Yeast (too old) or (too much)

[sumdumgai]

Have got two packets of Nottingham yeast, one with expiration 3/06 and the other with expiration 9/08. Should I even try the older one? Would it hurt to re-hydrate and pitch both? 5 gal. is target.

Thanks.

 

[Cheeto]

I would use the packet that has not expired.

if this is your first brew just pitch it dry, Nottingham is a very sturdy yeast
you will not need to rehydrate it

you could look in to trying to make a starter of the older packet

Welcome to HBT

 

[sumdumgai]

Thanks for quick reply. Your suggestion to just pitch it dry without rehydration into the fermenter is same as instructions I got, so that's what I'll do.

 

[html034]

I must disagree with the non-rehydration recommendation. Rehydration is quick, easy, and is recommended by:

-the company that makes Nottingham (see back of packet),

-everyones favorite brewing guru John Palmer:
"Dry yeast should be re-hydrated in water before pitching. Often the concentration of sugars in wort is high enough that the yeast can not draw enough water across the cell membranes to restart their metabolism. For best results, re-hydrate 2 packets of dry yeast in warm water (95-105°F) and then proof the yeast by adding some sugar to see if they are still alive after de-hydration and storage."
"Note: Lallemand/Danstar does not recommend proofing after rehydration of their yeast because they have optimized their yeast's nutrional reserves for quick starting in the main wort. Proofing expends some of those reserves."
cited from
http://www.howtobrew.com/section1/chapter6-5.html,

-and homebrewer extraordinaire Jamil Zainasheff:
"Many experts suggest that placing dry yeasts in a starter would just deplete the reserves that the yeast manufacturer worked so hard to build into their product. For dry yeasts, just do a proper rehydration in tap water, do not make a starter. " cited from http://www.mrmalty.com/starter_faq.htm

Also I'd just throw away the 2 years expired pack of yeast. A pack of Nottingham sells for what, like a dollar? just get a new pack.

 

[Brett0424]

Use the expired pack in your boil to act as nutrient for the non-expired pack.

 

[BarleyWater]

Use the expired pack in your boil to act as nutrient for the non-expired pack.

Not a bad idea, throw it in at 10 min.

 

[amoceri7]

I am making a batch of cyser meade. I made the meade for 2 gallons, is a 5 gallon red star packet of yeast too much?

 

[etp777]

Nope, that packet of yeast is just right.

 

[sumdumgai]

Rehydration may have been the right thing to do, but I just scattered the dry yeast over the wort and gave it a good stir. That was yesterday around 6PM. This morning, 6AM, the air-lock is rockin'.

 

[grasshopper1917]

I have never rehydrated yeast and never had a problem with fermentation getting started - that being said still may not be a bad idea - personally from my experience I dont think it matters either way

 

[sumdumgai]

OK. I pitched the yeast, dry, around 6PM Sunday. Right now, Wednesday 1:30 PM (4 1/2 hours short of 3 days), the fermentation has slowed to about a perc every 6 seconds. That sound about right? Nottingham yeast, Brewer's Best Red Ale kit. Room temp around 70, and I've got one of those electric warming belts around the fermenter.

How long should I wait before racking to secondary fermenter?

Thanks.

 

[html034]

OK. I pitched the yeast, dry, around 6PM Sunday. Right now, Wednesday 1:30 PM (4 1/2 hours short of 3 days), the fermentation has slowed to about a perc every 6 seconds. That sound about right? Nottingham yeast, Brewer's Best Red Ale kit. Room temp around 70, and I've got one of those electric warming belts around the fermenter.

How long should I wait before racking to secondary fermenter?

Thanks.

Well I've made 3 or 4 beers with Nottingham (re-hydrated of course), and with each one, fermentation was over in like 36 hours (at least airlock activity was over, and we know that the two are distinct) so that sounds a little long, but I'm sure it doesn't matter at all.

For your temperature, if room temp is 70 degrees, you shouldn't have a heating belt on your fermenter. Did you have that on during fermentation? Because that wouldn't be a good thing. For Nottingham your ideal temp is low to mid 60's, and during ferment the temp of your beer is going to be higher than air temp. So you should have been cooling your fermenter if anything.

