Yeast problem. i think.

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DuffManMississippi

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I have used whitelabs yeast for ever kit i have ever ordered . Oldcastle brown ale - contaminated horrible yeast smell and taste dumped after 10 weeks in the bottle. Abita Purple haze clone and a oatmeal stout both from the same company both ordered at the same time. we always buy the best yeast available which happens to always be whitelabs liquid yeast. Problem , the beer looks good smells good and is well carbonated and aged in the bottles and they still have a yeast taste to both beers. the beers taste good for the most part but the yeast is over powering all of the good notes of the beer should i switch to dry yeast . is white labs adding a off flavor or what? plz help me i will anwser all quetions to the best of my ability.
 

ISUBrew79

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I have used whitelabs yeast for ever kit i have ever ordered . Oldcastle brown ale - contaminated horrible yeast smell and taste dumped after 10 weeks in the bottle. Abita Purple haze clone and a oatmeal stout both from the same company both ordered at the same time. we always buy the best yeast available which happens to always be whitelabs liquid yeast. Problem , the beer looks good smells good and is well carbonated and aged in the bottles and they still have a yeast taste to both beers. the beers taste good for the most part but the yeast is over powering all of the good notes of the beer should i switch to dry yeast . is white labs adding a off flavor or what? plz help me i will anwser all quetions to the best of my ability.
Can you provide any more detailed information? You might want to provide the recipe for each of the unsatisfactory batches. Also, did you make yeast starters for these batches? What were the fermentation temperatures? The more specific information you can provide, the more likely we will be able to help you pinpoint the source of the off flavors in your brews.
 
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DuffManMississippi

DuffManMississippi

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Pappers_

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One part of your question is whether there is something wrong with White Labs yeast - the answer is no. I use White Labs in 3/4 of my beers and ciders with no problems.

As an experiment, you might consider using a high quality dry yeast with your next batch. Fermentis makes US-05 and US-04 and Danstar makes Nottingham and Windsor - all are top quality yeast. Dry yeast is easier to use, in that it takes less effort to pitch sufficient numbers of happy and healthy yeast than with liquid yeast.

Cheers!
 

Pappers_

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Your fermentation temps are higher than recommended for most yeasts - low 60s up to 68 as a maximum would be best for most yeasts.
 

strat_thru_marshall

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Your fermentation temps are higher than recommended for most yeasts - low 60s up to 68 as a maximum would be best for most yeasts.
Based on what you've told us so far, this is a good answer. Anything above 70 is going to result in some flavors you might not want if you're using normal american or english ale strains. I have used White Labs in 95% of my batches and have had great results. They make an excellent product.

Hows your sanitation? Insufficient sanitation can lead to some nasty flavors. What temp did you store your bottles at for the 10 weeks you mentioned?
 
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DuffManMississippi

DuffManMississippi

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I stored them at the same temp. the yeast and the beer both said to keep the temps between 70-80 i believe or somewhere in that range, but colder you say hmm lol damn mississippi. well i am going to try dry yeast for my next batch and see if i have the same problem and btw we are using diluted bleach water in a giant tub and we run everything through that first. should we change that and use star san or onestep?
 

ISUBrew79

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hmm they where both partial mashes from austin home brew.

http://www.austinhomebrew.com/product_info.php?cPath=178_452_42_159&products_id=312

http://www.austinhomebrew.com/product_info.php?cPath=178_452_43_245&products_id=10170

we followed the directions to the T.
Used whitelabs for both beers.

they both fermented at about 70-80 degree's. F.

Both had great starts in less than 5 hours .

No starter kits but we used yeast fuel for both and i used a alcohol booster on the stout.
Are the fermentation temperatures you mention the ambient temperature of the room? If so, I suspect that the fermentation temperatures may be too high.

For the stout, it looks like the recommended yeast strain was an English strain. Also, with the addition of the alcohol booster, your brew was a fairly high gravity, probably about 1.060. If you only pitched one vial of White Labs yeast, you likely didn't pitch enough yeast. You can get away with pitching a single vial into lower gravity brews, but most of us would recommend making a yeast starter prior to brew day for a 1.060 OG brew. In my experience, the use of an English yeast strain in a ~1.060 wort fermented over 70 degrees F resulted in a beer with a lot of esters and higher alcohols (very fruity and solvent-like flavors).

While the Purple Haze clone recipe is a lower gravity beer, I also suspect that fermentation temperature may be the primary cause of off flavors in it as well.

Also, what process do you use for sanitizing your fermenters, racking and bottling equipment? It is possible that contamination may be an issue, too.
 

