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bradleym734

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I am currently brewing on a 3V electric setup. I will post pictures of the current setup. I would like to transform it into an automated low oxygen brewery. I am thinking that I should be able to weld latches onto the tun and kettles so they can be purged with N2 and I will use a pre-boil for strike water. My question comes with the electronics. I am a nuclear electrician on submarines and have a working knowledge with PLC's and VME systems. I would like in process monitoring of dissolved O2, ph and specific gravity. It looks like the atlas scientific industrial ph probe and dissolved O2 probe should talk fairly easy with an Arduino setup. My concern is the specific gravity. I see everyone is using a micro motion mass flow meter and I would like help choosing a correct model with the correct remote transmitter. I also need help choosing all of the correct Arduino equipment to accomplish all of this. I have studied the prints of the sample systems over at brucontrol but don't want to waste a bunch of money buying things I don't need as I tend to do. Any help would be greatly appreciated.
1E6BC5DD-D4F5-4550-B7B0-14704D6A58C2.jpeg
 

braumke

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Have you thought of using PLCs and automation software?

Awesome setup. I don't know what protocols the Atlas sensor use, so not sure how to recommend there. But I also come from a PLC and automation background, so that is my bias.
I had an electric brewery (self made), sold this summer, and now planning to rebuild one. But I want to automate it.

Take a look at Ignition Ignition Maker Edition | Inductive Automation
My thought right now is either to use that server only, or add a cheap PLC from Omron or Automation Direct.


This is my open-source project to get it started
https://www.homebrewtalk.com/thread...esters-needed-for-open-source-project.687167/
 
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bradleym734

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I am still trying to decide between PLC and something like Brucontrol. The whole reason for wanting to do this is because I want in process pH and density readings. To be honest I don’t know how far I’ll automate because I enjoy touching things like loading grain, flipping switches and swapping hoses. I am really not wanting to add anymore valves than I currently have.
 
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bradleym734

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The other really difficult part of this is that I am currently stationed in Guam. Shipping things out here is sometimes impossible or ridiculously expensive and slow.
 

estricklin

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Have you thought of using PLCs and automation software?

Awesome setup. I don't know what protocols the Atlas sensor use, so not sure how to recommend there. But I also come from a PLC and automation background, so that is my bias.
I had an electric brewery (self made), sold this summer, and now planning to rebuild one. But I want to automate it.

Take a look at Ignition Ignition Maker Edition | Inductive Automation
My thought right now is either to use that server only, or add a cheap PLC from Omron or Automation Direct.


This is my open-source project to get it started
Automate your electric brewery - 4 Testers needed for open source project
We have a very large Ignition system where I work, I've thought about using it to control my brewery too. Ignition may have modules for those protocols, depending on what they are.
 

braumke

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I am still trying to decide between PLC and something like Brucontrol. The whole reason for wanting to do this is because I want in process pH and density readings. To be honest I don’t know how far I’ll automate because I enjoy touching things like loading grain, flipping switches and swapping hoses. I am really not wanting to add anymore valves than I currently have.
The only automatiopn in my last project was the temperature sensors and heat control (solid state relays), which I also used to run the fermentation fridge.
The controls would drop the heat just before boilover on the BK; because it's easy to forget that is coming up when running two batches at the same time.

I can't help you with Brucontrol, but it looks like a complete system, well used, and adapted to home brewing with support.
I'm going down the Ignition path because you can use off-the-shelf industrial controls (https://www.automationdirect.com/adc/shopping/catalog/programmable_controllers) and all of that will be supported, available for decades to come.
 

braumke

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We have a very large Ignition system where I work, I've thought about using it to control my brewery too. Ignition may have modules for those protocols, depending on what they are.
You should give it a try. The Maker Edition has all the protocols included.
And you can learn more about the stuff at work!
 

estricklin

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You should give it a try. The Maker Edition has all the protocols included.
And you can learn more about the stuff at work!
I actually do all the development (programming) for our system. That's probably why I haven't done it yet, I kind of like playing with something different outside of work. I'm in the process of converting my system from an Arduino-PC controlled to raspberry pi, so if Ignition will install and run ok on a pi, I may just go for it.
 
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I am currently brewing on a 3V electric setup. I will post pictures of the current setup. I would like to transform it into an automated low oxygen brewery. I am thinking that I should be able to weld latches onto the tun and kettles so they can be purged with N2 and I will use a pre-boil for strike water. My question comes with the electronics. I am a nuclear electrician on submarines and have a working knowledge with PLC's and VME systems. I would like in process monitoring of dissolved O2, ph and specific gravity. It looks like the atlas scientific industrial ph probe and dissolved O2 probe should talk fairly easy with an Arduino setup. My concern is the specific gravity. I see everyone is using a micro motion mass flow meter and I would like help choosing a correct model with the correct remote transmitter. I also need help choosing all of the correct Arduino equipment to accomplish all of this. I have studied the prints of the sample systems over at brucontrol but don't want to waste a bunch of money buying things I don't need as I tend to do. Any help would be greatly appreciated.View attachment 708150
Hi Bradley,

A few here have following in the footsteps that @Die_Beerery have created. I don't think he is active on here any longer... are you familiar with him? You may be able to reach him www.**********************. In the meantime, we can help you with any BruControl questions. Naturally, you can build your brewery in stages to accommodate the costs of the hardware and your goals along the way. All the hardware you mentioned can be integrated as you need. Those sensors can either feed analog signals to the BC interfaces or digital data via Arduino direct to the BC application. Regarding the brew hardware like pH, MFM, and dissolved O2, there are multiple choices that others can share their experience with. Regarding the BC hardware, we can help.
 
