Cream Ale Cream of Three Crops (Cream Ale)

[CDGoin]

OK.. using this "inexpensive recipe"..

How would it be without any hops

Want to try my first BIAB brew (Wife out of town) but LHBS closed till friday (Wife gets home)

I am a malt guy anyway and don't care for hops anyway.. so.. figured just as an experiment.

I will brew this up and put it in the fermentor with the left over trub from my oktoberfest I just racked. That should get me the yeast I need.

I guess no harm no foul and won't cost a whole heck of a lot to do..

Just curious if it would taste like crap.. or be at least possibly drinkable.

 

[PapaFoxtrot]

How would it be without any hops (Call me cheap)

I'm thinking that it wouldn't taste like much at all. This is a very light brew; the bittering hops is about all you taste. On a lark, I brewed a batch with Cascade once and the citrus note in the Cascade almost overwhelmed the beer. I stick with Centenial now; spreading one ounce over three additions.

 

[CDGoin]

Hmm.. wonder if I added 2lbs of honey to it for ABV and some body if that would work..? In lieu of hops.

I looked all over and havent found any mention of unhopped beer. I know back before hops, they made beer.. so.. Hmm..

 

[Channel66]

I wouldn't brew it without hops but it's your call I guess..

 

[CDGoin]

I wouldn't brew it without hops but it's your call I guess..

I am figuring it will have a sweeter and earthy tone without the hops.

Also if I use the honey.. it may act as the anti-septic, doing at least that portion of the hops job.

I am thinking that this would basically be a Braggot Mead when its all said and done.

So I posted the recipe and will update that thread as I go.

 

[Channel66]

I am figuring it will have a sweeter and earthy tone without the hops.. and as you pointed out for a second or two.. the Beer did spoil.. but it was also always at room temp too.. So theres' that.

Also if I use the honey.. it may act as the anti-septic.

That said.. I am thinking that it would basically be a Braggot Mead when its all said and done.

Your call, hops also help keep infections out.

Earth tones usually come from hops not the grains.

Look into gruit

 

[thadius856]

Hmm.. wonder if I added 2lbs of honey to it for ABV and some body if that would work..? In lieu of hops.

I looked all over and havent found any mention of unhopped beer. I know back before hops, they made beer.. so.. Hmm..

Before hops, they used gruit.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gruit

2# of honey to save money on a dirt cheap recipe? No hops? WTF?

If you want it to be cheap, don't use honey. Add table sugar. However, there's nowhere for the alcohol burn to hide in this recipe, so I expect that it's going to have a hot alcohol aftertaste.

Substitute flaked maize for instant grits and use minute rice if you want to save money on the recipe. Or look check out his Centennial Blonde, which can be made for about the same price.

No hops? Sounds really gross. It only calls for 1 oz of 5% AA noble hops in 11 gallons... that's literally 60 cents worth of hops if you buy by the pound. Pick something with even lower AA if want or add later in the boil for less bitterness, but as-is, there's hardly any hop flavor (or any other flavor) at all to begin with. Even for a cream ale, this one falls at the very bottom end of the style guidelines in bitterness.

For comparison, my favorite IPA so far uses 13.5 ounces of hops in a batch this size. Even more if your AA's are lacking on your bittering hops due to aging.

If you want to avoid hop flavor altogether, I might recommend heading in the cider direction, perhaps a batch of O'Graff?

 

[thadius856]

Earth tones usually come from hops not the grains.

This is my opinion as well. The closest I can find to "earthy" in grains would be Chocolate malt, but that's more in the "ashy" and "acrid" realm, really.

Have you looked into Rausch malt? Not earthy, but certainly satisfying in a similar way.

 

[CDGoin]

Being cheap isn't the main the real reason to do this sans' hops. The reasons are simply.

LBHS is closed till Friday.. SWMBO is away till Friday

SWMBO already hates when I take over the kitchen.. so I have a few days I can do that without listening to her.

First All-grain, so doing it more to see what the result is than anything else and I have a 12lb bag of 2 row malt sitting at my house that was gift, a yeast starter ready to go from my last batch of octoberfest, and I can corn flakes and minute rice and honey at the store. It makes for a easy first attempt. With not a lot invested.

As for WHY about the Honey.. See my signature I simply like honey in my beers, adds an authentic sweetness and aroma that I don't get from malt, it also bumps the ABV without bringing on the alcoholic heat. Everyone that has tried my MarZzzzens have liked them. Told me they almost have a Belgian Quad character, but smoother.

Lastly for earth tones.. when ever I have done the partial mash in my octoberfests before I added hops.. I taste it to make sure it has the subtle character I like.. and it usually has a grainy earthy tone to it.. Maybe the grains in the kit..

Overall just experimenting.. and curious what will happen.

As mentioned, looking around, what it looks like is I will be making a lagered braggot mead when its all said and done. Could be good, or taste like sugar water.. or dirty sugar water. I know no matter what it will never be the worst thing I made.. that will always be my first batch ever, it was really really bad.

