Using RO water

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usafbeerlover

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Greetings,

I want to use RO water as a base and add to it to build beer profiles. Looking for advice what to order and a good beer profile breakdown. I need the least complicated if possible.
Cheers
Jeff
 
You need 6 things:

1) Acid. Whether it be acid-malt, or liquid phosphoric or lactic acid.
2) calcium chloride
3) calcium sulfate
4) pickling lime (for use on rare occasion)
5) a way to measure pH. Preferably a pH meter, but you need to know the limitations of the strips if you use them.
6) an accurate scale that will measure 0.1 gram.

Don't bother with chalk. It does not dissolve easily and will give you erratic results.

Understand that pH strips are not an ideal solution and will tell you ballpark at best. In fact those ColorPhast strips are known to read about 0.3 pH units low.

Head over to the Brew Science forum section and read the stickies. This will be your quickest jumpstart to water knowledge.
 
Don't bother with chalk. It does not dissolve easily and will give you erratic results.

It might not dissolve well in water but it certainly raises pH when you need it.

In fact those ColorPhast strips are known to read about 0.3 pH units low.

I wouldn't sweat 0.3 pH difference for the price (a dime per mash).
 
Thank you guys for the great info but what if I just used store bought spring water. Would I need to add anything to it and just test the PH. Also I saw PH strips in Walmart yesterday for aquariums, will these work the same? Here is what my water report says. Can someone decipher it for me?
http://www.charlestonwater.com/down...2011_annual_drinking_water_quality_report.pdf

Chloride 22 ppm 250 ppm
Color 3 PCU 15 PCU
Iron <0.10 ppm 0.3 ppm
Manganese <0.05 ppm 0.05 ppm
Total Dissolved Solids (TDS) 85 ppm 500 ppm
Sodium 18 ppm
No Standard
Alkalinity 28 ppm
Conductivity 210 umhos/cm
Hardness 56 ppm
Ortho-phosphate 1.2 ppm
Silica 5.8 ppm
Temperature 71.6&#730;F (22&#730;C)
 
There isn't really all the information that you would like for brewing, but the information that is provided suggests that it might be fine for brewing. The wide variability in chloride and TDS are troubling though.

I find that RO water from a vending machine is often less expensive than jug water that is trucked in from somewhere. It should be even less mineralized too.

I do have to disagree with Message #6 above. I have not found chalk to be effective in raising mash pH unless it has been previously fully dissolved by CO2 treatment prior to brewing. Just adding powdered chalk to the mash tun has proven totally ineffective at raising mash pH for me and numerous others.

I generally agree with the sentiment that colorpHast pH strips are useful and effective in the brewery. However, there can be cases where the darkness of the wort causes the brewer to mis-interpret the result. They're not perfect, but still useful.
 
Martin,
I have a Glacier water dispenser unit right up the street. I was thinking of using that and the 5.2 ph stabalizer they sell at northern brewer. Here is the a link to the water.
http://glacierwater.com/
I am honestly thinking about going back to extract just to not worry about all this water hoopla.

Thanks again
 
Glacier water is RO water and should be fine for brewing. Adding 5.2 Stabilizer would not produce a good result in most cases. It appears that this product just adds phosphates and sodium to the water, neither of which are very beneficial to brewing.

A RO source could mostly benefit from a calcium addition. The recommendations of the Water Primer in this forum are most useful when using RO water excepting that the Primer provides little guidance as to what additions are needed when brewing beers with acidic grists (grists with significant crystal and/or roast content).

Even extract brewers need to be concerned with the water they use to reconstitute their wort. Since the extract already has a dose of ions in it, using a water with a lot more ions can be bad for the beer. RO water can frequently be the best addition when brewing with extract.

So there isn't really an escape to water concerns, but you really don't have to fret over water. With only a few understandings of either the tap water or RO water, there would be only a few things you MIGHT want to adjust. Brewing beer doesn't require much understanding of water. But brewing great beer in a wide range of styles does require a good understanding of water. No one needs to play with water until they aren't satisfied with their brewing results.
 
Martin and other brewers thanks again for the knowledge. That is what I love about this site and particularly this hobby.
Cheers guys
 
Never needed chalk. I use CaSO4, CaCl, and MgSO4. Sometimes lactic acid or acidulated malt with very pale beers. I've used plenty of dark malts in stouts and haven't had the pH drop so low as to require any sort of pH raising chemical.
 
