Syracuse, ny - round 5 group grain buy

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CidahMastah

CidahMastah

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sounds good jhenderson!

Twogunz - got you down! Hope the oatmeal stout turns out great - I did jamils and it has been a hit so far, I really like it.
 

rustbucket

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im still here... im pretty much set on my grain :p,

right now im putting the finishing touches on my design of a cider press.....
 

jbsengineer

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Two questions:

1) When is the deadline for the group buy?

2) Where do you guys get your C02 filled in Syracuse?
 

rustbucket

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1. it is open until we fill the order of 42 bags. You can see the orders open and closed for splits and how many bags we are up too in post number 2 (if you want in a split such as 1/3 roasted barley, or ext just post what you want added too. this group buy has slowed so your probably looking at end of october early november for a timeline.

2. I typically get mine done at haun welding supply on court street (they typically exchange not refill, just depends on whos working and whats going on, last time i was there they just refilled it), sunset hydro on the blvd also does refills (altho i have not used them for this)
 

drocu

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So I'm starting to accrue a lot of all grain equipment and hope to start brewing all grain once I finish the LME I have left.

Can anyone suggest some grains to start with? I'm guessing a bag of 2-row would be good to start but am pretty lost after that. Also, what brand would be best?

I'm glad to hear that there is a group buy in Western NY.
 

rustbucket

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well, 2row is a good place to start I use the CM-2ROW, if had good experience with it and its really cheap, its a pretty neutral grain.

the next question is what type of beer do you typically brew/ want to brew.
because there is a lot of variety depending on what what you want to do it. such as if you want to brew Strong bitter, i would use some type of UK malt, or even Marris otter(which give you more of a maltier flavor).

I would suggest crystal malts next after you base grains depending on what types you want.

40L and 60L are the most common crystals to have, they are almost in everything

if your into stouts and things of that nature, i would suggest getting roasted barley
 

drocu

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I'm an equal opportunity drinker so I'm pretty open to everything. Right now, I'm sticking mostly with American styles, and I appreciate pale ales, stouts, porters, IPA's, etc.

For crystal/roasted barley, a full bag would be way too much I'm guessing. What do most order? 1/4?
 

copyright1997

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1/4 or 1/3. You will use alot of crystal for all those styles.
Shameless plus for my open C40 split.

As a new all grain brewer with the base malts (2 row, MO) from the previous buys, I can attest I have to keep buying c40 or c60 with just about every recipe I've done so far. Not too far behind them is carapils.
 

zeno27

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I'm an equal opportunity drinker so I'm pretty open to everything. Right now, I'm sticking mostly with American styles, and I appreciate pale ales, stouts, porters, IPA's, etc.

For crystal/roasted barley, a full bag would be way too much I'm guessing. What do most order? 1/4?
These guys give good advice. Definitely pick up some crystal, and if you think you'll brew more than a couple of porters or stouts over the next year, get in on a split of chocolate or the roasted barley. With the group buy, you'll wind up paying literally 1/2 price compared to per pound pricing from an LHBS.

For the base grains, I'd say you have three main possibilities: two-row, Maris Otter (or similar), and pilsner/munich. These very roughly correspond to the principal styles of American, British, and continental (German and Belgian) beers, respectively. Obviously this is an oversimplification, but I think it gives you a rough idea of where to start.
 

drocu

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Thanks for the recommendations and advice. I guess I'm in, especially if there's a pickup in Canandaigua.

I'll take a bag of CM-2Row and can take a share of the following splits:
BZ-CRPL 1/3
GM-C40 1/3
FB-CHOC 1/3
TF-RSTB 1/3
5S-STAR4
5S-PBW50

Is this sufficient or should I PM the people in the splits?

