Wiring pid ssr questions

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evan5159

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M trying to build my own control box for my HLT element. Element is 5500 watt. I understand that it only draws 23 amps but I bought a 40 amp ssr/ pid combo on amazon. The diagram on the pid says 90-260v on the pins where the power is connected. Does this mean that I bring all power in there? Both red and black connect there? If not then where? I plan on putting a common ground bus bar, shoul I put neutral and power buses too? And this is dumb but how to I connect the heat sink and bus/buses to the box? Tiny carriage bolts through the bottom or what. I'm sorry for the stupid questions. Total noob to electronics, I'm a bricklayer not an engineer.
 

williamsdm1111

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I just wired mine in last week. It was a mypin ta4 pid. If that's the same one I can send you some pics of my connections and control box. Pm me.
 
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evan5159

evan5159

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williamsdm1111 said:
I just wired mine in last week. It was a mypin ta4 pid. If that's the same one I can send you some pics of my connections and control box. Pm me.
Yes same one
 
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evan5159

evan5159

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Pj, I posted the link above. I will be bringing power from a 30a plug. I have a friend who is an electrician who is going to make a "cord" using 10-3 romex with the appropriate plug in. I will then run said wire into the project box. There lies my question. Where does the incoming power go? I understand I need to ground it somewhere so the ground will go to a bus bar. I also understand that wires connect the SSR to the pid in the appropriate pins. As for the element power, I plan to put a 30a outlet in the project box. I plant to connect a dryer cord to the element and plug into said outlet. Also how can I break 240v into 110v to run an additional switched 110v outlet to run my pump. And maybe another switch to run a pc fan over the SSR. I hope this is more specific
 

P-J

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Sorry. I'm not familiar with that PID in any way. With that and the minimal info provide for the PID on the site posted, I cannot help you. So sorry.

P-J
 

kenh

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Click your link. It is not readable. (IMHO)

Sorry to all... Count me out of this situation.
I just did - it brings up a pdf file that looks just like the instruction sheet that came with the MYPIN TA4-SSR PID.
 

ineedit

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I have the same PID and SSR. I've been running it for about two months and it works great. The wiring diagram I used for mine came from this instructable. http://www.instructables.com/id/Electric-brewing-system/

Since I don't have a pump in didn't bother with a 110 but I did add a double pole switch to turn off the element at the panel.

I can get you some photos of the inside of the panel if you think it will help.
 

Bobby_M

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M trying to build my own control box for my HLT element. Element is 5500 watt. I understand that it only draws 23 amps but I bought a 40 amp ssr/ pid combo on amazon. The diagram on the pid says 90-260v on the pins where the power is connected. Does this mean that I bring all power in there? Both red and black connect there? If not then where? I plan on putting a common ground bus bar, shoul I put neutral and power buses too? And this is dumb but how to I connect the heat sink and bus/buses to the box? Tiny carriage bolts through the bottom or what. I'm sorry for the stupid questions. Total noob to electronics, I'm a bricklayer not an engineer.

I'm going to first suggest that you get your electrician friend to explain a bit to you about how 240v works at a high level.

This is not advise, just some general tips.. An SSR is going switch the flow of current on ONE of your hot lines. In most simple terms, one hot (say the red) would go to the element directly and the other hot (black) goes to the SSR power terminal and then out (black again) to the other terminal on the element. It is however best practices to also put an actual 2 pole switch in the box to make positive disconnect on both hots in case the SSR fails and if you want to be absolutely sure the PID isn't going to try firing the element.
 

rgauthier20420

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I have the same PID and SSR. I've been running it for about two months and it works great. The wiring diagram I used for mine came from this instructable. http://www.instructables.com/id/Electric-brewing-system/

Since I don't have a pump in didn't bother with a 110 but I did add a double pole switch to turn off the element at the panel.

I can get you some photos of the inside of the panel if you think it will help.
I'm ordering the exact PID/SSR combo tonight, so some pictures would be awesome! I'll be following this thread to ask any questions and see how the OP has done things instead of opening a new one with the exact topic.

OP, you make progress please let us know. Thanks and good luck.
 

