Think I made a mistake

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icebob

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Brew my first all grain yesterday, had some prob with kettle size but manage a solution. Today at work it hit me right in the face:eek: the recipe call for a final amount of 5.5 gallons.... I end up with 4.5 but never top it off to reach the goal... I pitch Nottingham dry yest (rehydrated) and now have small action in the fermenter... is it too late to top if off? I have extra Nottingham yeast here if a repitch is needed.... Thx in advance.
 
You could just leave it. You will just end up with a higher gravity beer.

Or if you are overly concerned add another gallon of water, as long as the temperature of the added water is not extreme you will be fine.
 
Leave it. My move to all grain has been faced with boil/fermentation volumes. It is tough to dial that all in. Although that has been the case, I have just made my OG so topping off to 5 gallons would have often resulted in beer that didn't taste as planned. The exception is last night when I was over my OG but didn't care to change that by topping off.

The thing about this is you do not need to ferment 5.5 gallons. What was your OG? What did you expect your OG to be? If it was high then you could have topped off but I say not to now. The yeast is happily doing its thing and you'll just end up with a higher ABV beer, but it will be beer...just not as much.
 
the recipe call for 1042 OG and I hit it right on the spot with the lower volume...
 
It kind of depends on your planned OG and expectations.
For example, let's say your planned OG was 1.050 for 5G. You now have 4G, but presumably the same amount of sugars, so your new OG would be 1.063.
With some styles that could make a big difference. With others, not so much.
If you do add more water, make sure you boil it, then chill to whatever temp your beer is working at.
Me, most likely I'd leave it as is.
Always check your OG!
OOPS, just saw your latest post. Disregard the above rambling. You hit your planned OG, so don't dilute it.
 
the recipe call for 1042 OG and I hit it right on the spot with the lower volume...

Then do not top off at all. You will end up with a product that isn't as good as the one you have now.

Since you hit it, like I have, you have to dial in a few things. Grain absorption which will help with how much mash and sparge water you use, then boil off, then trub loss. Those three things combined when off will result in lower volumes. If you have a lot of dead space in your mash tun you should account for that as well, I do. It helped but did not cure my issue. I then got my boil off to be slightly more accurate and that then helped more. As I continue to dial in my equipment, I am getting closer to the volumes I should have.
 
the recipe call for 1042 OG and I hit it right on the spot with the lower volume...


In that case then I have some advice and some truth.

Advice: If your OG was what you expected it to be the leave it alone and do not top off. You will end up with 4.5 gallons of the beer you planned on.

Truth: if you planned on having 5.5 gallons with an OG of 1.042 and you got 4.5 gallons then you had some issues getting all the sugars converted.

Sent from my iPhone using Home Brew
 
it was my first all grain, so I'm not expecting it to be perfect, for the mash volume, I went with 1 1/4 quart of water per pound of grain and 1/2 gallon per pound for sparge, I hit the pre boiling volume of 6.5 gallon. Wonder if because I have to split my wort in 2 to fit in my kettles the boil of volume was greater than if I've boiled it in one kettle... (BTW i have a bigger kettle coming in:) )
 
In that case then I have some advice and some truth.

Advice: If your OG was what you expected it to be the leave it alone and do not top off. You will end up with 4.5 gallons of the beer you planned on.

Truth: if you planned on having 5.5 gallons with an OG of 1.042 and you got 4.5 gallons then you had some issues getting all the sugars converted.

Sent from my iPhone using Home Brew

You think I should've preheat the mash tun?the recipe call for a 60 mins mash at 150F, so I heat the water at 160F, and after the mash period the temp was reading 140F...
 
it was my first all grain, so I'm not expecting it to be perfect, for the mash volume, I went with 1 1/4 quart of water per pound of grain and 1/2 gallon per pound for sparge, I hit the pre boiling volume of 6.5 gallon. Wonder if because I have to split my wort in 2 to fit in my kettles the boil of volume was greater than if I've boiled it in one kettle... (BTW i have a bigger kettle coming in:) )
it was my first all grain, so I'm not expecting it to be perfect
That's the most important thing that you have to remember. Dialing in your setup is both annoying AND an intricate part of going AG.

I went with 1 1/4 quart of water per pound of grain
Good ratio. I use closer to 1.33 to 1.5 qt/#, but again this is something that is specific to your setup.

1/2 gallon per pound for sparge
You are overthinking this. Apply the K.I.S.S philosophy (Keep It Simple Stupid)
After you collect your first runnings, subtract the volume from your preboil volume. Then sparge with whatever the difference is.
After your grains have absorbed all the water that they can, WATER IN = WATER OUT.
For instance if you collect 2 gallons of wort when you drain the first time, then you need to add 4.5 gallons of sparge water to get to your preboil volume.

I hit the pre boiling volume of 6.5 gallon.
You need to aim for more preboil volume. With my setup, the magic number is 7.25 gallons preboil to get 5.75 into the fermenter. I usually boil off anywhere between 1.25 and 1.5 gallons per hour depending on the weather conditions.
Splitting it probably did not help, but a larger kettle will definitely help you.

You think I should've preheat the mash tun?the recipe call for a 60 mins mash at 150F, so I heat the water at 160F, and after the mash period the temp was reading 140F...

