A few questions....Considering BIAB

[blackcows]

I’ve been brewing extract for well over 10 years, I’ve made close to 70 extract batches (5 gallons) in that time. I’d like to move to BIAB for several reasons. Cost savings, ability to brew smaller batches, more variety in what I can brew. For example I love a good dubbel on occasion but 5 gallons is way to much for me. I do have a few questions....

1. Maybe I’ve gotten lazy, maybe just comfortable but I just kinda roll with it when I am brewing. Whatever happens I’m going to make beer. Heck on occasion I don’t even get out the hydrometer. I’m looking at directions for BIAB and I see 152 degrees, yikes! 150 or 155 sound like nice round temperatures to me . Is it as difficult as it sounds to get to and maintain such an exact number?

2. I’ve made extract batches which require a grain bag prior to the extract being added. I always understood squeezing the bag was not good, just let it drip. I read with BIAB you can squeeze. Why the difference?

3. If I’m willing to spend the $500 should I just go with a robobrew v3 instead? How would this differ from BIAB?

 

[kh54s10]

1. There is no "right" mash temperature. It depends on what you are trying to achieve. You certainly can just use 150 for a dry beer and 155 for a heavier mouthfeel. If you are doing small batches in a 5 gallon kettle, one way to hold temperature is to warm your oven to about 150 and put the kettle inside during the mash.

2. There is no difference. Some think that you will extract tannins from the grain by squeezing, but you need high temperatures and certain pH for that to happen and you are unlikely to get that combination. Squeeze away!

3. A Robobrew is BIAB. Just electric. It allows direct control of the mash temperature then after removing the grain you set it to boil the wort. I believe that version also has re-circulation. That helps keep the temperature of the mash stable throughout the depth.

 

[wilserbrewer]

Don’t be intimidated by the lengthy discussions regarding all grain brewing, it can be very simple or complex depending on your level of interest.

Can really be as simple as:
1. Accurately heat strike water to 162 degrees.
2. Add BIAB bag to kettle and mix grains in well.
3. Wrap kettle in blanket let stand for 60 minutes.
4. Remove grain bag and boil as you would w/ full volume extract brewing.

Notice how I never even checked the mash temp?

W/ experience I’m comfortable that an accurate strike temp of 162 - 164 will yield a mash temp of approximately 153 - 155 on a mid gravity beer.

Reference calculator
https://www.rackers.org/calcs.shtml

 

[mongoose33]

The key to mash temp is balancing the temp of the hot water with the cool/cold kettle and the cool grain. The grain and kettle will drop the temp to a specific temp.

The key at that point, once you get there, is to insulate your kettle/mash tun/BIAB setup so it loses as little heat as possible for at least the first 30 minutes, after which most or all of the conversion is done. I used a quilty blanket. Some use sleeping bags. Whatever works.

And yes, you can get pretty darned close to the exact temp assuming you keep good records of what you're doing.


Under no circumstances would I buy a ROBObrew. Period.

 

[BrewInspector]

Hitting those temps is not that difficult. Calculators will put you right where you need to be.

A suggested temp in the recipes is just that, a suggestion. Anywhere in that 150-155 range is going to be fine.

None of this is really anymore complicated than what you already do. You already have the experience needed. Your just going to replace a part of it with a different method.

 

[chickypad]

I'll echo the others. Especially with small batches BIAB can be super simple. I used to brew mostly 10-12 gal batches on a morebeer sculpture, but I sold it last year as I've gone exclusively to stove top BIAB. I do 2-3 gal batches in my old 5 gal extract pot, plus the occasional 5 gal batch which I top off with water. I'm brewing a lot more frequently and I can get other stuff done while brewing. I like the warm oven trick for maintaining mash temp (my oven only goes down to 170 so I preheat then turn it off, typically see no temp change in the 150-155 mash range). Priceless has a good calculator to help figure your volumes:

https://pricelessbrewing.github.io/BiabCalc/#Advanced

 

[kh54s10]

Under no circumstances would I buy a ROBObrew. Period.

I am not interested in one but, why?

 

[mongoose33]

I am not interested in one but, why?

My son had one. Ended up putting it by the curb in hopes someone would take it....someone did. Bought a Grainfather. Yeah, some people have been able to make Robobrew work, but there are many instances where not so much.

 

[NewJersey]

even a grainfather tho... if you're gonna go electric why not spend a few more bucks and get a more versatile 240v setup? the extra speed was the main driver for me, but most other 240v systems are also more modular. when any part of that grainfather takes a dump... good luck.

 

[blackcows]

One other thing I’m struggling to understand is efficiency and why it’s important. The only explanations I can find seem very complicated. Can someone dumb it down for an extract brewer?

 

[Blazinlow86]

One other thing I’m struggling to understand is efficiency and why it’s important. The only explanations I can find seem very complicated. Can someone dumb it down for an extract brewer?