Bobby_M

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Pj, I posted the link above. I will be bringing power from a 30a plug. I have a friend who is an electrician who is going to make a "cord" using 10-3 romex with the appropriate plug in. I will then run said wire into the project box. There lies my question. Where does the incoming power go? I understand I need to ground it somewhere so the ground will go to a bus bar. I also understand that wires connect the SSR to the pid in the appropriate pins. As for the element power, I plan to put a 30a outlet in the project box. I plant to connect a dryer cord to the element and plug into said outlet. Also how can I break 240v into 110v to run an additional switched 110v outlet to run my pump. And maybe another switch to run a pc fan over the SSR. I hope this is more specific
Romex really isn't meant to be used as a portable power cord. You want SJ or SO flexible cord that uses stranded conductors.
 

rgauthier20420

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Romex really isn't meant to be used as a portable power cord. You want SJ or SO flexible cord that uses stranded conductors.
Bobby, would you suggest buying a 14 gauge extension cord then and just cut one end off for the line into the box and then 14/3 romex inside the box is ok?
 

ineedit

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I used 10/4 stranded from gfic to the panel and then 10/3 stranded to the element. Inside the control box 10 gauge copper.
 

mattd2

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I just did - it brings up a pdf file that looks just like the instruction sheet that came with the MYPIN TA4-SSR PID.
I think what P-J might of been refering to is the hard to read chinenglish instructions :D
My advice to the OP is to get your electrician freind to help you put this together. Not to sound condesending but it can/will kill you if you get it wrong! But if he was really planning on using building wire for an extension cord, maybe repost his plan on here before completing it.
You should be able to generally follow any of P-J's wiring diagrams, just make sure that you check/double-check you have the correct pins on your PID (and the correct model, i.e. one with a 5Vdc output for SSR not a relay output)
 
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evan5159

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I did not mean building wire. I mean stranded like what one would buy to repair an air compressor. I appreciate all the help.
 

Bobby_M

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I'm only using 120V, so I don't believe that means 24 amps right? Less than 15 AMPS right? Please correct me if I'm wrong, I'm buying my wires today :rockin:
Sorry, I got confused with the OP who was using a 5500 watt element. If you use 120v, it depends on the element wattage. A 2000w element will be just over 15 amps so it would have to be 12gauge wire. If you're using a 1500w then yes, a 14/3 extension cord would be fine.
 

ineedit

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rgauthier20420 said:
I'm ordering the exact PID/SSR combo tonight, so some pictures would be awesome! I'll be following this thread to ask any questions and see how the OP has done things instead of opening a new one with the exact topic. OP, you make progress please let us know. Thanks and good luck.
Took a few photos this morning but must say it is pretty hard to follow..

image-3273774467.jpg


I decided to do a drawing as well.

image-3258990771.jpg

Hope everything makes sense. The switch is a DPST used to turn off the power to the element.
 

rgauthier20420

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Thanks for the pics. Once I've got the box and parts mounted and get to the wiring, I might be asking a couple questions here.

Bobby, the threads has gotten jumbled because of my questions (sorry OP!). I'll be using part of a 25ft 14/3 extension cord to run into the box and the rest of the cord for the inside wiring. I've got a 12x12x6 box I'm picking up to I don't think I'll have any issues with space.
 

ineedit

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rgauthier20420 said:
Thanks for the pics. Once I've got the box and parts mounted and get to the wiring, I might be asking a couple questions here. Bobby, the threads has gotten jumbled because of my questions (sorry OP!). I'll be using part of a 25ft 14/3 extension cord to run into the box and the rest of the cord for the inside wiring. I've got a 12x12x6 box I'm picking up to I don't think I'll have any issues with space.
No problem. I noticed from your previous post that you are using a 110 circuit. My setup is 220. The PID wring should be the same but the element would be different.
 
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evan5159

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Ok, one of the hot legs goes to the pid (fused). The neutral also goes into pid. One hot goes directly to my element( via two pole switch intro my outlet in my control box). Is that correct? I am sorry but I want to be sure before I run this thing. I assume neutral will carry through ssr
 

ineedit

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evan5159 said:
Ok, one of the hot legs goes to the pid (fused). The neutral also goes into pid. One hot goes directly to my element( via two pole switch intro my outlet in my control box). Is that correct? I am sorry but I want to be sure before I run this thing. I assume neutral will carry through ssr
Take a look here. http://www.instructables.com/id/Electric-brewing-system/step6/Understand-the-wiring/
The second drawing is what I used with the only difference being the PID. I'm much more comfortable helping with it as opposed to the 220 circuit. If you don't have a good basic knowledge of electricity a lot of bad things can happen. If you aren't 100% sure of your wring skills DON'T do it yourself. Get an electrician to help. Not trying to discourage you but wouldn't feel right without a warning.

