Brainstorming

[ISUbrady]

I am new to brewing, but I recently acquired 4 full size kegs. So i am wanting to build a 10 gallon batch system. After I figured out what kind of system I wanted to go with, Electric and RIMS system. I started thinking what material are electric water heaters made out of.

I am wondering if you could use the electric water heater as a HLT and maybe Boil kettle I am not sure what it is made of.

Also I have only done my 5th 5 gallon batch of all grain and am trying to think of ways to improve mashing. Would there be an advantage to have a multi level mash tun. As in there would be multiple screens at different heights to improve drainage?

Thank you,

 

[doug293cz]

I am new to brewing, but I recently acquired 4 full size kegs. So i am wanting to build a 10 gallon batch system. After I figured out what kind of system I wanted to go with, Electric and RIMS system. I started thinking what material are electric water heaters made out of.

I am wondering if you could use the electric water heater as a HLT and maybe Boil kettle I am not sure what it is made of.

Also I have only done my 5th 5 gallon batch of all grain and am trying to think of ways to improve mashing. Would there be an advantage to have a multi level mash tun. As in there would be multiple screens at different heights to improve drainage?

Thank you,

Most electric brewers use water heater elements. There are several suppliers that sell heater elements that are all stainless for the wetted surfaces, and these are the best choice.

How would you mash in with screens (false bottoms) at multiple levels in your MLT? Doesn't seem practical to me offhand.

Brew on

 

[ISUbrady]

I was going to use water heater elements but I was wondering what the interior of water heaters are. And if that would effect the wort during boil? It appears that most water heaters in the US are a glass interior.

As far as screens go I was not sure but didn't know if having multiple lower surface area false bottoms would increse mash efficiency

 

[brandonnys]

Water heaters are almost always ceramic-coated steel.

 

[doug293cz]

Water heaters are almost always ceramic-coated steel.

The ceramic coating is an enamel glaze, which is a glassy material, so the industry uses the term "glass lined." It's basically the same as an enamel coated pot.

People brew successfully in enamel pots, but the enamel can develop pin holes, chips, or other defects that expose the underlying steel, which then rusts. Exposed rust can lead to excess iron in the beer, which is detrimental as iron has a low taste threshold.

Brew on

 

[ISUbrady]

So if you do not ding or damage the ceramic it can still become poris and that will then cause rust and other defects? I was just pondering this concept because there always seems to be an abundance of old water heaters that are usually free.

 

[lschiavo]

Good thinking. Cut one open and try it. I have never seen anyone do that (I'm sure someone has). I guess even if it's glass lined, you'd still have the cut edge to deal with somehow and also have to deal with it with every hole you drill into the vessel.

You already have what you need with your four kegs. Why you trying to buck the system?

 

[doug293cz]

So if you do not ding or damage the ceramic it can still become poris and that will then cause rust and other defects? I was just pondering this concept because there always seems to be an abundance of old water heaters that are usually free.

It shouldn't become porous spontaneously. A pinhole is usually the result of a tiny bubble in the glaze layer after application. Drilling new holes, cutting into the tank, or denting the tank could all lead to the formation of cracks in the enamel.

Used water heaters usually have a lot of crap in the bottom of them. A lot of the crap is often calcium deposits which could be extremely difficult to remove.

Good luck.

Brew on

 

[ISUbrady]

I know already have what I need with the 4 kegs, but I like to look for different ways to do things and didn't know if this would be an option.

Sounds like it is not such a great idea to look into.

Thank you all for the help and advice

 

[ISUbrady]

Now that we have ruled that out. I just wanted to run by the system I want to build to you.

1 full size keg to become my HLT, using 1 water heater element. 1 square cooler 10 gallon + for MLT with false bottom and sparge arm, utilizing a RIMS system. 1 full size keg for the brew kettle using 2 water heater elements. 1 chugger pump(I figured to save some money for now to just use 1 pump and do some connecting and disconnecting between stages). but would like to have 2 later on down the road. For the water heater elements I was thinking 240V 4500 or 5500 watts. I would use a high density in the HLT and low densities in the Boil kettle and RIMS to prevent scorching. Would have all the elements wired using PID's I think they are. Oh forgot sight gauges on HLT and BK. Also would like to somehow be able to clean in place.

Something I do not quite understand yet is how and why do you aerate your wort in the BK I think is what is done?

 

[brandonnys]

Aeration occurs in a decent amount when you boil. The better way to aerate is to get a stone and some O2 and introduce oxygen to the cooled wort just prior to pitching the yeast, IMO.

Something like this: http://www.homebrewsupply.com/diffusion-stone-0-5-microns.html

 

[doug293cz]

Aeration occurs in a decent amount when you boil. The better way to aerate is to get a stone and some O2 and introduce oxygen to the cooled wort just prior to pitching the yeast, IMO.

Something like this: http://www.homebrewsupply.com/diffusion-stone-0-5-microns.html

It's actually de-aeration that occurs during boiling. O2 comes out of the wort.

Brew on

 

[brandonnys]

It's actually de-aeration that occurs during boiling. O2 comes out of the wort.

This is correct, my bad.

 

[lschiavo]

Now that we have ruled that out. I just wanted to run by the system I want to build to you.

1 full size keg to become my HLT, using 1 water heater element. 1 square cooler 10 gallon + for MLT with false bottom and sparge arm, utilizing a RIMS system. 1 full size keg for the brew kettle using 2 water heater elements. 1 chugger pump(I figured to save some money for now to just use 1 pump and do some connecting and disconnecting between stages). but would like to have 2 later on down the road. For the water heater elements I was thinking 240V 4500 or 5500 watts. I would use a high density in the HLT and low densities in the Boil kettle and RIMS to prevent scorching. Would have all the elements wired using PID's I think they are. Oh forgot sight gauges on HLT and BK. Also would like to somehow be able to clean in place.

Something I do not quite understand yet is how and why do you aerate your wort in the BK I think is what is done?

I would put two elements in the HLT if anywhere. The boil kettle only has to get the wort from mash out to boil, the HLT from tap temps to strike. It is really nice to heat the strike water fast. That is exactly what I have. I added the second element to the HLT later. The BK works fine with one 5500W for 10 gallon batches.

A keg makes a better MLT than a cooler IMO. Since you are doing RIMS, heat loss in the MLT should not be an issue. Consider cutting the bottom of the kegs and using the neck with a camlock fitting for your drains. That works really nice.

 

[ISUbrady]

How long does it take to get a 12 gallon batch of wort to boil with just one element?

With your suggestion of turning a key upside down and using the neck with a camlock to drain, would it be possible to cut the bottom put that on a hinge with some rubber seals and clamos to use as fermenter?

 

[lschiavo]

Here is a calculator: http://manskirtbrewing.com/calculators.aspx

I have not looked into making a fermenter from a keg. I'm sure you can find a thread on that around here somewhere.

 

[lschiavo]

Here you go: https://www.homebrewtalk.com/showthread.php?t=447780

 

[ISUbrady]

I was thinking more along the lines of turning the keg upside down, attaching a coupling some sort of yeast catcher, cut the top off all the way across a few inches below its highest point, attach clamps onto it and rubber seals on the cut edges, cut a hole in the top and put in a bung and air lock.

 

[brandonnys]

^

Uh... What?

 

[ISUbrady]

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/showthread.php?t=276378

Do something like that to where you normally tap the keg, and then cut what is the normally the bottom of the keg straight across so it is removable for cleaning and maintenance, but add rubber seals or gaskets to make it air tight and screw clamps to hold it tight. Drill a hole that is normally the bottom to insert a rubber stopper with an air lock to ferment my 12 gallon batches in.