Another kegging question

[sorefingers23]

Hi everyone, I'm sure this has been asked and answered a million times, I did a search and can't really find what I'm looking for, I suck at the internet that's pro bono why I can't find what I need.

I'm about to set up my first kegging system, and I have a few questions,

How long should my keg hoses be
How much psi should I set my kegs to
How long does it take to carb

I have found a lot of answer with a lot of formulas, I'm really trying to keep my brewing simple these days, I don't have that much free time at the moment, and have found the more complicated my homebrew ing gets the less I want to homebrew.

I would really appreciate if someone could help me out, and again I apologize for what I'm sure has been asked over and over again.

 

[Remmy]

Hi everyone, I'm sure this has been asked and answered a million times, I did a search and can't really find what I'm looking for, I suck at the internet that's pro bono why I can't find what I need.

I'm about to set up my first kegging system, and I have a few questions,

How long should my keg hoses be
How much psi should I set my kegs to
How long does it take to carb

I have found a lot of answer with a lot of formulas, I'm really trying to keep my brewing simple these days, I don't have that much free time at the moment, and have found the more complicated my homebrew ing gets the less I want to homebrew.

I would really appreciate if someone could help me out, and again I apologize for what I'm sure has been asked over and over again.

The smartass in me would point you here: http://beersmith.com/blog/2011/07/14/keg-line-length-balancing-the-science-of-draft-beer

However, I don't buy into having to go through all that bull**** for something that seems so easy to accomplish effectively. So, I built my kegerator over 6 months ago and decided to make all of my beer lines 6' long. Haven't had ANY issues whatsoever with the height of the keg in the fridge or line length. Beers pour perfectly fine after setting the gas to 30 psi, shaking each keg for 20 seconds, leaving the kegs at 30 psi overnight and turning down the pressure to 10 psi for serving the following day.

Works. Every damn time. Good luck.

 

[Newsman]

The "rule of thumb" around here is 10' x 3/8 id lines, serving about 10-12 PSI. You can either do as Remmy suggests and put it on high-pressure and shake, or you can put it on "serving" pressure for a couple weeks (give or take) and it should be fully carbed. If you get a lot of foam when serving, there are some epoxy mixing sticks you can but that people swear help slow things down if you put them in your dip tube. I personally don't need them.

 

[doug293cz]

The "rule of thumb" around here is 10' x 3/8 id lines, serving about 10-12 PSI. You can either do as Remmy suggests and put it on high-pressure and shake, or you can put it on "serving" pressure for a couple weeks (give or take) and it should be fully carbed. If you get a lot of foam when serving, there are some epoxy mixing sticks you can but that people swear help slow things down if you put them in your dip tube. I personally don't need them.

That should be 3/16" ID for beer lines.

1. First thing you need to do is determine at what temperature you want to serve the beer. Lots of people use the 38° - 40°F range, although some prefer a little warmer.
2. Next determine how much carbonation you want in the beer. This can vary depending on the style.
3. Once you know temperature and carb level desired, you can use the calculator here to determine what the storage pressure should be to achieve and maintain the carb level.
4. Finally use this calculator to determine how long your beer lines should be to prevent foaming and other pour problems.

Some people get away with shorter lines than recommended by the calculator, but there are also numerous threads on HBT from people using short lines and asking why their pours are all foam. Ignore the recommended lengths at your own risk.

When it comes to force carbonating (any method using compressed CO2 gas) there are several ways to achieve the same goal.
Set and Forget - Put the keg in the cooler at the pressure given by the calculator for your temperature and carb level. It will take two to three weeks to reach the desired carbonation level.
High Pressure Accelerated - Apply 30 psi to the keg and put it in the cooler without shaking, rolling, or other agitation. Leave at 30 psi for 36 hours, and then vent the keg and set to the pressure given by the calculator for your temp and carb level. Beer will be ready to drink in 2 - 4 days.
Agitation Accelerated - Chill the keg and then apply the pressure given by the calculator for your temperature and carb level. Then shake or roll the keg repeatedly until you no longer hear gas going into the keg. Beer is carbonated and drinkable immediately, but it will take several days for any particulates to settle out so that the beer can pour clear.

