Yet Another "Lager won't start" thread

[dstegelman]

I've read a few of these threads and while I'm pretty sure I know what I should be doing, I wanted some opinioins/thoughts from here.

I'm doing my first lager where I actually can control the temperature, I've done a few in the past but they've always fermented above 65 in my house. I brewed Sunday (7/24) and pitched two (probably damaged) packets of liquid yeast. I know I underpitched this a bit, and i KNOW I should have made a starter. Question is, its been more than 3 full days and I checked gravity and I am still at OG. I pitched at probably 70 and then cooled to 50 after that. I've shaken the bucket a bit with no results. Fed up, I moved the fermenter into the house to see if warming it up would bring it back to life.

If this doesn't work after a day or so, what more can I do? I have a packet of ale yeast, but I don't really want to pitch that into my lager. The closest LHBS is over 2.5 hours away.

Any serious thoughts are appreciated.

 

[Yooper]

Not really much you can do at this point except either wait, or pitch the ale yeast.

Lagers do require more stringent temperature control, and I usually pitch a LOT of yeast in them. Often, a 3 GALLON starter isn't out of line! So, you probably underpitched by quite a lot. If your sanitation was good, and the yeast was viable, it should get going eventually without too much trouble.

 

[osagedr]

Often, a 3 GALLON starter isn't out of line!

Holy crap. For how big a batch? Is that a Mr. Malty calculation?

 

[Yooper]

Holy crap. For how big a batch? Is that a Mr. Malty calculation?

Yep! A 5 gallon batch. OG was 1.070, I believe.

 

[bernerbrau]

I'm in the same boat this week. Brewed my Victory Prima clone this weekend, and since I didn't have time to make a starter, I pitched 3 vials of Czech Bud after I got it down to 50F. I smell some CO2 coming out of the carboy, but otherwise there is no evidence of fermentation.

 

[osagedr]

Yep! A 5 gallon batch. OG was 1.070, I believe.

Wow. At that point one really has to consider dry yeast unless you are getting DME for free. I don't think I've done a starter bigger than 4.5 litres.

 

[Fantastical]

Bring it inside and give it a good shake. The yeast just need help getting started. I bet you can get it going without needing to repitch!

 

[Willum]

Not really much you can do at this point except either wait, or pitch the ale yeast.

Lagers do require more stringent temperature control, and I usually pitch a LOT of yeast in them. Often, a 3 GALLON starter isn't out of line! So, you probably underpitched by quite a lot. If your sanitation was good, and the yeast was viable, it should get going eventually without too much trouble.

This is why I started using Saflager W-34/70 almost exclusively. I re-hydrate two (or three if needed) packs on my stir-plate at slow speed for an hour and then pitch cold (50ish). Fermentation usually starts in less then 4 hours.

 

[osagedr]

This is why I started using Saflager W-34/70 almost exclusively...

I love this strain.

 

[dstegelman]

Thanks for the replies folks. Got home from work today and it still hadn't started. Sitting in the mid 60s. I gave it another shake and we'll see what happens. If nothing is going by tommorrow AM, I may pitch the ale and see what happens.

 

[stevehaun]

IMHO, if you are going to underpitch, you should start the fermentation at a higher temperature and then slowly lower it to 50F.

 

[bf514921]

what teperature did you warm it up too?

 

[Willum]

Thanks for the replies folks. Got home from work today and it still hadn't started. Sitting in the mid 60s. I gave it another shake and we'll see what happens. If nothing is going by tommorrow AM, I may pitch the ale and see what happens.

If you can get your hands on some W-34/70. Just re-hydrate it and pitch it cold. I have done it with two failed liquid yeast fermentations (Both had 1 gallon starters) and the beers came out great. It really sucks to make a one gallon++ starter, pitch it and 5 days later no change in gravity.

 

[bv805]

I saygive it more time. I underpitched my first lager and just when I was about to give up after about a week it started fermenting away. I quickly learned my lesson about pitch rates with lagers after that

 

[dstegelman]

what teperature did you warm it up too?

mid 60s.

I can't get my hands on any new yeast very quickly. I did notice a cake on top of the beer this AM, and some pressure in the airlock. I'm still sitting on it, will update with any progress.