thoughts on a Euro-Pils

[the_bird]

OK, I've got to brew a European-type pilsner for a co-worker. She and her husband are fans of Heiny (don't we all love heiny?), but I'm not feeling constrained to make a clone, per se - just a good, clean, crisp lager in that general vein.

My initial thinking for the receipe is along the lines of:

Mostly continental pilsner malt
Maybe a half-pound of some light crystal malt
Do a single decoction to bring out some melanoidins (or maybe sub in a wee bit of aromatic malt)

OG around 1.050ish or so

Hops, all Saaz if I can get them, if not, bitter with Tettnag and finish with Saaz (I have a lot of the former and a little bit of the latter already). Maybe what - 15-20 IBUs?


Yeast - anyone have a preference? Looking at WLP800 (Pilsner), WLP802(Czech Budojovice), probably not the German lager yeast, and I do have some Cry Havok. I'm leaning towards the 802, little bit higher attenuation, I'm thinking "crisp" and "refreshing" are the adjectives I'm seeking.

Any thoughts?

 

[Brewsmith]

I don't know that it would need any crystal. Maybe a little carapils, but thats about it. I think you about right on, though. My pilsner was all european pilsner malt. I used WLP 830 and it's great. The hop bill was going to be all Saaz, but I ran out and used a little magnum in the bittering to compensate. I over did the late hops which gave a very strong lemon flavor. Now that it's been in the kegerator a few months it's mellowed out and is turning out to be a very nice beer.

 

[the_bird]

I was debating on the crystal; a few recipes I saw online had a little bit, but I'm thinking you're right - do it real simple. You like the 830? Does that leave a little bit more residual sweetness?

 

[Brewsmith]

I have only done a few lagers, so I can't really compare. Either of the two you suggested should be just fine. From what I've read and heard the difference between many of the lager strains is very subtle.

 

[Brewsmith]

It looks like the 802 is the most attenuative on the White Labs site. I say go for it, should be nice and crisp and clean.

 

[the_bird]

I've emailed my local guy for supplies, requested the 802 if he can get it, the 800 if he can't.

How many IBUs did you shoot for?

 

[Dude]

What about some maize?

 

[the_bird]

European pils, not domestic. Traditional pilsners don't have any adjuncts, do they?

 

[Brewsmith]

I went for about 30 IBU's with a starting gravity of 1.048.
​

 

[the_bird]

Maybe I'll shoot a little higher, then, maybe 25ish. Don't want it overpowering, but I'd prefer a little bit more bitterness (I'll still be drinking MOST of this).

 

[sause]

The pils I did was all 2-row with a rest at 131 for 5mins. Then take your decoction so when you return it the mash temp will be 158. I shot for 1.054 with 40 IBU's. The 131 rest is a combo protein/sac. rest. For well modified malts this is suppose to be the way to do it.

 

[Brewsmith]

You're fine. That's a ratio of about 0.5 BU:GU. I wanted to balance a little more to the hops, closer to about 0.6.

 

[the_bird]

The pils I did was all 2-row with a rest at 131 for 5mins. Then take your decoction so when you return it the mash temp will be 158. I shot for 1.054 with 40 IBU's. The 131 rest is a combo protein/sac. rest. For well modified malts this is suppose to be the way to do it.

I'm scared sh*tless of doing a decoction now; every time I've done one, I've gotten hardly any temperature rise when I add the decoction back to the main mash. I have no idea why, it's been bugging the hell out of me.

 

[Dude]

I'm scared sh*tless of doing a decoction now; every time I've done one, I've gotten hardly any temperature rise when I add the decoction back to the main mash. I have no idea why, it's been bugging the hell out of me.

I know why.

 

[Brewsmith]

I say keep it simple and just do a single infusion. If there's one thing that will definately make it great is a long lagering.

 

[Glibbidy]

Consider my Bohemian Pilzner. It's a staple in my arsenal. Some Decoction required. I even get a little freaky with some crystal and munich in it.

 

[pjj2ba]

I've got two Euro-pils going right now. I've had some commercial ones, albeit cheap imports, that I'm pretty sure had some corn in them.

One of pils has 1.5 lbs of flaked corn in it, plus a little 6-row and rounded out with pilsner malt. OG was 1.050. ~25 IBUs of Sorachi Ace and Glacier.

2nd pils is mostly pilsner malt plus a little carapils, and for the h*ll of it, a lb of oat malt.
OG was 1.045 with 32 IBUs - Magnum and Liberty. I wanted this one to have a good hop bite to it.

I'd skip the caramel malt, especially if you want something light in color. I've yet to try a decoction, but I did do step mashes with a saccharification step at 148 for 60 min followed by 15 min at 158 in an attempt to get some extra dextrins.

I've also use biscuit and aromatic in light pils too. I'm considering toasting a pound of pils malt for an upcoming lager

 

[Kaiser]

I'm scared sh*tless of doing a decoction now; every time I've done one, I've gotten hardly any temperature rise when I add the decoction back to the main mash. I have no idea why, it's been bugging the hell out of me.

Yes, b/c you were going by the calculations for the decoction volume. Pull about 20% more and add the decoction in stages until you reach the temp. This compensates for temp loss and boil-off loss.

I suggest European malt and this mashing schedule. This is how I brew most of my German beers. Skip the protein rest if you are using Durst Turbo Pils. The decoction is only for mash-out, so hitting the temp won't be an issue and the saccrification is reached by infusion which makes it easy to hit its temp precisely. Aim for 149 - 150 *F for 45min until you pull the decoction.

Have you brewed light beers with your water before?

Maize (corn) won't be in a german Pils but may be in a Heineken.

You can go all Tettnang if you don't have the Saaz.

Kai

 

[the_bird]

I still haven't checked my water profile yet...

 

[Beerlord]

I just made this, still in the primary:
10 lbs of piilsner
1 lb of munich
0.5 lbs of caravienne
1 oz of nugget 12.4% for 60
2 oz of 2.3% sazz for 20
1 oz sazz at flame out.

1.043 sg, 34 ibu's