I don't recommend high pressure plus agitation, or high pressure for longer than 36 hours, as it is very easy to overcarbonate your beer by doing this. You will see reports of people who do this, but you will also see lots of threads asking "why is my beer overcarbonated and how do I fix it?" from people who try it. Again, you do this at your own risk.

No matter how you want to approach force carbonating, it is important to pressurize and vent several times (I recommend 5 times) in order to get air and O2 out of the headspace. O2 can cause your beer to oxidize over time. The pressure contribution from any air will reduce the effective pressure of the CO2, and your carb level will be lower than desired (but will improve as the keg is emptied.)

Brew on

 

[Remmy]

That should be 3/16" ID for beer lines.

1. First thing you need to do is determine at what temperature you want to serve the beer. Lots of people use the 38° - 40°F range, although some prefer a little warmer.
2. Next determine how much carbonation you want in the beer. This can vary depending on the style.
3. Once you know temperature and carb level desired, you can use the calculator here to determine what the storage pressure should be to achieve and maintain the carb level.
4. Finally use this calculator to determine how long your beer lines should be to prevent foaming and other pour problems.

Some people get away with shorter lines than recommended by the calculator, but there are also numerous threads on HBT from people using short lines and asking why their pours are all foam. Ignore the recommended lengths at your own risk.

When it comes to force carbonating (any method using compressed CO2 gas) there are several ways to achieve the same goal.
Set and Forget - Put the keg in the cooler at the pressure given by the calculator for your temperature and carb level. It will take two to three weeks to reach the desired carbonation level.
High Pressure Accelerated - Apply 30 psi to the keg and put it in the cooler without shaking, rolling, or other agitation. Leave at 30 psi for 36 hours, and then vent the keg and set to the pressure given by the calculator for your temp and carb level. Beer will be ready to drink in 2 - 4 days.
Agitation Accelerated - Chill the keg and then apply the pressure given by the calculator for your temperature and carb level. Then shake or roll the keg repeatedly until you no longer hear gas going into the keg. Beer is carbonated and drinkable immediately, but it will take several days for any particulates to settle out so that the beer can pour clear.

I don't recommend high pressure plus agitation, or high pressure for longer than 36 hours, as it is very easy to overcarbonate your beer by doing this. You will see reports of people who do this, but you will also see lots of threads asking "why is my beer overcarbonated and how do I fix it?" from people who try it. Again, you do this at your own risk.

No matter how you want to approach force carbonating, it is important to pressurize and vent several times (I recommend 5 times) in order to get air and O2 out of the headspace. O2 can cause your beer to oxidize over time. The pressure contribution from any air will reduce the effective pressure of the CO2, and your carb level will be lower than desired (but will improve as the keg is emptied.)

Brew on

Great advice. There's a lot of this floating around on HBT.

I opted for what I think is the easiest method to carbing beer in kegs and drinking a home brew one day after kegging. If I had chosen the set it and forget it method, I may as well have bottled my beer. I keg for a reason and that is, I can drink the beer I've kegged in 16-24 hours.
I

 

[normonster]

10 ft lines for beer out.

15 psi at 40 degrees = ready in 1.5 weeks.

 

[sorefingers23]

My keg kit came with 6 ft hoses so I'm gonna start with that.
I just legged 3 batches that I've been too lazy to bottle for quite some time, I gotta say I'm in love with keggin already, I kegged 3 batches in the time it would take me to Bottle 1.

I set the kegs at 30psi when should I shake them up? Right away or should I wait a bit

 

[sorefingers23]

I also wanted to know is it possible to prime the kegs I can't fit in my fridge with dextrose as I would when bottling? That way when 1 keg is empty I can put the new one in reay to go?

 

[normonster]

I set the kegs at 30psi when should I shake them up? Right away or should I wait a bit

Personally I don't think you should ever. I started doing that at first and it screwed up some good beer. Why not leave it 4 days then start drawing a few pours a day? Barely carbed beer is better than over carbed beer IMO. If you must, sit down and roll it back and fourth on your lap like 100 times with gas in near top of sideways keg. You'll hear the O2 valve letting gas in. Then release pressure to 10 or so and wait a day to test.

 

[normonster]

I also wanted to know is it possible to prime the kegs I can't fit in my fridge with dextrose as I would when bottling? That way when 1 keg is empty I can put the new one in reay to go?

