Hi I'm am about to put on a brew of wheat beer, I'm am brewing it from an extract. i keep it in one fermenter then bottle it.so I was wondering when would be the best time to add my orange and coriander seed, I have been advised it's best to add flavours a few days before bottling (although that was for coffee beans and vinilla) mabye these ingredients behave differently?it says on my pack of orange peel to add at boil. Anyone have any experience with this? Also I'm trying to get a flavour similar to hoegarrden which is a very nice Belgium wit,so would any one know how much orange and coriander seed to add I was thinking 25 grams of each,for 22.5 litres?
Adding coriander and bitter orange peel
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flars
Well-Known Member
I add 1 ounce of coriander, not crushed, for 10 minutes and 1 ounce of bitter orange peel for 1 minute in the boil. This is for a 5 gallon Witbier recipe I have brewed a few times.
That's interesting, I would have though you would need more time for the flavours to be absorbed. Although I haven't any experience!!Does this recipe you do have very mild hints or is it quite pronounced? Hoegaarden has a very unique flavour compared to other wits I've tried, and I think it's due to the coriander and orange really shinning through. So I want to go for reasonably strong flavours Also I would like to add a bit of a kick with some crushed pepper corns. Have you ever tried this?
flars
Well-Known Member
I've never tasted Hoegaarden so I can't make a comparison with what I have brewed. I did crush the coriander seeds, once. The beer had an easily perceived bitterness to it compared to the other brews.
The flavor of the coriander and bitter orange peel is up front, but very well balanced so it is not overpowering the malt.
I have used black peppercorns in dill pickles, about 8 to 12 per quart. There was a distinct bitterness to these pickles compared to those without. I would use white peppercorns in a beer, if I were going to make this addition. The bitterness may not be present with the black hull absent. To my palette white pepper adds heat, but the heat is fleeting. It does not stay on the tongue.
I would not crush the peppercorns. Might add a little to much flavor.
The flavor of the coriander and bitter orange peel is up front, but very well balanced so it is not overpowering the malt.
I have used black peppercorns in dill pickles, about 8 to 12 per quart. There was a distinct bitterness to these pickles compared to those without. I would use white peppercorns in a beer, if I were going to make this addition. The bitterness may not be present with the black hull absent. To my palette white pepper adds heat, but the heat is fleeting. It does not stay on the tongue.
I would not crush the peppercorns. Might add a little to much flavor.
You're absolutely right, those spices need more time to extract flavor.
If you add them at or close to flameout, give them a 30' steep/stand before starting the chilling. During the steep your wort will cool down gradually, which is good.
To speed up extraction, grind, pound, or crack (mortar) the coriander coarsely. I even run the orange peel through my spice/coffee mill to get smaller pieces and lots of powder. Those dried peels are very hard and tough. If you can't or don't want to grind them, soak them in a covered cup of hot water for a couple hours (use microwave to heat the steeping potion every now and then, don't boil). Then add the potion, peels and all, at flameout or 5 minutes before, steep 30' and chill.
To give much more and better flavor, lightly toast the whole coriander seeds in a skillet. Only toast them to become a couple shades darker than the green ones, definitely not brown, you're not making Indian curry.
Amounts to use (crushed and pulverized):
I use 1/4 oz (7 grams) of each in a 5.5 gallon batch, that's pulverized and a 30' steep/stand after flameout. You can double quantities of either or both for more pronounced flavor. Putting in a whole ounce each may be about the limit.
7 grams of coriander seeds (whole) is about 2 tablespoons. The (big) bags they sell at the Indian spice stores are great and fairly cheap.
Curacao bitter orange peel is used traditionally, but you could use fresh peel from oranges, tangerines, persimmons, etc. Seville oranges are the most sought after and wonderful. Whole Foods or Trader Joe's have them during the season. You really want the colored zest, don't get too deep into the (white) pith when grating or peeling. You could add some of the juice too.
