Carbonation Drops - David Logsdon loves them

[Grinder12000]

I was listening to a podcast on Basic Brewing with David Logsdon the CEO of Wyeast.

They were talking about his view of what the most common problem he sees in homebrewing and his view was oxidation.

Putting a priming sugar solution into a bottle bucket had many bad things going for it. Many times the solution will drop to the bottom of the bucket. OR a brewer will stir so much oxidation will start to occur.

THUS - he is a huge fan of Carbonation drops. Just put one in each bottle and stop worrying.

Comments???

The one thing I would think is don't you want to have control on different amounts of sugar?

 

[HOOTER]

I'd like to know how many people here have had issues with oxidation and/or terribly inconsistent carbonation due to mixing priming sugar into the entire batch. I personally haven't had a problem with this and I'd be willing to bet most homebrewers don't, which is why I don't use those carbonation drops.

 

[Brett0424]

Yeah if you're siphoning into a bottling bucket anyways, then putting sugar on the bottom won't change the amount of oxidation. And in my experience, siphoning onto sugar stirs it up just fine.

 

[Grinder12000]

He did not say there were problems - just that your beer tasted better by lessening the amount of time your beer was next to O2. It was one of the major things a normal homebrewer did not recognize.

Just repeating what he said.

October 2005

 

[ArcaneXor]

Yeah if you're siphoning into a bottling bucket anyways, then putting sugar on the bottom won't change the amount of oxidation. And in my experience, siphoning onto sugar stirs it up just fine.

You wouldn't use a bottling bucket - you'd bottle straight from the carboy, hence the reduced exposure to O2. I usually do that with my small batches and it works quite well.

 

[Brett0424]

You wouldn't use a bottling bucket - you'd bottle straight from the carboy, hence the reduced exposure to O2. I usually do that with my small batches and it works quite well.

Many people use bottling buckets and this was just a response to the original post, addressing what he said. Yes, if you wanted to completely limit the amount of 02 your beer is exposed to you wouldn't use a bottling bucket. The fact is, small amounts of oxidation are not big problems for homebrewers who often drink their beer pretty damn fresh anyways. And, most homebrewers use bottling buckets...what was your point anyways?? I'm not even sure what that comment has to do with what I said?

 

[HOOTER]

He did not say there were problems

"They were talking about his view of what the most common problems he sees in homebrewing and his view was oxidation.

Putting a priming sugar solution into a bottle bucket had many bad things going for it. Many times the solution will drop to the bottom of the bucket. OR a brewer will stir so much oxidation will start to occur."

I beg to differ. This sounds like problems to me, and I just don't see it. The standard, old school method of adding priming sugar works great and there is no reason to change, in my opinion.

 

[blacklab]

I never had a problem with using the traditional priming sugar/bottling bucket method, but am lazy and switched to carb tabs. Both work fine.

 

[menschmaschine]

I never tried the Carb Drops, but I have tried the Carb Tabs and have learned to only use them out of necessity or extreme convenience. As mentioned in other threads, the tabs don't dissolve all the way, leaving white bits floating in the beer and not carbing it as much as intended. Maybe the drops don't do this, but they don't have the 'fine tuning' that the tabs have for carbonation level, so I wouldn't use them just for that reason.

I've never had a problem with oxidation that I've ever noticed. If it were a big concern, I would invest in a pipette and inject an exact volume of sugar solution into each bottle before I used the tabs or drops.

 

[cubbies]

The only time I had any noticeable problem with oxidation in regards to bottling is when I added my priming sugar after my beer. I did this when trying to be precise as possible. By adding the beer first I figured I could know exactly how much beer I had and then adjust my priming sugar accordingly. However, using this method I had to thoroughly stir the beer, and I noticed a bit of oxidation in the finished product.

Now I just assume 5 gallons. It is never far off anyways. maybe 4.75 or 5.25, but not enough to drastically change carbonation levels IMO.

 

[bradsul]

I've never had a problem with the bottling bucket/priming solution method either and some of my beers have been over a year in the bottle with no oxidation at all. The carbonation is always nice and even across the whole batch too.

If anyone is that worried about oxygen exposure they should get a CO2 bottle so they can purge the bottling bucket and bottles before filling.

 

[Revvy]

"They were talking about his view of what the most common problems he sees in homebrewing and his view was oxidation.

Putting a priming sugar solution into a bottle bucket had many bad things going for it. Many times the solution will drop to the bottom of the bucket. OR a brewer will stir so much oxidation will start to occur."