As to secondary fermenter, you don't have to do it, many experienced homebrewers don't even bother with that anymore, because it just adds another chance of infection, and it exposes your beer to the air (which isn't good). So I would say don't even bother, just bottle or keg 2 weeks after brewing and you'll be fine. In my limited amount of experience, the more you screw with a beer, the higher the chance you're going to screw it up. But if you want to use a secondary, do it after a week, or a bit more, but no less, because you want to give your yeast a chance to clean up the byproducts of fermentation, like Diacetyl, and they can't do that if you take the beer off the yeast and put it into a secondary. Or at least not nearly as well.

 

[sumdumgai]

Thanks. No more heating belt. I'll wait a couple of more days for the perc to stop. I think I will do the second (clearing) fermentation. The brew will be long gone before it has a chance to get stale from any extra O2.

 

[7Enigma]

Do you happen to know what temp your fermenter was at with that heating belt on?

 

[sumdumgai]

I'm doing this in the basement where daytime temp (Atlanta) stayss around 68. The heating belt is a small one, about 1/2 inch in width, and only gets a little warm. I had been moving it up and down the fermenting bucket. Now it's off. The percs have slowed to about 1 every 20 secs.

 

[splat]

You might want to check the gravity of your beer before transfering to secondary...Check it 3 days in a row to make sure it hasnt changed before transfering to secondary. I secondary all my beers, except cooper kit type beers.

 

[sumdumgai]

I like the idea of keeping things rolling, on about a two week cycle. That should keep my thirst quenched ad infinitum. Batch in progress is Brewer's Best Red Ale. I figure I'll move it to secondary in about 3-4 days. That'll open up my primary fermenter for another wort load. Any suggestions on what I might try next? I'd like to do something in the 5.0 to 5.5 alcohol range, sticking with an ale, but lighter in color than the Red. Also, I am under the impression that unless you go mega quantities ingredients, your expense doesn't change much in sticking with the Brewer's Best kits. That true?

 

[amoceri7]

my cyser meade is stinky. my recipe is a pretty straight forward cyser. read right off a recipe. its only been in the primary for a week. will this change? possibly sour or old ingredients?

 

[mullimat]

I like the idea of keeping things rolling, on about a two week cycle. That should keep my thirst quenched ad infinitum. Batch in progress is Brewer's Best Red Ale. I figure I'll move it to secondary in about 3-4 days. That'll open up my primary fermenter for another wort load. Any suggestions on what I might try next? I'd like to do something in the 5.0 to 5.5 alcohol range, sticking with an ale, but lighter in color than the Red. Also, I am under the impression that unless you go mega quantities ingredients, your expense doesn't change much in sticking with the Brewer's Best kits. That true?

Make sure you are taking hydrometer readings before you transfer to secondary. You want to make sure your beer is finished and you can't just go off of airlock activity to know if it's finished. You don't want to end up bottling an unfinished beer and then have bottle bombs.

 

[7Enigma]

I'm doing this in the basement where daytime temp (Atlanta) stayss around 68. The heating belt is a small one, about 1/2 inch in width, and only gets a little warm. I had been moving it up and down the fermenting bucket. Now it's off. The percs have slowed to about 1 every 20 secs.

Glad to hear it was a plastic bucket and not a glass carboy (much less efficient heat transfer). Probably didn't make the temps rise much, probably much less than the yeast heated up the container anyway.

amoceri7, start a new thread in the mead forum. You'll get much better/more responses there:

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/forumdisplay.php?f=30

 

[sumdumgai]

Thanks. I'll do that. One more question, though, here. I know now you should use dry yeast as soon as possible, but should the dry yeast packet be stored in a refrigerator before use to better preserve it?

 

[7Enigma]

Thanks. I'll do that. One more question, though, here. I know now you should use dry yeast as soon as possible, but should the dry yeast packet be stored in a refrigerator before use to better preserve it?

There's a lot of different ideas on this one. Dry yeast are traditionally stored at room temp, though my LHBS had them refrigerated. Opened dry yeast (say using 1/2 a packet) should be stored in the refrigerator in a sealed container to prevent damage from moisture. So I think is it probably all depends.

Most important thing though is if refrigerating, let it SLOWLY warm back up to room temperature before hydrating in warm water. You don't want to shock the yeast by going from refrigerated temps to 100F.

HTH

 

[sumdumgai]

What should I do? Is this unusual? Brewer's Best Red Ale/Nottingham pitched dry 8 days ago. Never really did get a lot of bubbling at the air lock; just very slow from the beginning. And it is still perculating I'd say about once every half minute. Room's about 68 degrees. Should I still give it a few more days? Take a reading? Pitch more yeast? What? Thanks.