 

[stratslinger]

OK.. using this "inexpensive reciepe"..

How would it be without any hops (Call me cheap)

I am a malt guy anyway and don't care for hops. Want to try my first BIAB brew (Wife out of town) but LHBS closed till friday (Wife gets home)

It'd be sweet, unbalanced, and probably darned near undrinkable.

You're talking about 2oz of low AA hops in 11 gallons. Substitute that with something like .8oz Colombus, and you're in the same IBU range for $3 and you'll still have a well balanced finished product and not a nasty, overly sweet beverage that's likely to spoil very quickly. (And that's far less expensive than the honey you're talking about adding, so I think this fits in with your "cheap" requirement.)

Your choice, though.

 

[Battles4Seattle]

Even Braggots are hopped... Sounds like a drain pour.

 

[Lazarous]

Saw a basic brewing episode where they made an unhoped beer. They basically said it was sour/ rancid tasting and only got through one sip I believe. If you're set on a hopless beer I would try using some kind of hop alternative like juniper or similar

 

[CDGoin]

Even Braggots are hopped... Sounds like a drain pour.

Actually looking into Gruit and Braggots.. found MANY are not hopped.

Ingredients: A braggot is a standard mead made with both honey and malt providing flavor and fermentable extract. Originally, and alternatively, a mixture of mead and ale. A braggot can be made with any type of honey, and any type of base beer style. The malt component may be derived from grain or malt extracts. The beer may be hopped or not. If any other ingredients than honey and beer are contained in the braggot, it should be entered as an Open Category Mead. Smoked braggots may be entered in this category if using smoked malt or a smoked beer as the base style; braggots made using other smoked ingredients (e.g., liquid smoke, chipotles) should be entered in the Open Category Mead style.

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/wiki/idnex.php/Braggot

So to assume something is a drain pour because its not made in a way you deem acceptable is a little ostentatious.

Sometimes they use spices and juniper berries. Which I maybe able to get at fresh market and add to taste. As I mentioned.. I am only going hoppless due to time and ability to find hops before Friday.

 

[Channel66]

Actually looking into Gruit and Braggots.. found MANY are not hopped.

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/wiki/idnex.php/Braggot

So to assume something is a drain pour because its not made in a way you deem acceptable is a little ostentatious.

Sometimes they use spices and juniper berries. Which I maybe able to get at fresh market and add to taste..

Juniper makes a great addition. Ever heard of sahti?

 

[Battles4Seattle]

So to assume something is a drain pour because its not made in a way you deem acceptable is a little ostentatious.

Sometimes they use spices and juniper berries. Which I maybe able to get at fresh market and add to taste. As I mentioned.. I am only going hoppless due to time and ability to find hops before Friday.

No assume it will be drain pour because he intends not to use anything to provide bitterness with a cream ale grain bill.

 

[stratslinger]

So to assume something is a drain pour because its not made in a way you deem acceptable is a little ostentatious.

To ask advice, then insult people when they give you exactly that advice, is something worse than ostentatious. Cut it out.

 

[thadius856]

Actually looking into Gruit and Braggots.. found MANY are not hopped.



https://www.homebrewtalk.com/wiki/idnex.php/Braggot

So to assume something is a drain pour because its not made in a way you deem acceptable is a little ostentatious.

Sometimes they use spices and juniper berries. Which I maybe able to get at fresh market and add to taste. As I mentioned.. I am only going hoppless due to time and ability to find hops before Friday.

Clearly you already know the answers to all your questions.

Why are you wasting your time asking them and then wasting your time again reading the responses you get?

 

[shadyj]

I've noticed that the wort can have a bit of red tint to it out of the kettle, but that it turns a golden color pretty quick in the fermenter.

That's exactly what I'm seeing! I'm actually fermenting in a glass carboy. A 5 gallon batch. It's always more fun that way watching the yeast go crazy in there. My yeast its a lot more globular than I'm used to seeing though. I used a starter and some yeast nutrients and a whirfloc tablet so it is almost see through already although very amber. Thanks for the help.

 

[CDGoin]

My apologizes for coming off rude. Wasn't meant that way..

Thanks to some constructive replies.. I found out about Gruit (A term I didnt know) and I looked it up from there, I found out about the braggots like sahti. I was able to go to a organic grocery store and secure some juniper berries.. which I will add to this in place of the hops I can not get right now.

As for knowing before I asked.. I was asking questions as I was researching.. trying to see if anyone had real world experience to go with the "Book knowledge" I was getting.

In any case, because of Channel66, Thadius856 I learned a lot and I appreciate the help. Looks like I am making a cream ale version of a sahti now

 

[pellis007]

I just picked up the ingredients to brew cream of three crops this weekend. I've brewed BierMuncher's Red Hook Clone and loved it so I'm looking forward to brewing this batch.