I beg to differ. This sounds like problems to me, and I just don't see it. The standard, old school method of adding priming sugar works great and there is no reason to change, in my opinion.

I agree...I've never had any problems, I never stir, I let the natural flow of the beer coming out of the auto siphon mix the priming solution in...One thing I do though, is only add half of the solution to the bottom of the bucket, then when the beer is around the 2 gallon mark, begin adding the rest of my solution...Never had any problem with it "falling to the bottom," nor have I had any oxydation problems.....It actually takes a lot of ppm's of oxygen to actually cause beer to oxydize (according to someone else on Basic Brewing, either Chris Colby, or John Palmer, can't recall which) and normal careful racking/bottling procedures, and most "accidents" and mistakes that we make during the course of things, just isn't enough.

I believe they said it would literally take "accidently" putting your airstone setup in your bottling bucket of beer and leaving it running for 10 minutes or so before you put your beer at risk for oxydation...So unless you are pouring your beer from your fermenter into your bottling bucket, you really shouldn't worry....

Remember ask 10 different homebrewers how they do something and why, and you'll get 12 different answers....and a lot of it has been passed down into lore or conjecture, and may not have any veracity...

Remember, It supposed to be about RDWHAHB....

 

[brewt00l]

I was listening to a podcast on Basic Brewing with David Logsdon the CEO of Wyeast.

They were talking about his view of what the most common problem he sees in homebrewing and his view was oxidation.

Putting a priming sugar solution into a bottle bucket had many bad things going for it. Many times the solution will drop to the bottom of the bucket. OR a brewer will stir so much oxidation will start to occur.

THUS - he is a huge fan of Carbonation drops. Just put one in each bottle and stop worrying.

Comments???

The one thing I would think is don't you want to have control on different amounts of sugar?

Sure, carb drops are one way to eliminate the areas of potential problems mentioned.....course, good techniques and attention to a few key details (both very beneficial in general) can accomplish the exact same thing. It's up to the individual brewer where to draw the line between the factors of convenience/ease, economy, control and time required.

 

[ArcaneXor]

Many people use bottling buckets and this was just a response to the original post, addressing what he said. Yes, if you wanted to completely limit the amount of 02 your beer is exposed to you wouldn't use a bottling bucket. The fact is, small amounts of oxidation are not big problems for homebrewers who often drink their beer pretty damn fresh anyways. And, most homebrewers use bottling buckets...what was your point anyways?? I'm not even sure what that comment has to do with what I said?

The whole point Dave made in said interview that is that by using carb drops, you can save yourself one racking (instead of carboy->bottling bucket->bottle you do carboy -> bottle), thus reducing the potential for infection and oxidation. So you wouldn't "siphon into a bottling bucket anyways". I was clarifying Dave's point, not questioning your technique. I apologize if it came across that way.

That said, I completely agree with your points. I use the bottling bucket/priming sugar method for all my full-size batches, just like many of us, and oxidation has not been a problem with my beers. The reason I use the method advocated by Dave for small batches is simply a matter of personal preference.

It's important to remember that Dave was being interviewed by Basic Brewing Radio, which mostly targets new homebrewers. I don't think he would advocate the same on, say, the Brewing Network Sunday Session.

 

[RICLARK]

I have never had an oxidized beer, Ive had over carbed brews but never an undercarbed one. A lot of Hber's down at my Lhbs say that the carb tabs are hit and miss. You will have 2 beers that are fine and then 1 that is flat So I have been kind of skeptical in buy a pack.

 

[cubbies]

I have never had an oxidized beer, Ive had over carbed brews but never an undercarbed one. A lot of Hber's down at my Lhbs say that the carb tabs are hit and miss. You will have 2 beers that are fine and then 1 that is flat So I have been kind of skeptical in buy a pack.

I went to a "brew school" thing here in STL sponsored by AB. It was for the humane society and you got to meet the head brewmaster at AB and he gave a presentation and you got to try samples and whatnot.

Anywho, at one point during his presentation he got to talking about why Budweiser has the born on date and talked about freshness and whatnot. He gave everyone a glass of fresh Budweiser and a glass of older thoroughly oxidized Budweiser. It wasnt until i did this that I really realized what oxidation tastes like. However, that "wet cardboard" that people use to describe it is a perfect example. If you want to taste it, all you have to do is buy a couple of Budweisers. Buy one and put it in the garage and let it sit there. Three months later, go buy a fresh one. Taste them side by side.

 

[HOOTER]

all you have to do is buy a couple of Budweisers.

NEVER!!!