You want to find out your systems efficiency so you can adjust your recipes to compensate for your system eventually. The actual efficiency of your system doesn't really matter. It will just make very slight difference in your ingredients costs. Concentrate more of repeatable results rather then increasing efficiency at least until your all sorted. Cheers

 

[wilserbrewer]

With extract your are adding accurate amount of fermentable sugar to your beer.

With all grain your efficiency determines how much fermentable sugar you extracted from the grain.

Short explanation is with lousy efficiency your brew will be low alcohol or you will need to use more grain.

Knowing your efficiency is key to brewing the beer your targeting.

I wouldn’t worry too much about efficiency at this point...key point to take away is to try and assure your grain is crushed well when brewing all grain.

#1 cause of low efficiency is a poor crush.

 

[BrewInspector]

Exactly.
Don't worry about it. Just brew the recipe and go for consistency.
The recipe will have you use x lbs of various grains and you are supposed to get a specific OG reading after the boil.

Your number may vary from that expected number depending on your system efficiency. You may have gained/lost points from the mash or from how you boiled and the volume of wort you ended up with. As you repeat the process you can narrow down that efficiency and adjust the recipes for consistency using those numbers to adjust future recipes.

I have never even bothered to accurately calculate mine.

 

[deadwolfbones]

My son had one. Ended up putting it by the curb in hopes someone would take it....someone did. Bought a Grainfather. Yeah, some people have been able to make Robobrew work, but there are many instances where not so much.

The board got fried on mine, but I got a V3.1 replacement (with the new screen) and it's working great again. I love it, honestly.

 

[camonick]

3. If I’m willing to spend the $500 should I just go with a robobrew v3 instead? How would this differ from BIAB?

I just recently moved to BIAB from extract and so far I’m sold. Without knowing what size kettle you have, the only 2 upgrades that I would recommend to get you going is a grain mill (cereal killer is $99.99 w/ free shipping from Adventures in Homebrewing https://www.homebrewing.org/Cereal-Killer-Grain-Mill_p_2310.html)
and a BIAB bag (I got mine from @wilserbrewer and it works very well)
Next on that list would be a good digital thermometer and you’re ready to mash grain. If you mill your own grain to a very fine grind, efficiency isn’t something that should cause a lot of heartburn if you can maintain a good mash temp. Good luck!!!
Slainte

 

[Carolina_Matt]

2. Add BIAB bag to kettle and mix grains in well.

When I do this step, I put the bag in first, and then pour in the grains while I mix it. Is there any downside to having the grains in the bag from the get-go, then dropping the bag (full of grains) into the kettle and mixing? It would be quicker and easier to line my bucket with the bag while I'm milling my grains, then just drop it in when I hit ~160 degrees, but I'm thinking there's probably a reason it's not done that way.

 

[McKnuckle]

There is no real downside, as long as 1) the full bag can be lowered without resistance; and 2) the bag is easy to seat while full.

For example, I have two mash tun options, a cooler and a kettle. My full bag bulges too much to lower into the cylindrical cooler mash tun, because the cooler diameter is too narrow. And while the full bag fits my kettle perfectly, it's a PITA to get it seated around the kettle rim when it's full of grain.

If these issues don't affect you, then go for it. Lower it slowly to simulate underletting and possibly avoid doughballs.

 

[HB2 HughBHomeBrew]

Go for it! I just got back to homebrewing after a 20 year (!) hiatus. I was doing all grain with a 3 vessel gravity system on a very tight budget - it was primitive and cheap system but it worked. Anyway, starting all over from scratch but with a little more budget, I decided to go for BIAB - seemed so much simpler and still cheaper than 3-vessel. Have done 3 batches so far - first two I re-created recipes that I had kept that were 20+ years old on my old system. Guess what - yield was the same and the beer is great! I am really happy I decided to go with BIAB for my re-invention as a homebrewer.

As posted above, the only temperature you have to worry about (not counting chilling before you pitch) is the strike temp - easy peasy!
As was also posted - go ahead and squeeze.

Of course, a big change you have to consider going from extract to AG is what it will take to boil - i.e. you need a bigger pot and more heating power etc. if you still want to do the same size batch.

 

[wilserbrewer]

When I do this step, I put the bag in first, and then pour in the grains while I mix it. Is there any downside to having the grains in the bag from the get-go, then dropping the bag (full of grains) into the kettle and mixing? It would be quicker and easier to line my bucket with the bag while I'm milling my grains, then just drop it in when I hit ~160 degrees, but I'm thinking there's probably a reason it's not done that way.

You can add the grain to the bag, then add to the kettle.

One potential downside is that it may be messy, as the BIAB bag will leak the flour while moving it full of grain prior to putting it in the kettle.