On an unrelated note, how long does this stuff last? Someone gave me half a bag of Pilsen malt for free that is about 2 yrs old. Still good?
 

jhenderson27

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Hell im on almost a year for my 2row. Fresh as can be. All about being stored. No your post is just fine, cidah will pick it up and update the main list. Good start. I personally have at home 2row,TF MO, pilsner, c20,c60,c120, flaked oats, flaked wheat, carapils, choc malt, munich, caramunich, d2candi syrup and many others. All are stored air tight out of light in cool temps.

If your pils was stored good uncrushed you should be all set.
 

drocu

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Yeah...it was just stored in the bag in unknown condition. I guess a better question is, how can you tell if its bad?
 

TwoGunz

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I'll take 1/3 wheat split and jump in on the aromatic one as well
 

stunsm

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I'll take the following:
CM-2ROW x 2
BD-MOPA x 1

And if anyone in the group is interested, I have about 35 green grolsch bottles just taking up space, I'll trade for some other bottles or something, let me know what they're worth to you!
 
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CidahMastah

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Hey guys sorry for being MIA - I believe post 2 has us up to speed - if not, let me know if I missed something.
 
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CidahMastah

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Good for you! I have you down.

Also - it came to my attention that a few onlookers backed out of buying based on the potential cost of storage containers for grain. Let me just chime in here. While I personally have set up grain storage that will maintain grain better than the LHBS, you don't necessarily need to buy containers. If you buy 2-ROW or similar base grains you should have no spoilage issues if you leave the grain in the original bag and twist the top between uses. Or simply buy some giant ziplock bags for your splits.

So key points being:

1. Store the grain whole (uncrushed)

2. you can get containers if you want, but they aren't 100% necessary. Depends on your storage conditions and how looney you want to be about it.

3. keeping the grain at slightly less than room temps (basement) out of excessive moisture/heat will prolong grain storage for up to years.

4. I have never heard of someone having grain spoil from a grain buy. I am sure this has happened, but just saying... common sense in storage goes a long way.

Just some info for the gents on the verge of placing an order but not sure about the cost to store.

21 bags - Half way there!!
 
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CidahMastah

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im still here... im pretty much set on my grain :p,

right now im putting the finishing touches on my design of a cider press.....
Just pressed about 15 gallons of cider this weekend from some apples I came into. Still haven't pressed my trees yet.

I think you had asked about an oil for the press - I think tung oil is the only foodsafe one outside of mineral oil. My press is easily 50 years old, if not more. I don't think it was ever treated. Check out the site I posted below, as the also have some protective coatings for presses.

When I press I don't do anything except wash down all the wood surfaces with a hose. I let them sit a bit then hose down again so the wood takes up some water in the pores instead of just juice. I then hose it all down and let it dry outside for storage. I have a cast iron bottom pressing plate, so for winter storage I coat that with some vegetable oil to prevent rusting.

If I was building one, I would use White Oak - no question that this is the wood you are looking for. It will cost more, but well worth it in the grand scheme. This is the wood that all the old presses were built out of.


Oh yeah - this is the shredder I bought. The website has been upgraded though http://www.happyvalleyranch.com/ - has food safe innards.

It looks like now they even offer it motorized. Unfortunately I think the cost was goosed too. I thought I got mine for 160 or 180?; just the same this shredder is well worth it. Looks like they have some other cool stuff on the site too.
 

copyright1997

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Good for you! I have you down.

Also - it came to my attention that a few onlookers backed out of buying based on the potential cost of storage containers for grain. Let me just chime in here. While I personally have set up grain storage that will maintain grain better than the LHBS, you don't necessarily need to buy containers. If you buy 2-ROW or similar base grains you should have no spoilage issues if you leave the grain in the original bag and twist the top between uses. Or simply buy some giant ziplock bags for your splits.

So key points being:

1. Store the grain whole (uncrushed)

2. you can get containers if you want, but they aren't 100% necessary. Depends on your storage conditions and how looney you want to be about it.

3. keeping the grain at slightly less than room temps (basement) out of excessive moisture/heat will prolong grain storage for up to years.

4. I have never heard of someone having grain spoil from a grain buy. I am sure this has happened, but just saying... common sense in storage goes a long way.

