Will this cheap 3500 watt induction burner work?

[Hello]

Remember that whole forgiveness/permission thing?

I think he was referring to safety and not asking to put holes in walls.
A 20 amp breaker is perfect. You can indeed take a 120 and remove that putting a 240 double breaker in its place. Also like it was said, 12 gauge is fine but for me the pros installed something more due to run being 40' to my panel.

 

[IslandLizard]

I think he was referring to safety and not asking to put holes in walls.
A 20 amp breaker is perfect. You can indeed take a 120 and remove that putting a 240 double breaker in its place. Also like it was said, 12 gauge is fine but for me the pros installed something more due to run being 40' to my panel.

Maybe it's just me, am I missing something here? I was making a play on Pink Floyd.

Even at 40' 12ga is sufficient for 20 Amps unless the ambient temps are really high. Using a thicker wire may help in easy future-proofing, say to make it 30A instead. Running 10/3 wg which is suitable for a 30A circuit, like dryers, or small sub panels, providing you with a 120V feed as well, with the included neutral.

 

[AnOldUR]

I have two dedicated 20 amp lines but think they are just 20 amp 120 breakers think wire is 12g not sure if i can change breaker and outlet and be good.

My only word of caution would be to be absolutely 100% sure that there is only the single 120V outlet on the circuit. It’s not that uncommon for someone to branch a circuit off a line and not mark the panel.

 

[IslandLizard]

My only word of caution would be to be absolutely 100% sure that there is only the single 120V outlet on the circuit. It’s not that uncommon for someone to branch a circuit off a line and not mark the panel.

You're so right!
Dedicated doesn't always mean it wasn't hacked into at some point.

I'm still figuring out the wiring in my home. Previous owner patched left and wrong, never right. There are also a few dummy switches around...

 

[Hello]

Maybe it's just me, am I missing something here? I was making a play on Pink Floyd.

My bad. I probably missed it.
Even at 40' 12ga is sufficient for 20 Amps unless the ambient temps are really high. Using a thicker wire may help in easy future-proofing, say to make it 30A instead. Running 10/3 wg which is suitable for a 30A circuit, like dryers, or small sub panels, providing you with a 120V feed as well, with the included neutral.

You're right but I think for purposes of just making sure the company that did my install did a good job, they did use a higher gauge wire. I have to pull the invoice to see what they used but I know they mentioned it. It is under the house, crawl space, in a humid and hot climate.

My only word of caution would be to be absolutely 100% sure that there is only the single 120V outlet on the circuit. It’s not that uncommon for someone to branch a circuit off a line and not mark the panel.

This for sure.
I had one that I actually thought could be used in that manner, turns out when the panel was removed it was no where near safe to do that. Sometimes even blowing $300 on a silly plug for a hobby is worth every penny.

 

[AnOldUR]

Got a steamer rack to use as a false bottom in the mail yesterday. It's a magnetic grade of stainless, but it sits on a ring 1¼” from the base so it shouldn’t change the way the induction works. I wanted to test it first, so boiled up some water this morning.

Question for you guys with the efficiency spread sheets. It took 70 minutes to get from 52 to 210 on the pots dial thermometer. In another couple of minutes it was boiling. This was with 9 gallons of water at 3500 watts with the lid on. What efficiency does that work out to?

 

[geoffm33]

Got a steamer rack to use as a false bottom in the mail yesterday. It's a magnetic grade of stainless, but it sits on a ring 1¼” from the base so it shouldn’t change the way the induction works. I wanted to test it first, so boiled up some water this morning.

Question for you guys with the efficiency spread sheets. It took 70 minutes to get from 52 to 210 on the pots dial thermometer. In another couple of minutes it was boiling. This was with 9 gallons of water at 3500 watts with the lid on. What efficiency does that work out to?

85.22%

http://www.geoffmanning.com/homebrew/wattage-efficiency-calculator/

 

[MerlinWerks]

Got a steamer rack to use as a false bottom in the mail yesterday. It's a magnetic grade of stainless, but it sits on a ring 1¼” from the base so it shouldn’t change the way the induction works. I wanted to test it first, so boiled up some water this morning.