ISUBrew79

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I stored them at the same temp. the yeast and the beer both said to keep the temps between 70-80 i believe or somewhere in that range, but colder you say hmm lol damn mississippi. well i am going to try dry yeast for my next batch and see if i have the same problem and btw we are using diluted bleach water in a giant tub and we run everything through that first. should we change that and use star san or onestep?
I highly recommend Star San. It doesn't require rinsing like bleach does, and is just as effective when used as recommended.
 

beninan

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I stored them at the same temp. the yeast and the beer both said to keep the temps between 70-80 i believe or somewhere in that range, but colder you say hmm lol damn mississippi.
Swamp cooler!! Rubbermaid (or equivalent) container than you can fit your fermenter in, fill the container with water to equal approximately they same hight of beer in the fermenter, and swap out a couple frozen water bottles to keep the temp down. Or, if you are rich a fortunate enough, put it in a temp controlled refrigerator.
 
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DuffManMississippi

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we clean them out with bleach water quite vigorously . we have the fermenter s sitting in swamp coolers , at about 75.f. on average. they sat for ten days as recommended and moved them to secondary s. another 2 weeks in there and bottled. btw the stout over flowed lol and we caught it early the next morning when the foam was still coming out of the top into the water we cleaned the bubbler and put a blow off hose on there going into a half gallon jug with water in it and didnt seem to have any problems after that but that sucker was going nuts. I also let the yeast sit out for 24 hours at the correct temp in order to let them wake up so i dont know i tried but i am kinda getting deterred. the beers seem to be ok physically i dont think its contaminated my first batch was most def. contaminated and these two batches dont look sick like my first one did. its just the beers have a yeast flavor and you think it might have something to do with the temp, so thats where i will start first that and changing my sanitation methods.
 

strat_thru_marshall

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and you think it might have something to do with the temp, so thats where i will start first that and changing my sanitation methods.
Temperature controlled fermentation and good sanitation with a no-rinse sanitizer like star-san are two of the best things you can do to see immediate, drastic improvement in your beer. At least they were for me
 
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DuffManMississippi

DuffManMississippi

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Swamp cooler!! Rubbermaid (or equivalent) container than you can fit your fermenter in, fill the container with water to equal approximately they same hight of beer in the fermenter, and swap out a couple frozen water bottles to keep the temp down. Or, if you are rich a fortunate enough, put it in a temp controlled refrigerator.
not rich but i use 2x 35 gallon garbage cans from the dollar store lol they come with lids so it helps keep the light out and the smell of beer brewing in lol. i love being a red neck.
 

beninan

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not rich but i use 2x 35 gallon garbage cans from the dollar store lol they come with lids so it helps keep the light out and the smell of beer brewing in lol. i love being a red neck.
if it works, it works. You said they were kept an average of 75 degrees? Thats still a little higher than I like to see. I like to hit an average of 65 degrees, with a max of 70 on those days I forget to swap out the ice water bottles.
 
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DuffManMississippi

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ok tighten the temp control . (T)Check.
Switch to Star San , (T)Check.

now should i use dry yeast ?????
 

strat_thru_marshall

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ok tighten the temp control . (T)Check.
Switch to Star San , (T)Check.

now should i use dry yeast ?????
You can, but you might think about changing one thing at a time so you know what effect each change has. If you change temp control, sanitizer, and yeast and suddenly the beer is great it will be hard to tell where the original problem was...
 

beninan

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you can still use liquid yeast, there is nothing wrong with it. Liquid yeast usually has a significantly lower amount of viable yeast cells per vial compared to a dry yeast sachet. Dry yeasts are usually designed to re-hydrate, then pitch. Liquid yeast are ok to just pitch if the gravity of your wort isn't too high (like above 1.050 for instance). If it is too high, a yeast starter should be made the day before, and then the yeast starter should be pitched, so there are more viable cells. It would not hurt to make a yeast starter for every batch using liquid yeast however.
 

ISUBrew79

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ok tighten the temp control . (T)Check.
Switch to Star San , (T)Check.

now should i use dry yeast ?????
You might want to give dry yeast a try for a few batches. Safale US-05 and Danstar Nottingham are two pretty clean-fermenting dry yeasts, and it will be easier for you to get the proper amount of yeast into your brews.
 

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now should i use dry yeast ?????
if you don't make a starter when you use liquid yeast, then yes, I would experiment with a good quality dry yeast. I regularly use Nottingham in my ciders and will be using US-05 this weekend.

If you are having troubles with your beers, good quality dry yeast is easier and produces great results.
 

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if you don't make a starter when you use liquid yeast, then yes, I would experiment with a good quality dry yeast. I regularly use Nottingham in my ciders and will be using US-05 this weekend.

If you are having troubles with your beers, good quality dry yeast is easier and produces great results.
Pappers, you dawg! How'd you get your name back? Been off for a while, so probably missed it. NOW, back to your regularly scheduled peogram.......:D
 
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DuffManMississippi

DuffManMississippi

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some damn good advice on here i was thinking of doing a nice kit to add this jar of spring honey too any recommendations on what i should do for my next batch or should i start over with the older ones and find out what went wrong.
 
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