 

[Revvy]

What should I do? Is this unusual? Brewer's Best Red Ale/Nottingham pitched dry 8 days ago. Never really did get a lot of bubbling at the air lock; just very slow from the beginning. And it is still perculating I'd say about once every half minute. Room's about 68 degrees. Should I still give it a few more days? Take a reading? Pitch more yeast? What? Thanks.

Remember, bubbling in the airlock or lack thereof is not a sign of fermentation...The hydrometer is the only way to tell.

If it's been a week then take a reading, and take another one the day after tomorrow, if they are the same then it is ready to move to secondary or to bottles...or you can just leave it for a couple more weeks to let the yeast clean itself up...

 

[html034]

My first thought would be for you to take a reading, but if there is still significant yeast activity going on then you arent going to get an accurate reading. But overall, usually the only solution to these "is fermentation finished?" questions is to take a hydrometer reading. Do that, and depending on your reading, additional steps may be recommended, so post your reading.


damn, revvy beat me to it.

 

[7Enigma]

What should I do? Is this unusual? Brewer's Best Red Ale/Nottingham pitched dry 8 days ago. Never really did get a lot of bubbling at the air lock; just very slow from the beginning. And it is still perculating I'd say about once every half minute. Room's about 68 degrees. Should I still give it a few more days? Take a reading? Pitch more yeast? What? Thanks.

Unless you're in dire need of the fermenter (for another batch) I'd give it 2 more days and then take a reading. I've decided to start a new montra to the 1-2-3 rule, 10days before testing. Won't hurt anything, and it probably will avoid the, "Shucks almost there".

 

[sumdumgai]

1.010 where the bottom of the liquid crosses the scale. Looks like I'm ready to go to either bottle or go to secondary. Think I'll do latter. Thanks.

 

[sumdumgai]

I started secondary fermentation about a week and a half ago. Little small islands of tiny bubbles have formed on the surface. That okay? Guess I should bottle anu day now, right? Thanks.

 

[Thalon]

The bubbles are probably okay. I like to secondary for three weeks just to get the maximum clearing effect. But it looks like it's already been a month since brew day for you. You should be good to go and bottle whenever you want now.

 

[7Enigma]

I started secondary fermentation about a week and a half ago. Little small islands of tiny bubbles have formed on the surface. That okay? Guess I should bottle anu day now, right? Thanks.

Yup, these are normal (had them in both of my batches). You can bottle anytime you want. I think another week in secondary would be a good idea, but its all up to you. If you need the container for the next batch, bottle, otherwise just give it another week and go buy a case of a nice microbrew to hold you over.

 

[sumdumgai]

I bottled my brew two weeks ago and refrigerated a single bottle this past Saturday. Yesterday, I opened it with great anticipation. I expected a clear brew (after the secondary fermentation) but it was kind of merky. Also, the kit I used was a Brewer's Best Red Ale and it tasted a bit like Jamaican Red Stripe. Does that sound right? Thanks.

 

[7Enigma]

Can't comment on the taste but crack open a bottle that has NOT been refrigerated. Basically without using a good wort chiller to crash the proteins out prior to fermenting, or doing a bulk chill in the fermenter for a week or so, it is difficult for us to get really clear beer when chilled. I prefer to drink mine around 65F or so, and so the basement is my fridge and my beers are almost crystal clear. I did put one in the fridge and sure enough when I poured it it looked a bit like unfiltered apple juice.

But frankly I drink for the taste and smell, I could care less what it looks like.

 

[Revvy]

I bottled my brew two weeks ago and refrigerated a single bottle this past Saturday. Yesterday, I opened it with great anticipation. I expected a clear brew (after the secondary fermentation) but it was kind of merky. Also, the kit I used was a Brewer's Best Red Ale and it tasted a bit like Jamaican Red Stripe. Does that sound right? Thanks.

There's a saying around here...and there's good reason for it...

3 weeks @ 70
3 weeks @ 70
3 weeks @ 70

You need to give the beer time to clear/carb and condition and 2 weeks, despite your great anticipation is not enough time. It might be if you're mixing coolaid...but the yeast has it's own agenda and time frame.

Read this....

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/showpost.php?p=558191&postcount=101

 

[sumdumgai]

Thanks for the advice. I'll wait another couple of weeks for it at room temperature (although here in Atlanta, in the basement, it's between 65 and 75). Then I'll refrigerate another two. It's hard to wait, though.