You will notice from on his circuit that he splits one of the hots to the PID and the DPST. From there it goes to the element. The other goes through the SSR and again to the DPST switch. The ground from his 4 wire circuit goes directly to the element. Since there's no pump the only thing the neutral is used for is to complete the 110 to the PID.

The Auberins PID uses pin 9 & 10 for power and the Mypin uses 1 & 2. The SSR controls on the Aberins is 7 & 8 with the Mypin using 3 & 4. I used the same temperature control listed in the instructable. It is wired to the Mypin PID using pins 7, 8, 9 & 10. That temp controller has three colored wires. The two same color go to pins 7 & 10. The odd color goes to pin 8 that has a jumper connecting it to pin 9.
 
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evan5159

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My electrician friend is the one who questioned it. But thank you
 
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Also how much clearance is needed atop the SSR? I've got about half inch with it sitting on the heat sink. Should I or could I lay it on its side for more air from the fan hits it?
 

ineedit

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evan5159 said:
Also how much clearance is needed atop the SSR? I've got about half inch with it sitting on the heat sink. Should I or could I lay it on its side for more air from the fan hits it?
Can't say I know for sure but 1/2 inch seems kind of close. I think you want as much room around it as possible for better air flow. Maybe someone else has some advise on placement.

In my case it is on the side with the heat sink sticking outside the top of the panel. I don't have a fan but even during the boil it only gets slightly warm.


image-4132676856.jpg

image-2783160437.jpg
 

ineedit

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Oh. Don't forget the thermal grease between the SSR and the heat sink. I've read a lot of posts where people have fired their SSR in only a couple minutes.
 
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mattd2

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My electrician friend is the one who questioned it. But thank you
In simple terms you have to provide:
1) Power to the PID - either 120Vac or 240Vac
2) Power to the element - 240Vac: One leg runs through the SSR and it is recommended that both legs run through some sort of mechnical isolation (Double pole switch or contactor).
3) A low voltage 5Vdc control wire between the PID SSR output and the SSR input - make sure you get the polarity correct.

You will need to check that:
1) You have the correct type of output for you PID = 5Vdc pulse/PWM/digital
2) All switches/relays are rated for the voltage and current you are putting through them.

Hope that helps your sparky freind.
 

jeffmeh

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Can't say I know for sure but 1/2 inch seems kind of close. I think you want as much room around it as possible for better air flow. Maybe someone else has some advise on placement.

In my case it is on the side with the heat sink sticking outside the top of the panel. I don't have a fan but even during the boil it only gets slightly warm.


View attachment 162803

View attachment 162804
I would think that with your side mounting that you would dissipate heat more efficiently with the heat sink fins running vertically, so that the heat can easily rise away from it. That said, if you are not having any problems with overheating, I wouldn't worry about it.
 

ineedit

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jeffmeh said:
I would think that with your side mounting that you would dissipate heat more efficiently with the heat sink fins running vertically, so that the heat can easily rise away from it. That said, if you are not having any problems with overheating, I wouldn't worry about it.
Unfortunately the panel is not deep enough to mount the heat sink vertically. I will keep in in mind if I decide to move to something larger.

Thanks.
 

jeffmeh

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Unfortunately the panel is not deep enough to mount the heat sink vertically. I will keep in in mind if I decide to move to something larger.

Thanks.
Understood. I was looking at a rectangular heat sink, but have now decided to go with a square one so that I can orient the fins in either direction. That enables one to orient the fins so that they run vertically when the control panel is laid horizontally on a surface, and it is moot when one mounts the control panel on the wall. This assumes the heat sink is mounted in typical fashion on the top surface of the box when mounted vertically.
 

rgauthier20420

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All built! Thanks to everyone!
Let's see some pics! I've got all the parts together and will be starting the positioning and cutting of the box once my dremel gets here.

I'm still looking for some local assist/guidance for the wiring though.
 
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evan5159

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Ok so, I originally wired according to pj's diagram. Everything came on but pid was screwy, reading like 553. So I tried to figure out why. Watched [ame]http://youtu.be/KtaLrs8ZVSo[/ame] and I just put a jumper on the pid at sensor and my ssr literally blew up in my face and tripped my MAIN in my panel. So wtf
 

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