Out of curiosity, why did you add the "false bottom" to your rig?

 

[geoffm33]

Out of curiosity, why did you add the "false bottom" to your rig?

I am planning to get one so I can fire the burner during the mash without fear of scorching the bag/grain.

 

[MerlinWerks]

I am planning to get one so I can fire the burner during the mash without fear of scorching the bag/grain.

Thanks Geoff,

I'm not trying to be a wise-a** here, but do we know if that is a concern with the induction set-up. I asked earlier about this, but no one commented.

 

[geoffm33]

Thanks Geoff,

I'm not trying to be a wise-a** here, but do we know if that is a concern with the induction set-up. I asked earlier about this, but no one commented.

You ask a great question, well apparently twice you've asked

Last night I undershot my strike temp and just pulled the bag up a few inches for a minute while the temp rose.

I don't know if it's a concern. Hopefully we can get confirmation.

 

[sammy33]

I have not experienced any scorching of the bag when applying heat to the mash. I am, however, usually stirring when I do apply heat to distribute the heat.

Keep in mind my system is 1800 watts. Perhaps on the 3500 watt units this is more of a concern?

 

[sumbrewindude]

I think he was referring to safety and not asking to put holes in walls.
A 20 amp breaker is perfect. You can indeed take a 120 and remove that putting a 240 double breaker in its place. Also like it was said, 12 gauge is fine but for me the pros installed something more due to run being 40' to my panel.

Oh! Totally not what I was inferring to - I was talking about me and my new purchase last night.

Got the shipping confirmation this morning!

:rockin:

Sammy/Geoff - I really don't think that the bag will have an issue with scorching in an induction setup. Consider that nylon bags typically need temps in excess of 400F to melt, which are completely capable in a waterheater element style pot, or even on some of those jet gas systems as you're putting a ton of BTU's on a very small area and waiting for the rest of the water to heat up.

With the induction setup, the whole bottom of the pot is in heating source, so it's much broader, allowing for a more even and distributed application to the water/bag.

I'd think we're in the clear AFA the bags go....

 

[geoffm33]

Thanks sumbrewindude!

Question for All:

When I turn on my IC3500 with my Bayou Classic 1044 the bottom immediately buckles as the magnetic field kicks in. If you look at where the cooktop surface meets the pot, just the middle 7 or so inches is touching the unit. It was sitting completely flat prior to turning it on.

I imagine this is due to the thin makeup of the BC pots, and may not happen on thinker or tri-ply pot bottom pots.

Anyone else notice this?

Any efficiency downsides?

Looking at AnOldUR's 85% efficiency compared to my 74% I am looking at all options

 

[sumbrewindude]

NP, Geoff!

AFA the pot buckling, I'm actually surprised that the pot doesn't concave in with 56# of water in it! I know it's been mentioned on here multiple times that thinner pots actually have better transfer than the thicker based pots (the difference of course being that the thicker pots actually have better heat distribution over the thinner pots), and as both of your pots are of the same gauge/style I don't think it's a pot design thing.

I'd put my money on the insulation.

OldUR's using a neoprene sleeve, and not reflectix. Neoprene is a fantastic insulator, and traps/holds heat really well - think about a set of 5mm duck waders or a wetsuit. Reflectix was designed as radiant barrier, like those mylar space blankets. Good for reflecting heat, but not so hot at holding it.

I'd try experimenting with some closed cell foam, like a cheap blue camping 0.5" mat from wallyworld (1.7R) and see where that get's you - it'll have a greater insulation value than the Reflectix (typically 1.2R).

 

[sammy33]

Remember that whole forgiveness/permission thing?

Oh! Totally not what I was inferring to - I was talking about me and my new purchase last night.

Got the shipping confirmation this morning!

:rockin:

Awesome! Sounds like you have "something" on the way?

 

[AnOldUR]

With the induction setup, the whole bottom of the pot is in heating source, so it's much broader, allowing for a more even and distributed application to the water/bag. I'd think we're in the clear AFA the bags go....

I don't know for sure, but I don't think this is true. When you look into the boiling pot with just water in it, you can see that the bubbles are coming from a ring that's about 6" in diameter and 3/4" wide. I'm guessing that all the heat that's creating the boil is concentrated in that area.

