Cold strike, ramping mash

[MazdaMatt]

What would be the effects of doughing into cold water and gradually raising the temp (assuming constant stirring, ensuring no hot spots or scorching, blah blah).

Lets say it takes 30 minutes to evenly heat the mash up to 150, then i leave it for 60 minutes.

Alternatively, what if it takes 30 minutes to ramp up to 158 and I leae it for 60 minutes?

 

[MazdaMatt]

41 views, no reply... nobody's ever thought of heating the water with the grain in it already?

 

[Jakemo]

I think that starting cold and heating the whole mash up to temp will result in an extremely thin beer.
Different processes happen at different temperatures.

Rather than type out 5 sections of "How to Brew," I'll simply point you to the appropriate section to start reading at, and let you extract the information accordingly.

www.howtobrew.com/section3/chapter14-3.html

Basically you're going to go through all of the steps that traditionally lead to a more fermentable malt, before you even get to your goal mash temp. If you want your beer to finish with any semblance of body, I say don't do it. If you just want to see what happens for the sake of experimentation, go for it. Be sure to report back and let us know.

 

[motobrewer]

i don't think it'd make a overly thin beer. 30 minutes from 65F to 150F isn't a lot of time at activity temp to cause this.

i think noonan even advocates doughing-in cold. i don't remember his exact temps and rise time, i can look up when i get home. best part of this is that its below gelatinization temp so you can really mix good without concern of dough balls.

 

[squirrelly]

I usually dough in about 10* lower than my intended mash temp, and come out hitting my numbers each time. With my RIMS system it is easier to bring the mash water up in temp than try to lower it. I would be more concerned that adding too much cool water to supplement for a high temp would result in a thin beer and throw your pre-boil off making it necessary to add DME to the boil.

I have a false bottom in my mash tun with three burners on the system under each vessel. I bring my strike water in the mash tun up to about 160*, and dough in at 150.* The water in the hot liquor tank is set with the digital controller at 185* and the mash temp is set at 152*. The pump will automatically kick on to recalculate the mash until it is as 152* until it's time to set the controller at mash out temp.

I have read and heard a lot of negative thoughts about applying flame directly under the mash tun when the grains have been introduced due to possible scotching of the mash.

[email protected]. on tap: easy virtue blonde, fruity monk belgian wit. primary: American pale ale, American stout, blow your top steam, and heffewitzen

 

[BiscayneBrewing]

I asked almost the same question in the all grain section a few weeks back but never really got a definative answer.

I have a 42 quart polarware SS brew pot that I use as my MLT. I have direct heat (propane) going to the bottom. Because of the false bottom and regular stirring I have never had a problem with scorching.

I've always heated the water close to my mash temp and added the grain however I wondered if there was any pro/con to adding it when cold and then ramping up the temp.

I'm interested to see any replies.

 

[motobrewer]

i guess I would ask, what are you trying to fix? or gain?

single infusion is pretty darn easy, and effective...

 

[MazdaMatt]

Thanks for the thoughts!

I am aware of the various stages of "rests" that are often use to make things more fermentable.
Also aware of the risk of scorching, but with enough stirring things should be safe.
Not trying to "fix" anything, just gain some knowledge, i suppose... but I was actually hoping for the answer of really thin beer - in theory it seemed to me like it could be a good tool for the light american lager, etc. Something to serve the people that don't want my delicious honey caramel ale or strong pumpkin pie porter.

Again, thanks. I may give this a shot some time... maybe with a smaller stove-top batch so it doesn't take too long to heat up while applying little enough heat to ensure no scorching.

 

[squirrelly]

If you want to get that really clear lager or pils look down, I would recommend just an appropriate amount of pilsner malt, cold fermentation, cold crashing the beer, and keeping your water:grain ratio correct.

What you are describing is similar to doing a decoction mash which is used in things like Oktoberfest and dopplebocks to darken them and bring out that Carmel flavor.

Personally once I've started my protein or scarification rest, I don't touch my mash until mash out. At mash out I will bring the temp up to 168, and give the grist a good stir, but then let it rest for another 15 minutes. I do this to avoid disturbing my grain bed, and avoid channeling during the sparge.