinking the tannin is likely to extract into the liquid more as it sits, so I'm reserving judgement. The cherry flavor index is a little to high. To much "stone fruit" flavor. The almond flavoring was a straight up flavor miss, so I dropped it this time. The kola nut seemed like it would be right, but it wasn't. It's flavor profile was to spicy. Rum flavor is a bit over the top.
It's hard to judge the acid profile at this point, it tastes completely off right now. However, I think most of the acid profile is actually from the carbonic acid from the carbonation. I won't be able to tell how close things are until the mix has chilled and I can carbonate it. That won't be until tomorrow.
I'm actually fairly pleased with how this latest batch is going. It's still not right, but it's much closer then any of the other attempts.
hunter_le five
Sheriff Underscore
Subscribed. Keep up the good work.
CYBERpsycotic
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Hi,
I just got a Soda Stream machine and bought the Dr Pete mix. I am a Dr Pepper guy and that mix to me is horrible. Its entirely too sweet. I started searching around hoping to find a good recipe for DP but its seems like everyone is having a difficult time replicating it. A lot I've come across seem to have some luck with Amaretto, Almond and Ginger in addition to the last several posted recipes. I have no experience at all in this area but I may try my hand at it soon. I'm sure the sweetener is a big deal...sugar, high fructose corn syrup...so on. Cherry has to be a must because the 'Cherry' versions of DP taste roughly the same but stronger cherry flavor obviously.
I hope someone is able to clone it.
all I know about DP is there are "23 flavors" in it . . .
1. Amaretto
2. Almond
3. Blackberry
4. Black Licorice
5. Carrot
6. Clove
7. Cherry
8. Caramel
9. Cola
10. Ginger
11. Juniper
12. Lemon
13. Molasses
14. Nutmeg
15. Orange
16. Prune
17. Plum
18. Pepper
19. Root Beer
20. Rum
21. Raspberry
22. Tomato
23. Vanilla
With that I know the root beer I am working on has 20+ ingredients besides water, CO2 and sugar . . . and thats only 1 "flavor of DP so good luck . . .
I just got a Soda Stream machine and bought the Dr Pete mix. I am a Dr Pepper guy and that mix to me is horrible. Its entirely too sweet. I started searching around hoping to find a good recipe for DP but its seems like everyone is having a difficult time replicating it. A lot I've come across seem to have some luck with Amaretto, Almond and Ginger in addition to the last several posted recipes. I have no experience at all in this area but I may try my hand at it soon. I'm sure the sweetener is a big deal...sugar, high fructose corn syrup...so on. Cherry has to be a must because the 'Cherry' versions of DP taste roughly the same but stronger cherry flavor obviously.
I hope someone is able to clone it.
all I know about DP is there are "23 flavors" in it . . .
1. Amaretto
2. Almond
3. Blackberry
4. Black Licorice
5. Carrot
6. Clove
7. Cherry
8. Caramel
9. Cola
10. Ginger
11. Juniper
12. Lemon
13. Molasses
14. Nutmeg
15. Orange
16. Prune
17. Plum
18. Pepper
19. Root Beer
20. Rum
21. Raspberry
22. Tomato
23. Vanilla
With that I know the root beer I am working on has 20+ ingredients besides water, CO2 and sugar . . . and thats only 1 "flavor of DP so good luck . . .
I think that sounds way too complex. Maybe once dr pepper was fancy and subtle, but probably not now. I remember long ago they used to sell a 20 sided can of it at the Johnson ranch not too far from the dr pepper museum in TX that tasted special.
Anyway, in some thread here I reported getting a close match by accident... sort of hit just between dr pepper and cherry dr pepper with only 2 ingredients! I used black cherry concentrate and agave syrup... period! I may try adding some artificial nut flavors I happen to have on hand, including ameretto. This is with sodastream.
These were very particular ingredients. The agave was xagave, which uniquely is a blend of the very different blue and white agave. Agave is getting insanely expensive due to the popularity of making premium tequila from it, but I get the huge container from a club store and use very little. It packs a tremendous punch of sweetness, more than almost any other substance, so you don't need much (and it is healthy with a very low glycemic index). Complex mapley flavors.