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bradleym734

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I attached the fluid diagram for how I brew. My current setup uses 5X 1/2" Ball Valves and 2X Linear Throttle Valves. If I go to an automated setup it would require 10X 1/2" solenoid 3way valves, 2X 1/2" solenoid valves and 2X solenoid proportional valves. My concern is the number of valves in the system. As of right now I have zero problems with flow or priming issues with the pumps. I would hate to spend almost $1500 on valves to have priming and flow issues. If any of you smarter guys out there could come up with a simpler schematic or if you could tell me there will be no priming issues with the current number of valves I would appreciate it. I am going to draw up the electrical schematic for what I think I need tonight as well and post it. One problem I have at my current residence which will be my residence for the next three years is that it is government quarters and I only have 1 GFCI 240 VAC outlet and that is for my dryer. The problem with the outlet is that it is on a 30A breaker and I cannot modify the house. So I would need to build the panel for how I run it now and that is a separate panel for 120VAC RIMS heater and one for the 240VAC boil kettle and HLT.
 

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crane

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It doesn't sound like you have a clear end goal of how much you want to automate your brewery. If you are still planning on running the system more manually (moving hoses, turning switches) then you don't necessarily need any automation software/PLC. You could use pH, DO, and MFM meters with displays to monitor these values. If you do want to automate things, then I would suggest BruControl.

Only the larger DIN rail mount Atlas Scientific meters have temp sensor inputs for temperature compensation. These output an analog 4-20mA signal. There are other options for meters like the Mettler Toledo 2100e pH and 4100e O2, as well as the Rosemount 1056. These meters all have a local display as well as analog outputs. You can find DO and pH probes from Mettler Toledo and Broadly James on ebay.

For the Micro Motion MFMs, here are all the components.

1. MFM sensor. I have DS040s, others have the larger DS065s. Anything larger and the minimum flow rate is too high for the flow rates we are dealing with.
2. RFT9712 transmitter. This is the box that connects to the sensor. It outputs a 4-20mA with digital HART.
3. Moore Industries HIM HART interface module. This takes in the 4-20mA/HART signal from the RFT9712 and outputs up to 3 separate 4-20mA signals for flow, density, and temperature. This has a local display that can be configured to display 2 different values.
4. Rosemount 275 HART communicator. This is used to configure the RFT9712.
5. RS232 adapter and jumper wires. This is to configure the HIM HART module. The pinout for the RS232 interface on the front of the module is Tx, Rx, Gnd from left to right. This connects to the following pins on the RS232 DB9; Tx - 2, Rx - 3, Gnd - 5

All of the 4-20mA outputs go to an analog input pin on the arduino. If your arduino has 5V IO, then you need a 250 Ohm resistor from the 4-20mA output to ground. If you IO is 3.3V, then you need a 165 Ohm resistor.
 
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bradleym734

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It doesn't sound like you have a clear end goal of how much you want to automate your brewery. If you are still planning on running the system more manually (moving hoses, turning switches) then you don't necessarily need any automation software/PLC. You could use pH, DO, and MFM meters with displays to monitor these values. If you do want to automate things, then I would suggest BruControl.

Only the larger DIN rail mount Atlas Scientific meters have temp sensor inputs for temperature compensation. These output an analog 4-20mA signal. There are other options for meters like the Mettler Toledo 2100e pH and 4100e O2, as well as the Rosemount 1056. These meters all have a local display as well as analog outputs. You can find DO and pH probes from Mettler Toledo and Broadly James on ebay.

For the Micro Motion MFMs, here are all the components.

1. MFM sensor. I have DS040s, others have the larger DS065s. Anything larger and the minimum flow rate is too high for the flow rates we are dealing with.
2. RFT9712 transmitter. This is the box that connects to the sensor. It outputs a 4-20mA with digital HART.
3. Moore Industries HIM HART interface module. This takes in the 4-20mA/HART signal from the RFT9712 and outputs up to 3 separate 4-20mA signals for flow, density, and temperature. This has a local display that can be configured to display 2 different values.
4. Rosemount 275 HART communicator. This is used to configure the RFT9712.
5. RS232 adapter and jumper wires. This is to configure the HIM HART module. The pinout for the RS232 interface on the front of the module is Tx, Rx, Gnd from left to right. This connects to the following pins on the RS232 DB9; Tx - 2, Rx - 3, Gnd - 5

All of the 4-20mA outputs go to an analog input pin on the arduino. If your arduino has 5V IO, then you need a 250 Ohm resistor from the 4-20mA output to ground. If you IO is 3.3V, then you need a 165 Ohm resistor.
Thank you so much. This is really what I was looking for. I have decided that since I want real time data I might as well see how far the rabbit hole goes. I should be able to get my tinkering fix with this project. I think brucontrol is the best way to go since there is a ton of support out there.
 

braumke

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I actually do all the development (programming) for our system. That's probably why I haven't done it yet, I kind of like playing with something different outside of work. I'm in the process of converting my system from an Arduino-PC controlled to raspberry pi, so if Ignition will install and run ok on a pi, I may just go for it.
It looks like yes, it does run on raspberry pi.
But I don't know if the Ignition Edge is available as a free (maker edition). Installing Ignition Edge on Raspberry Pi
 
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