Trying to Determine Partial Mash Proportions

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escalante88

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I'm a newbie (started a month ago) and I've been trying to determine the correct ingredient proportions for a 5 gallon batch of partial mash honey wheat beer. I listed what my tentative recipe and the ingredients I have below, but I'm curious to see if anyone has any favorites, corrections, or suggestions. Here is what I am thinking, although I could be terribly off the mark:

Mash or steep (?) 2 lbs milled malted wheat, add 5 lbs. (?) Munton's wheat DME (55%/45%), 1 oz of Hallertau @ 60 minutes, and 1 oz of Hallertau @ 5-10 minutes, and pitch the W3638. Would this be too sweet? Should I also steep or mash the honey malt - or just add 1 lb. honey at flame-out? Holler at me with any suggestions or preferred proportions. Great to be a part of the forum!

Josh

*5 lbs Munton's Wheat DME (55%/45%), 5 lbs milled malted wheat, 2 oz Hallertau hop pellets, 1 lb. Gambrinus honey malt, 1 packet Wyeast 3638 Bavarian Wheat*
 
Escalante, you might take a glance through the recipe database here https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f70/?daysprune=-1&order=desc&sort=replycount

You will see that it can be searched by # of replies. I figure the more action on the thread, the more times it's been tried and vetted out.

Take a look through the threads, notice some of the ingredients and percentages that tried and true recipes are using, then tweak them a little bit to make them your own. Then post them in the database if you make a really great one!
 
YOur DME is probably half 2row and half wheat. So, you probably don't want to try and mash 5 lbs of wheat, it needs 2 row to convert. Drop the wheat malt to 2.5 and add 2.5 lbs of 2 row.
 
Awesome - I looked through the recipe database for quite a bit and found only one recipe but its numbers and ingredients were different then what I am looking for unfortunately - 3 gallon batch size, LME, and so forth. I'm not sure if I'm experienced enough to significantly alter the recipe, but I will definitely search by number of replies - a great idea.

Ichthy, the Muntons (if this is 2-row, doesn't English 2 row have less diastatic activity?) DME is 55% wheat, 45% barley. So could I mash 2.5 lbs of wheat malt and 2.5 lbs of the 55/45 DME or would that be too much wheat and not enough diastatic activity? Do you suggest 2.5 lbs wheat malt and straight up 100% 2 row barley DME?

Will that make for enough fermentable sugars to hit 5% alcohol by volume? Would 6 row barley have more diastatic power and be more effective in converting the wheat starch to fermentable sugars? Sorry for all the questions - I want this batch to turn out tasty...
 
You can't mash with the DME, or at least I've never heard of anyone doing so. You would need to mash your 2.5lbs of wheat with actual 2row barley. A lot of hefe recipes are 50/50 wheat and 2row, so I think you'd be fine dropping the wheat to 2.5 and adding 2.5 lbs 2row. It shouldn't matter whether you use 2 or 6 row.

Also, go ahead and throw the honey malt in the mash.

I don't have my software in front of me, but do a search on google for "brewtarget" it's free and you can plug in all your numbers to calculate IBUs, OG, FG, etc. But you should be pretty close to 5% ABV.
 
Awesome - I looked through the recipe database for quite a bit and found only one recipe but its numbers and ingredients were different then what I am looking for unfortunately - 3 gallon batch size, LME, and so forth. I'm not sure if I'm experienced enough to significantly alter the recipe, but I will definitely search by number of replies - a great idea. ..

Escalante, the conversions are really fairly simple. some folks (like me) use software like http://www.beersmith.com/. You can also read up on converting in many articles like this one: http://home.roadrunner.com/~brewbeer/extract/pres.pdf

I think that you will find that being able to do the conversion will help you greatly as most recipe's are posted in all-grain, 5 and 10 gallons - assuming you will PM for a while. :mug:
 
Oh OK I was confused although I know you can't mash DME! Thanks guys I am downloading the software as I write this...
 
Hey, escalante88...your mailbox is full, so I'm posting my hefeweizen recipe here for ya:

3 lbs Wheat Malt
1-2 lbs Pilsner Malt (depends on how high in alcohol you want and your mash efficiency)
2 oz Aromatic Malt
3 lbs Wheat Dry Malt Extract
~10 IBUs of Tettnanger hops (or Hallertau, Saaz or even Fuggle) for 60 minutes of the boil
WLP300 in a 1L starter (or wyeast alternative)

Do a 90 minute total boil. Ferment in the low 60s.

Cold-crashing for a week or two after fermentation or filtering will give it the Kristall-weizen appearance and flavor by dropping out the yeast.

