Batch Sparge Water Volumes

[Salt]

I can't seem to figure this out and I'm sure it gets asked all of the time. How do you calculate your strike and sparge water volumes and temperature. Is there a standard water/grain ratio? Is there a standard temp for optimal mashing?

 

[Hammy71]

A good calculator is:

http://www.brewheads.com/batch.php

I use it to determine my strike water amount and temp. I usually shoot for 1.3 quarts/pound. Some do a little more and some do a little less. As far as the sparge water I measure my first runnings in a bucket that has gallon marks. I then subtract that amount from my pre-boil volume. Divide that number by two and you have your 2 sparge water amounts. The grain is already saturated, so what you put in at that point you get out. You'll usually mash in the low to medium 150s. The recipe/style will usually dictate/tell you what temp to mash at. A reliable thermometer that can be calibrated is a must IMHO.

 

[Bizoune]

I'm usually at 1.25 qt/lb. Depending on quantity of grains (11 to 12 lbs) and desired mash temp, I'm at about 4 gallons of mash water. After my first runnings, I'll measure what's in the kettle. Then I'll add the remainder of my water to my mash tun to get to my desired boil volume. After first runnings, grain bed is saturated and won't absorb more water. So for example, 5 gallons of sparge will give you 5 gallons of wort. Plus what is in the kettle after 1st runnings gets you to your pre boil volume.
I've bought a itouch this summer and the Brewpal apps is terrific to get all of this figured out. You can then concentrate on getting your brewing groove up and running during brew day.

 

[Salt]

These figures are just as an example and say you are brewing a 5 gallon batch.

If you mash in with say 4 gallons of water at strike temp and with grain absorption, you are left with 2 gallons from your first running?

Then you would sparge with an additional 5 gallons to rinse the grain and as you said there is little to no water absorption because the grain bed is already saturated? This would include water for evaporation?

How do you account for evaporation? How much is typically lost?

Is your Pre-Boil volume, First runnings (2 Gal) and then Second runnings (say 5 Gal taking into accout for evap)? This should boil down to 5 gallons in total after say 60 minutes or whatever the recipe calls for?

I'm almost there, just not quite.

Also, why is there variation in water/pound of grain? What is the effect.

I appreciate you guys taking your time to help me.

 

[ian-atx]

You are correct, pre-boil volume is going to be your first runnings plus any additional sparges. For example, if I am aiming for 6ish gallons after 60 minutes, then I want to have around 7 or so gallons pre-boil.

Evaporation during boil will vary depending on system, kettle, etc. Most pre-boil volume calculators will start with assuming a 10-15% evaporation rate per hour. The only way to really figure it out is to brew with your system a few times, and know how much pre-boil volume you have and how much you end up with after X minutes. Then you can figure out the percentage and use that as a guide.

Grain absorption varies, but most people initially assume .1 gallon per pound of grain. So if you have a 10# grain bill, then you will lose roughly 1 gallon to absorption.

The only time I really deviate from the water/grain thickness of 1.25 qt/lb is if it is a huge grain bill and I just physically cannot have that much water in the mash tun. I am sure there are a bunch of threads on this site about mash thickness alone.

How many batch sparge brews have you done? Getting a handle on the numbers and whatnot is good, but brewing and taking notes and having reliable measurements will help tie everything together.

I have an iphone and the brewpal app is cool, and the spargepal app is free (or at least it used to be, and its functionality is included with brewpal) and helps with these calcs.

 

[Salt]

This is going to be my first. Why would you be aiming for 6 gallons after a 60 min boil? What is the point of a 5 gallon recipe.

 

[ian-atx]

I like to have a little extra for system losses (kettle deadspace, crap left in primary, etc) so I end up with 5.25 to 5.5 after all is done.

 

[Mermaid]

One common value I have seen used in more than a few recipies is shooting to boil roughly 7 gallons for a 60 minute boil to yield 5.5 gallons for the fermenter.

With partial mash recipes, depending on whether or not I'm going to split the boil between 2 kettles (I can't go larger than 5 gallon kettles atm) I'll sparge in 4 gallons of water, add my first running to make as close to a 5 gallon boil as I can get. (Then top off to 5.5 gallons in the carboy)

 

[Salt]

I see. It just seems that there is so many variables in HB'ing that there is no way to really have a way to maintain a high level of consistency or repeatability when working on one recipe. The volume issue is something im still trying to understand. You are mashing and sparging and end up with say 6 gallons of wort and after boiling for 60 minutes and the recipe is for 5 gallons. using x-oz of hops for 5 gallons and x-oz of spices for 5 gallons with the same boil time with 6 gallons as you do for 5 gallons. You have an extra gallon of wort. To me it almost seems like baking a cake with and an extra cup of milk and an extra egg. Almost like diluting your overall hop content.

 

[Bizoune]

I also boil 7 gallons down to 6 in an hour and when I'm lucky, I'm getting 5.5 gallons of clean wort in the fermenter. When I'm not so lucky, wort won't be so clean but no worries. It'll all fall to the bottom of primary after fermentation.
The learning curve is pretty steep in homebrewing. You'll learn so much in the first few months. When you get the process down, you'll find that it'll be much easier. Only way to do that is brew often, take notes and try to get better as you go along.

 

[Mermaid]

I see. It just seems that there is so many variables in HB'ing that there is no way to really have a way to maintain a high level of consistency or repeatability when working on one recipe. The volume issue is something im still trying to understand. You are mashing and sparging and end up with say 6 gallons of wort and after boiling for 60 minutes and the recipe is for 5 gallons. using x-oz of hops for 5 gallons and x-oz of spices for 5 gallons with the same boil time with 6 gallons as you do for 5 gallons. You have an extra gallon of wort. To me it almost seems like baking a cake with and an extra cup of milk and an extra egg. Almost like diluting your hops.

I understand. I was completely overwhelmed for my second batch. I spent the better part of 2 months researching (because I couldn't brew due to my leg being in a cast).

I read a whole bunch of recipies and then when I started to figure out what I wanted to do, started messing around with the tastybrew.com calculator.

The sparge volume thing can be really overwhelming, but I really think it boils down to this (no pun intended). You want to boil as high a volume as you can given the equipment you have and the size of the fermenter. While you want to stay as close as possible to the 1.25 - 1.5 qt. per lb. of grain "general" rule (I've seen) for mashing, the sparge volume seems less important than your temperature.

Again, I'm new at this so please take this with a grain of er... salt (lol again.. no pun intended).

My dubbel hit the OG mark (was a little higher actually)I was shooting for, it fermented great, and when my boyfriend and I tasted it before we bottled it - he freely admitted that it was very tasty (and he normally doesn't care for Belgian styles).

So feel free to experiment just a little (and keep good notes). You may be very pleasantly surprised what you get.