 

[kapbrew13]

I just picked up the ingredients to brew cream of three crops this weekend. I've brewed BierMuncher's Red Hook Clone and loved it so I'm looking forward to brewing this batch.

You won't be disappointed. Very clean smooth brew.

 

[PapaFoxtrot]

That's exactly what I'm seeing! I'm actually fermenting in a glass carboy. A 5 gallon batch. It's always more fun that way watching the yeast go crazy in there. My yeast its a lot more globular than I'm used to seeing though. I used a starter and some yeast nutrients and a whirfloc tablet so it is almost see through already although very amber. Thanks for the help.

Glad I could help! I usually just pitch a packet of S05 dry(sprinkle it in thru the carboy opening and swirl. Takes a day or two to get cranked up, but on day three I'll have well over an inch of krausen. Comes out just fine; although I'm sure there's something wrong with that technique!

Here's one more pic of my last batch after 10 days in the bottle. So clear!

 

[orion7144]

I am going to post this in two posts. half way through my pour in my bubba keg (52 oz) I ran out of centennial and finished up the rest by topping off with this and WOW. Half and half of this with Centennial is pretty darn good. My favorite between the two is centennial but the combo is a close 2nd.

 

[Channel66]

My apologizes for coming off rude. Wasn't meant that way..

Thanks to some constructive replies.. I found out about Gruit (A term I didnt know) and I looked it up from there, I found out about the braggots like sahti. I was able to go to a organic grocery store and secure some juniper berries.. which I will add to this in place of the hops I can not get right now.

As for knowing before I asked.. I was asking questions as I was researching.. trying to see if anyone had real world experience to go with the "Book knowledge" I was getting.

In any case, because of Channel66, Thadius856 I learned a lot and I appreciate the help. Looks like I am making a cream ale version of a sahti now

Let me know how it turns out. I'm curiously hopeful for you.

 

[CDGoin]

Let me know how it turns out. I'm curiously hopeful for you.

Actually funny thing is after all this.. while digging for my hydrometer.. I found a 1oz sachet of willamette hops from an octoberfest I did a while back

Since I KNOW my taste buds liked just the one OZ of Willamette in my last octoberfest (Kit comes with 2). I used it instead of the juniper berries (Will save Juniper berries for doing this receipe as a 1-3 gallon test batch)

Anyway came out really nice.. I was impressed with my efficiency doing it BIAB. I was at 1.024 at 160 degrees. Which came out to a bit over 1.048 with the heat adjustment. Once I added the 2lbs of honey, it finished out to 1.064.

The raw wort came out smooth, and the touch of hops did make a difference. I could kind of tell how it would have had a sickly sweet straw taste without the hops.

As it settled out in the fermentor it turned a nice honey shade, and got really clear real fast. That was until this morning.. when there was a tempest in the fermenter.. and its back to cloudy again.. but a good cloudy. The vent was working overtime only 8 hours after it went into my ferment room. This was at 50 degrees or so.

I'm really curious how this comes out.. I am thinking it will taste much like a softer bodied, less hoppy and slightly sweeter / dry version of a Pils. It should also be close to 8% when I am done. Current calcs have me at about 6.5% if I don't add honey to the secondary. If I add honey in the secondary, then it could go up about 1.5%. Depending on what the sample tastes like out of the primary. I may just stick with that.

Be curious to see if I can get a "Light" beer with a higher ABV that isn't dry as a bone.. I know from seeing how well it settled out before the yeast got all hot and bothered it will be a REALLY clear beer (or braggot or.. you get the idea)

Thanks again for the help.

 

[Varmintman]

Of the two beers that I could not finish of all the beers I tried one of them had juniper in it. I know lots of folks like the flavor but I just do not like it at all in beer or even gin.

Great thing about this recipe is you can change it up to suit what you enjoy.

 

[Channel66]

Actually funny thing is after all this.. while digging for my hydrometer.. I found a 1oz sachet of willamette hops from an octoberfest I did a while back
8% when I am done....
.
.
.
Thanks again for the help.

I used 1 oz of willamette with this recipe as well. Turned out fantastic

 

[histo320]

Would it be okay to use Wyeast American Ale yeast for this recipe? It is all I have and the LHBS is lacking in their yeast selection.

 

[Channel66]

Would it be okay to use Wyeast American Ale yeast for this recipe? It is all I have and the LHBS is lacking in their yeast selection.

I would say that would be perfect

 

[Thunder_Chicken]

OK.. using this "inexpensive recipe"..

How would it be without any hops

Want to try my first BIAB brew (Wife out of town) but LHBS closed till friday (Wife gets home)

Just tossing this out there - maybe start the brew now without hops, then get some hops on Friday, boil them in plain water and pitch them in secondary?

I think it would be easier to just brew the whole damned thing on Friday. Make the kitchen an absolute mess, and make sure you've had enough homebrew to make your speech slurred when your wife arrives home. One way or another, you'll get the freedom to brew when you want to.