One of my favorites, I've made it many times.
:mug:
 
Thanks DeathBrewer - Your recipe has inspired me to do a few more hours of much-needed research! I still have a few questions, however. Why the aromatic malts? I haven't seen these in any other recipes and was curious about them.

Also, why the 90 minute total boil time? Lastly, do you cold-crash in the secondary or in bottles, and at what temperature? This is my third batch and I really want it to come out well (Hence all the questions)! Here is my recipe as it stands right now:

5.5 Gallon Batch of Kristall Pistol:

3.30 lb Wheat DME
4.00 lb Wheat Malt
1.55 lb German Pilsner (2 row)
1.57 oz Hallertau (3% AA)
W3068 (with starter?)

OG = 1.055
FG = 1.013
Alc by Vol = 5.4%
IBUs = 15
CO2 = 3.0 % with 5.9 oz corn sugar

Upgraded my membership by the way, so inbox is no longer 5 deep... Thanks for all your help!
 
German Hefeweizens are traditionally done with nothing but pilsner and wheat and a decoction mash is used to give it a bit of maltiness. Decoction mashes were also used because grains were not highly modified and because it was easy to gauge temperature, etc.

Anyway, a small amount of aromatic malt will give it a malty backbone with using a decoction. I've also tried using a maltier grain, such as Vienna, in place of the Pilsner, but then it isn't as light and crisp as a hefeweizen should be. I enjoy doing decoction mashes, too, but with a partial mash it's a a waste of time...you won't get enough out of it with such a small amount of grain.

Check out the bjcp guidelines: http://www.bjcp.org/2008styles/style15.php#1a

Your OG of 1.055 is pretty high for a weissbier, although I've made this same recipe as a weizenbock before and it was amazing, so a higher gravity is certainly possible.

I make it a rule to do a 90 minute boil whenever I'm using pilsner malt because it produces DMS (dimethyl sulfide.) This will ensure you don't get that vegetative aroma.

I would cold-crash in secondary to make it nice and clear, but that means you will have to add more yeast at bottling. Perhaps do like the breweries do and use a lager yeast for bottling :)

You could certainly just cold crash the bottles for a few weeks after they are done carbonating, however, and skip the secondary...but I think it will be less clear.

I would definitely make a starter and be sure to ferment cool...this will make a nice, clean beer with the ester banana and clove flavors being pleasant and smooth, not overpowering and wild.

Good call on the membership...this forum is worth it!
:mug:
 
YOur DME is probably half 2row and half wheat. So, you probably don't want to try and mash 5 lbs of wheat, it needs 2 row to convert. Drop the wheat malt to 2.5 and add 2.5 lbs of 2 row.

Malted wheat can self convert and then some. It has the same diastatic power as 6-row (Briess anyway.) You should still use some other malt in the mash though to keep it from turning in to a gooey mess and getting stuck.
 
OK, so I have adjusted my recipe thanks to everyone's suggestions, reducing the IBUs to 10, going to hold off the aromatic malts since this is partial mash, also I reduced the wheat/pilsner ratio to 50/50 based off what I read on Northern Brewer (I still remain a loyal supporter of HomeBrewTalk!) My OG is still 1.055, but I am holding on it to maintain the 5.4 % Alc by Volume, same as Weihenstephaner. And I will definitely cold-crash in the secondary, and filter everything as well.

I will be using a grain bag per DeathBrewers partial mash write-up so I'm not overly concerned with sticky bad-bad, and I just mixed the W3068 starter, to the tune of a Sweetwater IPA (no good homebrews yet!). By the way, what temperature do yall cold-crash at, and, also, do you smack/use yeast and nutrient from the Wyeast Activator Packs to make the starter? Will definitely ferment in the low 60's with a bootlegged swamp cooler.

You guys are seriously awesome, I have learned more in the last week than I could have figured out on my own in the last month! I will let yall know how it goes!

Kristall Pistol:

3.19 lb Wheat DME
2.87 lb Wheat Malt
2.87 lb German Pilsner (2 row)
1.03 oz Hallertau (3% AA)
W3068 (with 1 qt starter)

OG = 1.055
FG = 1.013
Alc by Vol = 5.4%
IBUs = 9.9
CO2 = 3.0 % with 5.9 oz corn sugar
 
Colder the better (faster, at least) for cold crashing. Don't go below freezing ;)

I generally use close to 70% wheat in my all-grain and partial mashes, but 50% will work fine.

Yep, smack the pack and it should bulge at least a little bit, so you'll know it's ready for the starter.
 
Just finished brewing the weissbier clone - seems like there were constant hot breaks rather than one, even at the 90 minute mark! I assume this is because wheat is about 15% protein, but luckily I avoided any boil-overs. Pitched the starter and am waiting for signs of fermentation, as you can see below. Fingers crossed...

IMG_0238.jpg
 
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