A while back, I was boiling a rye beer and the burner timed out and shut off. I didn’t notice it right away. By the time I got back the break material had settled to the bottom of the pot. I started it back up, but after I drained the pot I found that I had a black scorched ring on the bottom of the pot and the beer ended up being a dumper. (Word of warning. If the burner goes off, stir like crazy before putting it back on.)

To me it’s not worth the risk of losing a batch of beer and destroying a bag.

 

[sumbrewindude]

I don't know for sure, but I don't think this is true. When you look into the boiling pot with just water in it, you can see that the bubbles are coming from a ring that's about 6" in diameter and 3/4" wide. I'm guessing that all the heat that's creating the boil is concentrated in that area.

A while back, I was boiling a rye beer and the burner timed out and shut off. I didn’t notice it right away. By the time I got back the break material had settled to the bottom of the pot. I started it back up, but after I drained the pot I found that I had a black scorched ring on the bottom of the pot and the beer ended up being a dumper. (Word of warning. If the burner goes off, stir like crazy before putting it back on.)

To me it’s not worth the risk of losing a batch of beer and destroying a bag.

But what I'm reading there, and with everyone that has this type of issue, is that the proteins from the break material are settling in the bottom of the pot in addition to whatever trub is floating around in there. That particulate is going to scorch as boiling heat is applied, it needs to be in suspension.

The bag is only going to be present during mashing, at temps around 170F or so, and at that temp the particulate may be resting, but will slowly be brought up to temp and put into suspension.

TL;DR - One the break is in suspension, don't kill the heat - if you do, the particulate needs to be put back into suspension as heat is applied.

 

[Spurge]

I have just moved into an apartment, so have been researching going electric. Was tossing up induction, or adding an element to my Stout kettle. It is a shame I can't use the Stout kettle for induction, but it doesn't have a flat bottom.

So I'm a complete electrical newb. I moved my oven out of the way and below is what my plug looks like. I figure with it being 240V I should be ok with an Avantco IC3500. With the Avantco having a nema 6-20p plug, is there an adaptor that I could get to go to the 4 plug? I hate the idea of doing any wiring myself. I understand fire, but electricity is a scary mystery.

 

[IslandLizard]

I have just moved into an apartment, so have been researching going electric. Was tossing up induction, or adding an element to my Stout kettle. It is a shame I can't use the Stout kettle for induction, but it doesn't have a flat bottom.

So I'm a complete electrical newb. I moved my oven out of the way and below is what my plug looks like. I figure with it being 240V I should be ok with an Avantco IC3500. With the Avantco having a nema 6-20p plug, is there an adaptor that I could get to go to the 4 plug? I hate the idea of doing any wiring myself. I understand fire, but electricity is a scary mystery.

I think using a (50A) range outlet was advised against in an earlier post. Do you have a clothes dryer outlet? They are 30A and closer to the 14-15 amps the IC3500 requires.

 

[Hello]

Got a steamer rack to use as a false bottom in the mail yesterday. It's a magnetic grade of stainless, but it sits on a ring 1¼” from the base so it shouldn’t change the way the induction works. I wanted to test it first, so boiled up some water this morning.

Question for you guys with the efficiency spread sheets. It took 70 minutes to get from 52 to 210 on the pots dial thermometer. In another couple of minutes it was boiling. This was with 9 gallons of water at 3500 watts with the lid on. What efficiency does that work out to?

Can you post your false bottom? I ordered this one from Williams Sonoma. It was in stock when ordered and suddenly backordered. It has been 2 weeks and still not shipped so I am happy to order something else. I did not consider magnetic for the FB, just that I wanted to ensure the bag isn't sitting on the bottom. I got it so I could mash out if I wanted. I used a roasting rack, oval and about 8" wide by about 11" long. It didn't seem to affect getting up to strike temp, that I know of.

 

[Jpartschjr]

Spurge

I to had this same situation. There are several here willing to build a "pigtail" for you. It would be a range plug that goes into a sub panel with the proper breaker, then to 6-20r.

Materials to do this on your own are in The 100$ range. At least to do it safe and properly. The. U figure their time. Both locally and from forum members quotes came in around 175-225.