When adding larger amounts of peel and spices, taste the wort each time, and be careful not to overdo it. Careful tasting gives you an indication on how far to take it. If needed, you can always add more after primary fermentation has completed, similar to a dry hop.
If you add them at or close to flameout, give them a 30' steep/stand before starting the chilling. During the steep your wort will cool down gradually, which is good.
To speed up extraction, grind, pound, or crack (mortar) the coriander coarsely. I even run the orange peel through my spice/coffee mill to get smaller pieces and lots of powder. Those dried peels are very hard and tough. If you can't or don't want to grind them, soak them in a covered cup of hot water for a couple hours (use microwave to heat the steeping potion every now and then, don't boil). Then add the potion, peels and all, at flameout or 5 minutes before, steep 30' and chill.
To give much more and better flavor, lightly toast the whole coriander seeds in a skillet. Only toast them to become a couple shades darker than the green ones, definitely not brown, you're not making Indian curry.
Amounts to use (crushed and pulverized):
I use 1/4 oz (7 grams) of each in a 5.5 gallon batch, that's pulverized and a 30' steep/stand after flameout. You can double quantities of either or both for more pronounced flavor. Putting in a whole ounce each may be about the limit.
7 grams of coriander seeds (whole) is about 2 tablespoons. The (big) bags they sell at the Indian spice stores are great and fairly cheap.
Curacao bitter orange peel is used traditionally, but you could use fresh peel from oranges, tangerines, persimmons, etc. Seville oranges are the most sought after and wonderful. Whole Foods or Trader Joe's have them during the season. You really want the colored zest, don't get too deep into the (white) pith when grating or peeling. You could add some of the juice too.
When adding larger amounts of peel and spices, taste the wort each time, and be careful not to overdo it. Careful tasting gives you an indication on how far to take it. If needed, you can always add more after primary fermentation has completed, similar to a dry hop.
Along with my initial extract,I was going to add 1.5 kg coopers liquid malt extract, so I was thinking of mixing my spices in with that in a pot over heat for 20 minutes then adding to my fermentation bucket.25 grams of orange peel and 20 g of coriander
You can leave the spices in there for the whole fermentation. After a while they just don't have much left in them. It won't be too strong and they leave no bad byproducts or flavors.
Many recipes call for the orange peel/spices to be added the last minute of the boil, and honestly I have no clue how they can think you're going to extract much out of them. The center of the orange peel chunks won't even get wet.
Don't burn that Coopers LME when heating it up. You could add it at flameout to your kettle. The hot wort will dissolve it faster.
Many recipes call for the orange peel/spices to be added the last minute of the boil, and honestly I have no clue how they can think you're going to extract much out of them. The center of the orange peel chunks won't even get wet.
Don't burn that Coopers LME when heating it up. You could add it at flameout to your kettle. The hot wort will dissolve it faster.
I just added the lme to a pot then made it up to 5 litres with hot water then I added my spices and let it simmer for 30 minutes then mixed it with the wort which was also mixed with 5 litres of hot water. And then made it up to 20 litres.Do you think the flavours will be noticeable?
flars
Well-Known Member
Post when you taste your first hydrometer sample in a couple of weeks.
Sorry about the late post.But after I tasted my first hydrometer reading. I thought the flavours where a bit lacking, so I decided to toast some more coriander seed( 9 grams ) and added it and left it for a few days. So I decided to post after the bottled beer was ready.And after four weeks the flavours have really come though the Orange peel and coriander work very well together. There is a very citrusy element to the beer, the coriander is the more dominant flavour but there are still hints of the Orange peel. I am very happy with the overall flavour,although I wasn't able to get the spicey element of hoegarrden( a Belgium wit that I was trying to recreate). But the other night I made a salmon dish and used a spice called cardamom and after tasting the sauce I thought that that spice might be the key to getting that flavour. This is a wild guess but I plan to try it,and post the results.
