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HellBentBrewCo

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So I'm just starting to learn about water and it's impact to brewing. From what I've read I think i have hard water. This is my report. What are your thoughts? Using the Ezwater spreadsheet which number should I enter as the Alkalinity or Bicarbonate number?

PH 7.4
Total Dissolved Solids 210
Sodium 26
Potassium 3
Calcium, Ca 21
Magnesium, Mg 8
Total Hardness, CaCo3 86
Nitrate, No3N 4.1
Sulfate,So4S 5
Chloride, Cl 50
Cabonate, Co3 <1
Bicarbonate, HCO3 54
Total Alkalinity, CaCO3 44
 
I would use the total alkalinity.

You have a real challenge though... Like my water, you are going to have to dilute that bicarbonate significantly. There is too much to handle with acid... So R/O dilution to get that bicarbonate manageable and under 60 ppm means greater than 3:1. At that point your hardness is completely gone, may as well use 100% R/O or DI, building everything up with gypsum and calcium chloride.

I ended up buying a R/O system to treat my water... Hate to bring bad news.
 
Thats kind of what I was thinking based on everything I read and how my beers taste. I make good beer but I felt it always could be better. Now, who's got a recomendation on an RO system? I 'm thinking something with a 20 gallon storage tank? I brew 10 gallon batches, do 90 minute boils and typically start with ~15 gallons in the boil kettle.
 
Well, wait for a second opinion, but is essentially the same advice I was given. But I cannot imagine going back.

Do some digging, there are both value and commercial systems discussed here - so figure out your budget and be prepared to use it up. Consider how long to prep your water - so 15-17 gallons may take some time to collect with smaller systems, but is doable. I went with a high flow aquarium system rated just below commercial skids. Do your research for sure. Make sure store bought isn't a better option for you.

You will want to soften up the water first to help spare the filter membranes... If you have a softener already - then pass that feed to the R/O. Otherwise expect a very short lifespan for the filters.

I kick my R/O into a plastic malt barrel with a float valve. Then pump from there to the HLT when ready.
 
His water doesn't look that bad - in fact it looks quite good. Alkalinity of 44 is below the often quoted maximum of 50 and he can get it down to 22 with a 1:2 RO dilution or 11 with 1:3. And alkalinity of 44 from pH 7.4 implies that the total carbo is about 1 mmol/L. To neutralize the alkalinity in 19 L (5 gal) to pH 5.4 or so would only require 18 mEq of acid ~ 1.5 cc of 88% lactic.

I also don't think he needs to invest in a water softener for water at this level of hardness - it hardly seems justified. Yes, calcium carbonate would be his limiting salt in an RO system but he can run recovery up to 58% before he'll start to get precipitation on his membranes. Most of the inexpensive systems don't even approach that (more like 20%).
 
AJ, you are right, I read that as 344, not 44. I need to read those more carefully.

OP, I retract my previous statement. There should be spaces between the CaCO3 and the value.

I hope I didn't cause any angst... I am now very jealous of your water and feel like a noob :)
 
Nice, as I said I'm just learning how to use water correctly in the brewing process. I've read a ton but still have a lot to learn. My first beer now that I know my profile will be a kolsch, nothing like starting off with something "easy". Any suggestions for a final water profile? This is what I'm thinking right now.

Screen Shot 2014-01-09 at 8.44.53 AM.jpg
 
So for a profile, you are treading into subjective preference territory.

Some research should show that Cologne waters are very soft, but I am seeing Koln profiles of sulfates and chlorides above 70, and I wouldn't trust them - so not sure. Your water, I think is a perfect starting point.

http://morebeer.com/brewingtechniques/library/backissues/issue6.1/williams.html

Since you will likely use noble hops (Hallertau or Tett), then the sulfates should be low to avoid harshness. Your chloride is already at 50. I would personally mash at a lower pH around 5.2 - 5.3 to control darkening of the wort for the longer boil (assuming you are using Pils). You could use some acidified malt to lower the mash pH, which would be more traditional than lactic or phosphoric acid additions, but your call. I have seen Kolsch pale malt - but never used it.

Might be worth a test batch and some fine tuning if the malt profile isn't there.
 
+1 on Matt's thoughts about Koln water. I have not been able to really nail down what that profile consists of in my research. That is one reason that its not included in Bru'n Water. I agree that its hard to believe that a soft style such as Kolsch could be created with a water with a lot of sulfate. That is a style I would aim for little mineralization in.
 
http://braukaiser.com/wiki/index.php?title=Various_water_recipes

Use the first one for Kolsch.

I figure, who better to trust for German beers than Kai?

As everyone points out, who knows if all of these breweries are using the water straight. Like the munich dunkel and helles example.

Other than German beers, just trust the flavor profile you want, subcategorized by color in Bru'n water. There's so much personal preference in this anyway that you'll at least get it close the first time. You'll know if you want it more malt or hop forward after the first batch.
 
That first profile has a bit more sulfate that you want and probably close to the optimum (definable only by you, the drinker) level of chloride. I'd start with something with near 0 sulfate about that same level of chloride and then experiment with adding more chloride in the glass. In my 'if little is good less must be better' period I tried a Kölsch with about half that chloride and found it thin and insipid.

I have had Kölsch's with a bit of a sulfate bite. Didn't think it was appropriate but I've never set foot in Köln.
 
I've read everything you've suggested. Using the "yellow fizzy beer" profile on bru'n water I'm going to go with the below in order to get a mash ph in the neighborhood of 5.3 . One question is, will I be able to taste 8ml of lactic acid added to my mash? I'm assuming I'll need to add 3-4 to my sparge water to bring it to a ph of around 6.

Screen Shot 2014-01-10 at 10.51.19 AM.jpg
 
8-10 ml lactic in 10 gallon batch? doubtful, but everyone's threshold is different. If worried, try some in a glass of water scaled from 1 ml / gallon and see (maybe a single small pipette drop in a 16 ounce glass). Remember there will be other flavors present in the beer as well so it shouldn't be noticeable. I wouldn't sweat it at all.
 
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