What am I doing wrong?

[treacheroustexan]

So, long story short, I just moved into a new apartment and started all grain. I have done two batches that ended up awful, even though I strictly followed the recipes. I can't quite figure out what it is but it's very undrinkable. I have hit my mash temp/ and gravity right where I want them to be, so I don't think it's my process. I star san everything. My next batch will be kegged and not bottled. In my last apartment, I used hot water from my bathtub faucet and got some of the best beer that I have ever had. But I assume if i can drink the water here i can brew with it?

Some things that I think it might be. I use water from my hot water side of my sink, and when it comes out it's really white/cloudy, but was I just told that it's from the air or something and that's normal. I use the same in my coffee and it tastes fine. I am going to start using campden tabs in my water to see if it makes a difference? Drinking the water out of the glass is drinkable but it's not as good as bottled water. Should I use store bought water from now on or do you think the campden tabs will help?

Anther thing, I have been careless about actually cleaning my fermenting bucket in the past. I'l rinse it after every brew with hot water but never actually use any cleaner in it other than star san before dumping my wort into it. It is stained really yellow on the inside. Do you think that could have anything to do with it? I plan on buying a new one since it's only like 8 bucks at the lhbs. I also must note that a couple times I have poured the wort into the bucket above 80+ degrees, i'm not sure if the heat from that on the plastic would give the final product any off flavors?

If I know my actual process is working ( i have hit my og and fg and still getting off flavors, and these are well known recipes from this forum) so I am assuming something is getting infected somewhere maybe from my primary not being taken care of it in the past or it's my water. So I plan on trying to resolve both of them issues for my next brew to see if it tastes any better. Any other tips?

 

[SnakeRidge]

I think that campden tabs are a must. And after seeing the inside of a couple of water heaters, I no longer use the hot tap for anything other than cleaning. A new bucket is a good idea.

If it were me since you said everything process oriented went fine, I'd use all spring water for a batch and see how that does. Also, you mention dumping wort in at 80*. Are you chilling down to 65-68* before pitching yeast and keeping it there for the duration of fermentation?

 

[danimalt]

You can't sanitize something that isn't clean. I agree with SnakeRidge, if it were me I'd brew another batch (same recipe as before) with some RO and see how it turns out. If it's better, then you've found your problem, if not you're one step closer.

 

[Psylocide]

What flavors are you experiencing?

If you aren't treating with Campden tabs and it tastes really medicinal/band aid-y, that's most likely going to be your culprit.

 

[treacheroustexan]

What flavors are you experiencing?

If you aren't treating with Campden tabs and it tastes really medicinal/band aid-y, that's most likely going to be your culprit.

Thanks all! I am getting a medicinal taste in it. I am going to do an extract batch with campden tabs and see where I'm at. That way if it sucks i only wasted 2 hours rather than 6. And if it works il have a good beer either way.

 

[Psylocide]

Thanks all! I am getting a medicinal taste in it. I am going to do an extract batch with campden tabs and see where I'm at. That way if it sucks i only wasted 2 hours rather than 6. And if it works il have a good beer either way.

Yeah, just remember to treat your top off water and your boil water if you are doing a partial boil.

Use cold tap water.

1 tab will treat up to 20 gal I believe, I just crush one up and add to mash and sparge water 1/2 and 1/2.

 

[Homercidal]

If you are getting water from a municipal source (anything not form your own well) you may have Chloramines, and Campden tabs are recommended.)

I don't mind using hot water from the tank. If you've ever seen what an underground well looks like, you'd never drink spring water...

As it is, you are going to boil any bacterial stuff dead anyway.

Moving to a new water source can also change the water chemistry. Generally water from nearby areas are similar, but it may be the depth of a well is different and hence different amounts of minerals. Generally ground water in the Great Lakes area is pretty alkaline. I'd recommend having a Ward Labs report done on it. You may find darker beers brew better than lighter beers due to the higher amounts of acid teh roast malts provide.