Just some info for the gents on the verge of placing an order but not sure about the cost to store.

21 bags - Half way there!!
I hope I didn't contribute to this. In addition to the above, let me say:
1) I already had some containers with fancy lids for longer term FOOD Storage (because I have mice problems). That's what Cidah and I were discussing...they aren't needed if you are using your grains up in a reasonable time (e.g. < 1 year or so).
2. I've been able to buy 5 gallon food grade containers (used) from my food co-op for $1/each with lid. (Actually less as I get a member discount.)
3.Walmart WHITE 5 gallon paint containers have been discussed in other places and have been found to be food grade. They are $2.97/each. What I'm trying to say here is that you don't have to spend a lot of $ EVEN IF you want to store the grains in containers.

If you brew every other week and do a 5 gallon brew, you will likely use 10# or so of grains each time...so that 55 pound sack will be gone in about 12 weeks! (That is, before you know it!).
 
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CidahMastah

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Copyright - this isn't pointed at anyone ;) Just wanted to make sure the guys considering buying realize that they have options if they don't want to go straight out nuts like many of us on here have. There is no reason (aside from the ridiculously low cost) that many of us should have all the grain and the specialties that we have in our basements! :drunk:

Thanks for helping debunk the high cost of containers myth :D
 
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CidahMastah

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Drocu - those are the ones I have - cheap and work great.


]LOCAL HONEY
Hey all - anybody have a source on local honey? I am looking for orange blossom and buckwheat. If you do - please PM me!
 

TwoGunz

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I find it convenient to soak my grain for a bit in warm water, rinse it, and then store it some of these:
 
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CidahMastah

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ha! i assume there is supposed to be a keg or beer bottle pic? ;)
 
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CidahMastah

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Hey rust - this is my shredder set up, since I forgot to show it to you.

IMG_5110.jpg


2.jpg


3.jpg


4.jpg


5.jpg
 

Smashing

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Waiting to see if I get the mill I asked for my birthday this month. If I do I'll prolly be adding 2 or 3 bags to the count.
 
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CidahMastah

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Got you down jhenderson.

Smashing - sounds good, hope it sparks some more participation. If this keeps dragging I will have to add more to my order ;)
 

TwoGunz

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I goofed when I jumped on the last wheat split, I thought it was flaked wheat. Not sure what you use malted wheat with.

Cidah, can you switch me to the flaked?
 
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CidahMastah

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I goofed when I jumped on the last wheat split, I thought it was flaked wheat. Not sure what you use malted wheat with.

Cidah, can you switch me to the flaked?
I can switch you for sure (you interested in going halves with jhenderson to close it out or 1/3rds).

However if you don't have malted wheat in your cash I would recc it. Any hefes or dunkels or american wheats (sam adams summer ale), some porters and many more benefit from wheat. It improves head as well in small doses.

I am shot so I will update tomorrow.

Peace!
 

TwoGunz

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I'm not a fan of hefs but am interested in using wheat as an addition in various styles... Is flaked or malted more appropriate?
 

TwoGunz

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I haven't used wheat yet but I think the raw form will better fit the sorts of things I might use it for.
 
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CidahMastah

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I haven't used wheat yet but I think the raw form will better fit the sorts of things I might use it for.
I have used both and I think there are differences, but they aren't crazy differences. One is malted, one is not. So conversion for raw wheat usually isn't as good as the conversion for malted wheat.

I think the other key difference is flaked wheat is more for thicker/silky mouthfeel than malted wheat. Kind of like using flaked oats. Flavor wise there probably is a difference but i think malted is much more quaffable, with flaked lending to a more sipped at brew. Not that it will make a beer heavy necessarily. The sam adams clone goes down well with flaked wheat - but not nearly as fast as a BMC would.

All that is just my personal experience with brewing witbiers with flaked wheat and dunkels, hefes and american wheat. So YMMV

I updated your request though...
 

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