Agree, CaSO4, CaCl, and MgSO4 (with some acid like lacto) is all you need.
I use mabrungard's water sheet to predict my pH and I found it pretty accurate for my system. If pH is too low because of huge dark grains bill I add them at vorlauf or at last 5-10 minutes of mash.
 
I know you wanted a simple answer about treating RO to make a good "profile" for beer. My 2 cents is this...spend the 30 bucks and have your water tested by ward labs.

drink a bottle of water, rinse it, send it to them and some money and you'll have all the info you need. You'll know what's in your water. Then, its up to you to just CUT your water with RO. if you're high in sulfates, fine...cut with RO and add back what you need.

it saves SO much money not always buying RO to brew with...and you understand brewing science more! which is half the fun! They'll tell you the PH of your water, and everything you need to know to use the EZ Water Calculator

http://www.ezwatercalculator.com/

totally worth your time
 
Which of the test would it be?
W-9
Household Coliform Bacteria &
Complete Mineral Test*
That is the one that is close to 40 dollars but they have a few more for 10 dollars cheaper.
 
Which of the test would it be?
W-9
Household Coliform Bacteria &
Complete Mineral Test*
That is the one that is close to 40 dollars but they have a few more for 10 dollars cheaper.

The one you need is $16.50. I think it's W#6 (?) but that's going by my memory. I do know it's $16.50, though!
 
The W-6 test has all the same tests as the "beer test" except Iron and Phosphorus. If you order the "beer test" that 1971hemicuda linked to they will ship you a bottle and mailing label as well as run the 2 other tests. Is it worth the extra $20 as compared to the standard W-6 test? That would be for you to decide. I don't know how important the Phosphorus test is, but I know the Iron test can be handy (but probably avaible from your local water report already).

This spring I will be having my water tested, and will probably just buy the kit. I already know that my water is messed up as it is very hard well water with a high iron content. Hopefully it won't be so bad that I run into problems cutting it with RO to get a workable profile for the lighter colored beers that I enjoy in the summer.
 
Please be careful using only RO water for consumption. Even when adding just grains the water will be missing many minerals. The problem comes on e it's consumed the body always is trying to keep a boa lance of different levels. In this case these minerals can be pulled out of our bones. One batch probably not an issue, but years of drinking fluid devoid of these important minerals can cause many health issues. There are many article lee online that speak to this, I am a nurse by trade, but don't take my word for it, please do some additional research before you start off into a life time of brewing this way.

Cheers Jim
 
Please be careful using only RO water for consumption. Even when adding just grains the water will be missing many minerals. The problem comes on e it's consumed the body always is trying to keep a boa lance of different levels. In this case these minerals can be pulled out of our bones. One batch probably not an issue, but years of drinking fluid devoid of these important minerals can cause many health issues. There are many article lee online that speak to this, I am a nurse by trade, but don't take my word for it, please do some additional research before you start off into a life time of brewing this way.

Cheers Jim

Wow, what a bunch of silly nonsense. If the only thing you consumed in your diet was RO water you might have some health issues, but the ion/mineral rich diet we all have prevents the "stripping" of nutrients from our tissues. It all mixes together in the gut Jim!
 
+1 with what the Geek said. There are places all over the world that have near rainwater quality (or it is rainwater) and they are doing fine. Drinking low mineralized water is not a health risk unless your diet is also deficient in minerals. Since the bulk of our mineral intake is via our food, the quality of the water is a minor factor.

I had Jim's concerns several years ago when I first considered a RO system, but after more thought and research I found that my concerns were unfounded.

Enjoy!
 
This post wasn't meant to piss anyone off or high jack this thread, so this will be my last post on this topic. There is supporting data that shows that this could be an issue for some people. Lack of minerals in a diet can create or exacerbate current health issues. I only meant to bring some awareness to the topic. As Martin did. Please research this for yourself with your health concerns if any. Knowledge is king and awareness is the first step.

Ps your body doesn't produce minerals so you can spit all you'd like and it will still lack minerals. However, if you spit enough you might leave yourself a little dehydrated.

Cheers
Jim
 
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