The black cherry was definitely not anything like a flavor syrup... it is the medicinal health variety of simple boiled down black cherries with no sugar. Tart, and not delicious by itself... I think it is marketed mostly at gout patients and you can get reasonable mailorder deals. In combo these two have pretty much all the taste complexity of modern dr pepper in a more wholesome package.
That same xagave makes fantastic root beer with the humble supercheap-by-the-dozen zaterains root beer extract. You have got to exactly balance the sweetness... basically minimize it to only barely counter the bite of the roots. You can make it rich or lean... I just made a super lean batch that just can't be beat for refreshing taste. Very healthy, but the xagave price is getting almost too much to bear.
Anyway, in some thread here I reported getting a close match by accident... sort of hit just between dr pepper and cherry dr pepper with only 2 ingredients! I used black cherry concentrate and agave syrup... period! I may try adding some artificial nut flavors I happen to have on hand, including ameretto. This is with sodastream.
These were very particular ingredients. The agave was xagave, which uniquely is a blend of the very different blue and white agave. Agave is getting insanely expensive due to the popularity of making premium tequila from it, but I get the huge container from a club store and use very little. It packs a tremendous punch of sweetness, more than almost any other substance, so you don't need much (and it is healthy with a very low glycemic index). Complex mapley flavors.
The black cherry was definitely not anything like a flavor syrup... it is the medicinal health variety of simple boiled down black cherries with no sugar. Tart, and not delicious by itself... I think it is marketed mostly at gout patients and you can get reasonable mailorder deals. In combo these two have pretty much all the taste complexity of modern dr pepper in a more wholesome package.
That same xagave makes fantastic root beer with the humble supercheap-by-the-dozen zaterains root beer extract. You have got to exactly balance the sweetness... basically minimize it to only barely counter the bite of the roots. You can make it rich or lean... I just made a super lean batch that just can't be beat for refreshing taste. Very healthy, but the xagave price is getting almost too much to bear.
stpug
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Try some Brett Naardenensis to get some of that fruity tartness - it was isolated from Dr. Pepper to begin with. Perhaps a small side batch (1 gallon) added back to syrup mix, and then stabilized to keep further fermentation from occurring. IDK, an idea anyway.
That's interesting. It hadn't occured to me to change the sugar base out from just sucrose. It might be worth some time trying honey, or some alternate sugars.
My wife and I have been to Dr. Pepper in Dublin, when it was there, and Waco, Tx. They were adamant that there are no prunes, prune juice or prune flavor in DP. They know it's a popular belief, but said, nope, that ain't what gives it the flavor.
Believe it or not, Ripley
Believe it or not, Ripley
I believe it. There is some flavor that makes me think there is a stone fruit juice in it though. I would say black cherry juice is the most likely, based on the overall flavor profile.My wife and I have been to Dr. Pepper in Dublin, when it was there, and Waco, Tx. They were adamant that there are no prunes, prune juice or prune flavor in DP. They know it's a popular belief, but said, nope, that ain't what gives it the flavor.
Believe it or not, Ripley
Here is the latest version of the recipe.
1/2 tsp of gentian root boiled in 2 cups of water for 15 minutes.
1 cup granulated sugar
1 tsp molasses, grandma's original unsulphured
2 tsp Mexican vanilla extract
1/2 tsp rum flavoring, watkins
1/4 cup just black cherry juice, R.W. Knudsen family
The result is a little on the weak side. It also still needs an astringent addition. The next version I think I'll add a tsp of powdered tannin to the gentian when it's boiling. Like I said, it still needs an acid, but not citric or common lemon or lime juice. Those have other flavors that don't really work in the recipe.
1/2 tsp of gentian root boiled in 2 cups of water for 15 minutes.
1 cup granulated sugar
1 tsp molasses, grandma's original unsulphured
2 tsp Mexican vanilla extract
1/2 tsp rum flavoring, watkins
1/4 cup just black cherry juice, R.W. Knudsen family
The result is a little on the weak side. It also still needs an astringent addition. The next version I think I'll add a tsp of powdered tannin to the gentian when it's boiling. Like I said, it still needs an acid, but not citric or common lemon or lime juice. Those have other flavors that don't really work in the recipe.
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