What happened??

[Friartuck502]

Hello!

Long time reader, first time poster. My wife and I brewed a stout a few weeks back, and today when we finally tried it, the color was amber, there was practically no stout flavor at all, and all we got was hoppy water, in terms of flavor. Any idea what happened? Any insight, advice, or comment would be appreciated.

We are not discouraged. We just want to know what to do next time.

 

[The_Bishop]

Going to need a lot more info. Was it a kit? What came in the kit? Recipe?

 

[Friartuck502]

It was a partial grain brew. Here is the recipe:

1 lb Munich
.75 lb chocolate
.5 lb roasted barley
.25 lb crystal 80c
.5lb flaked wheat

6 lb dme

1 oz Nugget (60)
1 oz Willamette (20)

S-04 yeast

 

[LoneTreeFarms]

Like bishop said. More deets date brewed OG FG bottle date or kegged ? Stouts typically take longer to fully mature.

 

[Friartuck502]

This is where I say we are novice enough to have not measured OG. Primary was two weeks, followed by a week of bottle conditioning. I figured there was a chance that it wasn’t done yet...

 

[LoneTreeFarms]

This is where I say we are novice enough to have not measured OG. Primary was two weeks, followed by a week of bottle conditioning. I figured there was a chance that it wasn’t done yet...

Just off the top of my head with looking back at any of my old notes I'm thinking most of the stouts I made sat 5-6 weeks before I bottled. Try a bottle once a week or once every two and see if/how the flavor is changing.

 

[Friartuck502]

Awesome! Thanks for the input. I was afraid we’d ruined our first beer!

 

[LoneTreeFarms]

There's still a chance that it is. But I'd give it a little time before I gave up completely.

 

[khannon]

What was the temp you steeped the grains ? How much water did you use? That is where the color and some of the flavor is going to come from.
Kevin

 

[Friartuck502]

What was the temp you steeped the grains ? How much water did you use? That is where the color and some of the flavor is going to come from.
Kevin

I steeped the special grains at 150 degrees for 30 mins in 3 gallons of water.

 

[Yooper]

I steeped the special grains at 150 degrees for 30 mins in 3 gallons of water.

Where the grains crushed? If you're not getting color and flavor from the roasted grains, that was my first thought.

 

[Friartuck502]

Yes, the grains were all crushed.

 

[Lefou]

I steeped the special grains at 150 degrees for 30 mins in 3 gallons of water.

So, using 6lb of dark DME in 5 gallons should net approximately 53 gravity points ( according to the brewing calculator). The majority of fermentables comes from this alone. The steeping grains contribute a few extra points and should get you a higher gravity and more color depth for a stout instead of an amber ale.
The steeping grains should have a fairly low efficiency and will add about 7 points of gravity, but contribute enough color for 40SRM, using Brewers Friend.
1.060 OG, 5.8-6%ABV, 40 SRM for a five gallon brew.
**Edit** This is using the partial mash calculator ....

 

[studrymon]

It was a partial grain brew. Here is the recipe:

1 lb Munich
.75 lb chocolate
.5 lb roasted barley
.25 lb crystal 80c
.5lb flaked wheat

6 lb dme

1 oz Nugget (60)
1 oz Willamette (20)

S-04 yeast

The steeping malts don't have enough diastatic power to convert, so you essentially made some brownish water. You got color, but little to no sugars, hence, brown water instead of roasty goodness. If you throw a pound of British pale in with it, you would have almost enough dp to convert some sugars and may get more of what you want.

Was this a kit?

 

[MaxStout]

The steeping malts don't have enough diastatic power to convert, so you essentially made some brownish water. You got color, but little to no sugars, hence, brown water instead of roasty goodness. If you throw a pound of British pale in with it, you would have almost enough dp to convert some sugars and may get more of what you want.

Was this a kit?

OP listed 6 lbs. DME in the recipe. It's extract + steeped grains.

 

[Friartuck502]

The steeping malts don't have enough diastatic power to convert, so you essentially made some brownish water. You got color, but little to no sugars, hence, brown water instead of roasty goodness. If you throw a pound of British pale in with it, you would have almost enough dp to convert some sugars and may get more of what you want.

Was this a kit?

It was not. It was a recipe from my local home brew store.

 

[Lefou]

Three to four quarts of water per pound of grain when steeping is an acceptable volume to use. I am assuming the Munich was 10L, but with only one pound available, it isn't enough to help convert the other grains.
Partial mashing assumes a very low efficiency for steeped grains - about 35%, so you would've been better off using Vienna or Pilsner instead of Munich. It would've helped. Like studrymon stated, the extra diastatic potential of a better base malt would've extracted more sugar, but it bothers me why your color depth was off. The roast barley and chocolate should've contributed more .....

 

[studrymon]

It was not. It was a recipe from my local home brew store.

Talk to the hbs operator. Ask them how they brew this recipe. Maybe they do something on their system that is different. Maybe they pulled it off the internet. Small things can be the difference between good beer and hop water.

IMO, you won't get anything out of the steeping if doesn't convert. You get some color from the barley and crystal malt, but little else; essentially tea. Add a pound of 2 row, steep at 154-156°, you will get some of the long chain sugars that add to the mouth feel.

Just my 2¢.

Cheers!

 

[Lefou]

...so that leaves me with one last explanation.
Poorly ground grains can contribute to a conversion problem and color contribution. When I use small to moderate amounts of highly diastatic malted wheat, I tend to grind it to near flour to speed conversion.

 

[Yooper]

Munich can self convert, and the others are steeping grains (except for the flaked wheat), so the recipe is fine really.

The steeping malts don't have enough diastatic power to convert, so you essentially made some brownish water. You got color, but little to no sugars, hence, brown water instead of roasty goodness. If you throw a pound of British pale in with it, you would have almost enough dp to convert some sugars and may get more of what you want.

Was this a kit?

 

[IslandLizard]

I'm with @Lefou. Most LHBS mill their grain very coarsely, too coarse in general. Running it through the mill twice may help it in the right direction, but ideally you should get it milled finer than they do. You could pulverize it more yourself with a (large) mortar and pestle, in a blender, or food processor. When you steep it can be very fine.

How long did you steep and in how much water? Were the milled grains in a steeping bag? Did you agitate the bag during the steep?
After the steep, did you sparge the grains (like a rinse)?

It amazes me how brew shops sell recipes like this without including enough diastatic malt and correct instructions on doing a mini mash, which is not all that different from a steep, just more controlled, i.e., smaller volume and held at a more precise temperature (148-158F) for an hour. Until I understood more about brewing these "errors" weren't all that clear.

You've probably got a (light) Brown ale now. It may turn out quite well, less roasty than a Stout, but roastier than an Amber and quite tasty. Don't chuck it!