Yes...you should still purge with c02 though after you prime and leave 10 psi in there to maintain the seal.

 

[Cider123]

"High Pressure Accelerated" - I do this one only instead of setting it to 30psi automatically, I first determine what serving pressure I eventually want then I multiply that by 3. That is the pressure I set it to for 36 hours. I found that if I set a low carb mild ale to 30 for 36 hours I get too much carbonation.

 

[doug293cz]

I also wanted to know is it possible to prime the kegs I can't fit in my fridge with dextrose as I would when bottling? That way when 1 keg is empty I can put the new one in reay to go?

Yes, you can do this. Another option is to do set and forget force carbing at room temperature. For example: If you are looking for 2.5 volumes of CO2, and your room temp is 70°F, then the calculator says carb at 28.8 psi. Of course to do this you need another regulator that you can set at different pressure than the one you use with your cold kegs.

Brew on

 

[doug293cz]

"High Pressure Accelerated" - I do this one only instead of setting it to 30psi automatically, I first determine what serving pressure I eventually want then I multiply that by 3. That is the pressure I set it to for 36 hours. I found that if I set a low carb mild ale to 30 for 36 hours I get too much carbonation.

Interesting idea. I don't do a lot of styles that are low carb (yet) so haven't experienced the over carb yet. I wonder if going 3x for a high carb beer might end up overdoing it. I'll have to go back and re-learn some of my diffusion math to see if it seems reasonable.

Brew on

 

[Cider123]

Interesting idea. I don't do a lot of styles that are low carb (yet) so haven't experienced the over carb yet. I wonder if going 3x for a high carb beer might end up overdoing it. I'll have to go back and re-learn some of my diffusion math to see if it seems reasonable.

Brew on

Oh, this wasn't my idea. I got this from other folks on this site. I haven't tried it for beers over 10psi serving pressure since I wouldn't like them. I don't like beer carbonation over 8psi for even lawnmover style beers. In fact I just got a nitro system to create that cask conditioned texture.

 

[doug293cz]

Oh, this wasn't my idea. I got this from other folks on this site. I haven't tried it for beers over 10psi serving pressure since I wouldn't like them. I don't like beer carbonation over 8psi for even lawnmover style beers. In fact I just got a nitro system to create that cask conditioned texture.

Thanks for the follow up.

Brew on

 

[day_trippr]

doug293cz FTW.

My keg kit came with 6 ft hoses so I'm gonna start with that.

Good luck with that...

Cheers!

 

[Newsman]

That should be 3/16" ID for beer lines.

Thanks for correcting that.

 

[sorefingers23]

I kegged my beer at 30 psi for 24 hours and then dropped the pressure to 12 psi and it's been 5 days now, 6 if you include the 24 hours at 30 psi, I still don't see much difference in the carbonation of the beer. Should I just forget about for another week, or is there something not right?

 

[doug293cz]

I kegged my beer at 30 psi for 24 hours and then dropped the pressure to 12 psi and it's been 5 days now, 6 if you include the 24 hours at 30 psi, I still don't see much difference in the carbonation of the beer. Should I just forget about for another week, or is there something not right?

Your carbonation should be good after that protocol. What kind of pours are you getting, and are you pouring with the tap wide open? What is your beer temp?

Brew on

 

[sorefingers23]

I'm getting nice pours, tap is wide open, temp is around 45


Sent from my iPhone using Home Brew

 

[doug293cz]

I'm getting nice pours, tap is wide open, temp is around 45

Sent from my iPhone using Home Brew

@12 psi and 45°F, you have about 2.25 volumes of CO2 in your beer. This may be lower than you prefer. If you increase your pressure to 15 psi, you will get about 2.5 volumes of CO2. This may be more to your liking. There is a wide range of carbonation level preferences among beer aficionados. You can find a nice carbonation level vs. temp & pressure here.

Brew on

 

[sorefingers23]

so tomorrow will be 3 weeks in kegs, 24 hours at 30 psi, 2 weeks at 12 psi, and then I bumped up to 15 psi for the last 5 days. Just pulled a pint and not much has happened. There doesn't seem to be any leaks the tank is still around the same place as it was 3 weeks ago.