Water Chemistry is often one of the last things a brewer looks at in the course of gaining experience. But it's not that hard to understand. Maybe it's time to read up on it?

 

[Jayhem]

7 gallons of spring water at Walmart is like $7. I would start with your water and see if that helps. Also you can get a home water test done for about $20 and post that up to get more help on your water adjustments.

 

[joshesmusica]

I still wouldn't ignore proper cleaning and sanitation first. Then focus on proper ferment temps and pitching rates. Then move on to water chemistry. If you don't have those first three things down, changing your water won't necessarily help.
With that said, what are the styles the off flavors are showing up in? That will help you understand what to add to change the water chemistry. I'm just learning about it myself. If it's both pale and dark styles, it's likely the chlorine. If it's pale styles, I believe you're too alkaline. If it's darker styles, you're too acidic. I'm personally able to make really good pale styles, but my darker styles have suffered, which I have recently learned was due to my water being too acidic to start with.

 

[treacheroustexan]

I still wouldn't ignore proper cleaning and sanitation first. Then focus on proper ferment temps and pitching rates. Then move on to water chemistry. If you don't have those first three things down, changing your water won't necessarily help.
With that said, what are the styles the off flavors are showing up in? That will help you understand what to add to change the water chemistry. I'm just learning about it myself. If it's both pale and dark styles, it's likely the chlorine. If it's pale styles, I believe you're too alkaline. If it's darker styles, you're too acidic. I'm personally able to make really good pale styles, but my darker styles have suffered, which I have recently learned was due to my water being too acidic to start with.

I did a pale ale and an irish red and theu both tasted the same.

 

[joshesmusica]

those aren't necessarily far enough to tell just from that. so like i said, i would start with proper sanitation, ferment temp control, and yeast pitch rates.
1) sanitation, pretty descriptive, be more precise about sanitation. i don't go so far as to be as anal retentive as some guys on here, but it seems that you could use some improvement in that area.
2) ferment temp control - equals a steady temp in the 65-68 range for the first 4-7 days of fermentation (quite yeast dependent, for example s-04 is a beast and can finish up pretty quickly), then a steady temp around room temps (70-72) to finish out. I usually pitch around 72-75, if that makes you feel better, but the important thing if pitching that warm is getting it down to 65-68 in less than 12 hours. The key is steady, within 1-2 degrees of the temp you're aiming for. huge temp swings will cause the yeast to do funky things.
3) proper yeast pitching rates. there are more studies showing worse off-flavors from underpitching than overpitching. so if you're gonna do one, err on the side of overpitching.
once you get those down, then spending the time and money to fix your water will be worth it.

 

[Yooper]

It's most likely the water.

I'd try one batch with 100% RO water (NOT spring water) or distilled water. In many places, those 'water machines' have RO water for about 79 cents a gallon.

You tap water (if municipal) has chlorine or chloramines in it, and the campden will fix that, but it can't fix high alkalinity or iron, or things like that, that may be in your tap water.

 

[Brewrifle]

Definitely do a check on your water profile and adjust with additives. I found out mine was highly alkaline so I have to add 1tsp of gypsum (calcium Sulfate) and calcium Chloride to bring down the PH as well as add Campden tablets to remove chloramine. I think going with RO water to prove that it is your water would be the first and best step after verifying your sanitation is 100% sound.

I was going to mention cleaning your serving equipment, but you bottled the batches in question (I had mold growing in my picnic taps).

 

[treacheroustexan]

Definitely do a check on your water profile and adjust with additives. I found out mine was highly alkaline so I have to add 1tsp of gypsum (calcium Sulfate) and calcium Chloride to bring down the PH as well as add Campden tablets to remove chloramine. I think going with RO water to prove that it is your water would be the first and best step after verifying your sanitation is 100% sound.

I was going to mention cleaning your serving equipment, but you bottled the batches in question (I had mold growing in my picnic taps).

I was also thinking maybe mold or something growing in the bottling wand. Gonna do a good cleaning on all my equipment and try some RO Water and see what that does. Thanks all!