You think I should've preheat the mash tun?
Most definitely!!!
If you mashed at 140 for an hour, you were low and you will end up with a highly attenuated beer (dry with an alcohol bite/flavor)

K.I.S.S method: Preheat the tun with water around 175 degrees and then stir until it gets down around 165 and then dough in. Stir until you get your temps down to 152-ish and then cover and wait.


My advice is simple:
1) Don't get frustrated, you made beer!:cross:

2) Pick yourself up a copy of Palmer's How to Brew (if you do not already have it)

3) Ask a lot of questions on HBT and a multitude of us are here to help you.:mug:
 
Great advice brewkinger! And icebob- he's absolutely correct. It takes a few batches to dial in your procedures and get used to the ideosyncracies of your particular setup/techniques. Practice makes perfect. Brew on!
 
I'm by no means an expert but one of the first things I realized, after reading through posts books and anything I could find on home brewing, is that there is a general rule of thumb... "Don't worry about it" If its good in the end great if not adjust next time.
 
the only problem i see is that it may be more hoppy than expected. you added hops for 5.5 not 4.5, so in theory, your ibus, aroma, and flavor will be higher than expected. But, some of the best beers i have made had mistakes made. sometimes its just ment to be, brew gods watching over you
 
I think you're water amounts are good--for a 7.5 to 8 lb grain bill. But you would have to add some water to compensate for the water held in the grains--I think around 0.8 gallons. Maybe you didn't get everything out of the grains that you could, which is no big deal--you can always add extract to the kettle, or as you did, just not add the extra water.
 
it was my first all grain, so I'm not expecting it to be perfect, for the mash volume, I went with 1 1/4 quart of water per pound of grain and 1/2 gallon per pound for sparge, I hit the pre boiling volume of 6.5 gallon. Wonder if because I have to split my wort in 2 to fit in my kettles the boil of volume was greater than if I've boiled it in one kettle... (BTW i have a bigger kettle coming in:) )

Yes, I would say that boiling in two kettles resulted in greater boil-off, due to two kettles likely having more surface area than a single bigger boil kettle.

When you get your new pot, do a "dry run" with just some water.

Measure out 5 gallons of cold water and bring it to boil for 60 minutes.
After the 60 minute boil, record the volume (while it's still close to boiling) to see how much you boiled off.

The volume will be 4% higher than it is when cold due to thermal expansion, so take that recorded volume and multiply it by .96. Five gallons minus your corrected final volume is your boil-off rate per hour.

Then cool the water off using your normal chilling method and then transfer it to your carboy or bucket using your normal transfer method. Then record the volume that actually went in to the fermentor. The difference between the corrected final volume and what is in the fermentor is your BK deadspace loss. Hops and hot/cold break will add somewhat to the deadspace volume, but not too much. You can always tweak your numbers after a real brew day.

Then transfer the water from your fermentor to a keg or your bottling bucket and record the amount of water left behind in the fermentor. That will be close to your fermentor losses (actual trub will add more losses).

So now that you know all that, you can calculate your pre-boil volume.

My brewery example:
I usually want 10 gallons of finished beer.
I lose 1/2 gallon per carboy during the fermentation process, so I need 11 gallons of cooled-off wort going into the fermentors (the "batch volume.")
I lose 1/2 gallon to my BK deadspace/pump/hoses, so I need 11.5 gallons of cooled-off wort.
To compensate for thermal expansion, 11.5 gallons of wort x 1.04 = 11.96 (let's call it "12 gallons") should be my target for a final post-boil pre-chilled volume.
I lose about 2.5 gallons in a 60-minute boil (yes, I have a really wide 25 gallon pot) so I need about 14 gallons of wort, pre-boil.
Thermal expansion from room temps to typical mashing temps is about 2%, so that 14 gallons of wort should be reading around 14.25 gallons at mashing temps. So 14.25 gallons is my target pre-boil volume.

I like to use 1.5 quarts of water per pound of grain whenever possible.
I also like to batch sparge and use 2 equal smaller volume sparges instead of 1 big sparge. You should expect to get about a 3% efficiency increase by doing a double sparge as opposed to a single sparge. Of course, it adds time to the brew day, but...eh.
 
You think I should've preheat the mash tun?the recipe call for a 60 mins mash at 150F, so I heat the water at 160F, and after the mash period the temp was reading 140F...

In my personal experience with my own equipment, I found the following out:

If I didn't pre-heat my mash tun, I experienced a 17° loss in temps from my HLT to being done with doughing in.
If I did pre-heat my mash tun, I experienced a 15° loss in temps from my HLT to being done with doughing in.

So instead of going through the hassle of pre-heating the mash tun, I just heated my HLT volume an extra 2°.

A 10° loss during the mash is not good, but you probably know that already. I had about the same amount of temp loss during my first AG batch, and my brew buddy and I fixed the problem by doing the following:
1) Put a layer of aluminum foil down on top of the mash before you close the lid. This will really help keep the heat in the mash where it belongs instead of trying to heat up the air above the mash.
2) Put a sleeping bag over the mash tun while it's mashing.
3) Take some duck tape and seal up the lid opening. We have an old metal cooler, so this one may not really apply to your mash tun.

And once it's mashing, just leave it be. Don't keep opening the lid and checking the temps. I've seen other brewers do this. That's not a good idea.
 
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