Pm me if you would like the information of those that offered to make this.

It is both possible, safe (if done properly) and within code (for my area) if done properly.


Sent from my iPhone using Home Brew

 

[AnOldUR]

Can you post your false bottom?

Here's the one that I bought. It's a little bigger than the one that you linked to. I have the 62 quart Bayou pot that's 15.5 inches in diameter. The steamer claims to be plated stainless steel. I'm a little nervous that there was a little discoloration after the boil, but it did clean up. It is a food steamer and I would think it would be food safe. I'll look into the Williams Sonoma rack just in case.

 

[Dotay]

I don't claim to know code, but agree with what's been said about the circuit breaker being rated to protect the wiring to the receptacle, not the device plugged into the receptacle. And that you can plug in anything drawing up to the breakers rated amperage. Here’s a company that sells the type of adapter that you’re looking for.

EVSEadapters.com

I just bought one of these burners and I need help figuring out how to wire the cord adapter. My dryer has the three prong 10-30 style so I purchased a female 6-20 and a male 10-30 plug. I've got a 12 gauge 3 wire cord with black, white, and green.

Which wires to where?

This website sells the adapter with my specific plug that I need at the following link.

http://www.evseadapters.com/index.php?route=product/product&path=62&product_id=74

 

[Spurge]

I think using a (50A) range outlet was advised against in an earlier post. Do you have a clothes dryer outlet? They are 30A and closer to the 14-15 amps the IC3500 requires.

Thanks for the post. Unfortunately I can't get to my dryer plug to even check it.

I did find a place online that looks to make a pigtail that would work for the plugs, but if the amp difference is a problem I'm a bit stumped.

Here's a screenshot from the website that does custom pigtails.

 

[jeffmeh]

If a 20a appliance is plugged into a circuit protected by a 30a breaker, then nothing is protecting the appliance's wiring, unless said appliance has its own 20a breaker or fuse.

 

[AnOldUR]

Looks to me like I see a UL listing tag on that product?

 

[IslandLizard]

Here's the one that I bought. It's a little bigger than the one that you linked to. I have the 62 quart Bayou pot that's 15.5 inches in diameter. The steamer claims to be plated stainless steel. I'm a little nervous that there was a little discoloration after the boil, but it did clean up. It is a food steamer and I would think it would be food safe. I'll look into the Williams Sonoma rack just in case.

Staples is known for it's excellent selection of kitchen cookware :cross:

Why in the world would one plate stainless with nickel?

 

[carlk47]

Have the induction burner fired up and brewing a batch this morning! I'm in the process of moving my brewing from the kitchen to the basement. Purchased a utility sink and sump pump off amazon yesterday and just need to reroute the power back to the basement with a little plumbing work to do to get the sink installed. Very excited at the idea of not having to haul all my brew gear upstairs every brewday and having a permanent place for my "brewery"!

 

[schiersteinbrewing]

OldUR's using a neoprene sleeve, and not reflectix. Neoprene is a fantastic insulator, and traps/holds heat really well - think about a set of 5mm duck waders or a wetsuit. Reflectix was designed as radiant barrier, like those mylar space blankets. Good for reflecting heat, but not so hot at holding it.

Added reflectix to my pot and did a boil test, the diffrences between no insulation and with reflectix was marginal. Been trying to buy a Keg Koozie or Keg Skin like AnOldUR but they seem to be having issues with their suppliers. I priced sheet neoprene and making my own, which I might have to do.

Thanks sumbrewindude!

Question for All:

When I turn on my IC3500 with my Bayou Classic 1044 the bottom immediately buckles as the magnetic field kicks in. If you look at where the cooktop surface meets the pot, just the middle 7 or so inches is touching the unit. It was sitting completely flat prior to turning it on.

I imagine this is due to the thin makeup of the BC pots, and may not happen on thinker or tri-ply pot bottom pots.

Anyone else notice this?

Any efficiency downsides?

Looking at AnOldUR's 85% efficiency compared to my 74% I am looking at all options

My BC pot use to sit flat now the base has a slight bulge to it smack dab in the center. I too am wondering what a tri-ply pot would be like.