What's the stuff on top...

[nbstl68]

This is a pear cider.
I have another post going on at the moment as I was asking final thoughts questions for bottling and such...but now I see this stuf fon top coming back.
Had it on one batch, I racked off, leaving a it behind, cleaned everything and it sits in a new carboy ( w now def too much head space).
I spray shot c02 in to push out the air thinking that may help, but the stuff is back.

It smells fine. Taste is not horrible but would like it to be better.

I took a sample to the local brew shop, (no idea of their expertise but they have equipment I don't). They "tested" it and said no bacteria grew so it is fine.
But IMO it is clearly not fine as it clearly is progressing.

I'm considering racking again and just moving on to force carb,bottle \ heat pasteurize as I was diesussing in another post.

So any thoughts at to what it is w the most recent pics?

I don't want to bring something funky along into the bottles.
Will pasteurizing kill pretty much anything?
Think I'll be fine if I just leave the top inch behind?

 

[nbstl68]

First pic is when it is sitting still. Looks like little icebergs. 2nd pic is when I give it a swish...changes to look more like an oil slick and does cling to the sides a bit.

 

[yewtah-brewha]

First pic is when it is sitting still. Looks like little icebergs. 2nd pic is when I give it a swish...changes to look more like an oil slick and does cling to the sides a bit.

I had the same exact thing in my last batch of beer, when I racked it to the bottleing bucket it clinged to the sides and some dropped into the solution.

I was told it was brett and should improve the beer, I dont know, but its been bottled for 5 days and I see no sign of it in my clear bottles.

 

[brwagur]

It definitely looks like an infection. The layer on the top is called a pellicle and certain yeast and bacteria produce them in an attempt to keep out oxygen. Whatever is causing it is living in the actual cider so racking it probably won't get rid of it.

Did you use pasteurized or unpasteurized juice?

What is the current specific gravity of the cider?

Unless there are any current bad flavors your cider should be ok, although be aware that if the yeast is Brettanomyces then sometime strange flavors do not develop until several months down the road.

Whatever the cause, be sure to thoroughly sanitize all equipment and fermenters that have come in contact with the cider to prevent contamination of future batches.

 

[AidanSavage]

If that's done fermenting, that's definitely too much headspace, and even a CO2 dose isnt as effective. I'd have topped it up in the new carboy until it had a couple inches between it and the cap. As others have said, if there's no bad taste to it, bottle it and immediately pasteurize it at 180. As you drink it after that, if it starts developing a bad taste to it, or you feel ill after drinking it, that's your hint to dump the rest and sanitize the bottles, the capper, your bottling equipment, and fermentors (fermenters? fermentors? spellcheck doesnt even have a clue), twice, if not more.

 

[Yooper]

You've got WAY too much headspace, and the oxygen in the headspace would allow oxygen loving bacteria to grow. When fermentation slows, it must be topped up or racked to a smaller vessel. I'd get it out of that carboy now, dose with sulfites, and make sure the cider goes to within an inch of the bung. Even so, it might not save the cider at this point.

 

[nbstl68]

Crapo
Just the other day though my brew shop said their test showed no bacteria?
So is "infection"different than bacteria?

...on the other hand losing trust in the folks at the brew shop as even though I asked over and over about the SG no longer dropping and the head space they told me no worries. Ugh.
Hate to have to toss it all after all the work.
Tis was from my own pears.
I used meta initially as instructed and again about another 1/8 tsp about a week ago when I racked.

I don't have access to the equipment to do my plan of legging and force curbing but sounds like I cannot wait.

S is my best bet to het pasteurize and bottle flat to attempt to save it if it is an infection?

 

[nbstl68]

FYI it smells fine and does not taste bad but not great IMO but being a first batch I have no idea what it should really taste like. Just know at the moment the taste is not for me as is.
My ph was 3.5 & 3.6 (two 4.5 gal batches).
Not sure if that comes into play w taste or stability.

 

[AidanSavage]

Crapo
Just the other day though my brew shop said their test showed no bacteria?
So is "infection"different than bacteria?

...on the other hand losing trust in the folks at the brew shop as even though I asked over and over about the SG no longer dropping and the head space they told me no worries. Ugh.
Hate to have to toss it all after all the work.
Tis was from my own pears.
I used meta initially as instructed and again about another 1/8 tsp about a week ago when I racked.

I don't have access to the equipment to do my plan of legging and force curbing but sounds like I cannot wait.

S is my best bet to het pasteurize and bottle flat to attempt to save it if it is an infection?

Most likely. Heat pasteurization has a better chance of killing nasties than kegging. Possibly because a keg's built to resist pressure, and live yeast still gives off CO2 if it's not entirely dry already.

 

[Yooper]

Crapo
Just the other day though my brew shop said their test showed no bacteria?
So is "infection"different than bacteria?

No- infection is usually caused by bacterial contamination. It could be wild yeast contamination or mold, but it's more likely due to lactobacillus.

The headspace is a big concern, and the k-meta should have helped but perhaps opening it up often to take readings allowed some bacteria to take hold, due to the large headspace.

The folks who told you that you didn't have any bacteria in the liquid also told you the FG was 1.029, so I think that was a big learning experience.

 

[nbstl68]

The folks who told you that you didn't have any bacteria in the liquid also told you the FG was 1.029, so I think that was a big learning experience.

True. I guess just b\c you own a brew shop does not necessarily mean you know what you are talking about.

So at this point I just want to try to save the batches if I can.
I won't have access to kegging equipment for another week or more so I can't wait for that.
I think I just need to try to backsweeten until it tastes like something I'd drink, bottle and pasteurize non-carbonated I guess.

Are there more difinitive ways to determine if the batch would be bad to drink?
I'm not real fond of the prev posted "stop drinking it if you start to feel ill" method.

 

[Yooper]

The folks who told you that you didn't have any bacteria in the liquid also told you the FG was 1.029, so I think that was a big learning experience.

True. I guess just b\c you own a brew shop does not necessarily mean you know what you are talking about.

So at this point I just want to try to save the batches if I can.
I won't have access to kegging equipment for another week or more so I can't wait for that.
I think I just need to try to backsweeten until it tastes like something I'd drink, bottle and pasteurize non-carbonated I guess.

Are there more difinitive ways to determine if the batch would be bad to drink?
I'm not real fond of the prev posted "stop drinking it if you start to feel ill" method.

No, it won't hurt you. It just might not taste great as the infection progresses.

 

[AidanSavage]

Taste, smell, and after-effects are probably as definitive as you're going to get unless you can have a sample lab tested. Mind you, bottling would still need to take place even if you were getting it tested.

 

[yensmp]

I had very similar looking stuff on my first batch. I had too much head space in my carboy too. It didn't have any vinegary smell. I racked it into a clean carboy, topped it up and also spayed a little wine keep in. It is some kind of gas to keep wine from oxidizing. The batch turned out fine. I thinking what you have might be film yeast.


Sent from my iPhone using Home Brew

 

[EZED]

I'm drinking batch # 6 for me ; I have had nothing like this, I do however use buckets and I KEEP IT CLOSED From the pitch of yeast until the bubblier is at less than ..(# of bubbles)......?per...(time)....? you need to play with it [all depends on how dry YOU like IT].

:rockin:ipe::rockin: