Swagelok 1/2" tubing bender

[EuBrew]

Anyone know where I can pick up a swagelok 1/2" tubing bender for a reasonable price? I've checked ebay and there are not any listed right now.

 

[BrewBeemer]

Option?
http://store.harryepstein.com/cp/TubingBender/408.html

I added one of these to my bender collection, 5/8" off ebay, list $511 I paid $189
for a slightly used in like new condition.
http://www.drillspot.com/products/365427/Ridgid_358_Tube_Bender?s=1

Swagelok vs Ridgid in the 400 and 500 series I find no difference in bend quality, Swagelok are nice but super proud of their product price reflects.

 

[EuBrew]

not sure? Experts weigh in?? I've never bent stainless and I'm a bit anal when it comes to my building. Will the Ridgid 408 provide a quality kink/wrinkle free bend in 1/2" stainless tubing? If that is the case then I'll be ordering one soon!!

 

[kladue]

The Rigid 408 bender will work well if the tube wall thickness is .035 or greater, .020 wall tube requires a bender with internal mandrel (Parker 412) to keep tubing from wrinkling. Like BrewBeemer has stated, Swagelok is mighty proud of their benders and for just a few bends they are overkill, look for Rigid or Imperial tube benders at lower price. A few simple things to know about the bender and measuring, when measuring from left to right, use the "L" mark for a 90 degree bend end to center, when measuring right to left use the "R" mark for a 90 degree bend end to center, for a 45 degree bend it does not matter which direction use the "45" mark. Look on the moving handle for the marks and make sure the "0" mark on the inner shoe and the handle are aligned when setting the bend mark to the letter "L or R" guide mark on the handle.

 

[EuBrew]

Ah, glad you put the wall thickness in. I'll be ordering my tubing soon so now I know what to look for. Thanks!!

BREW ON!!

 

[BrewBeemer]

Sorry EuBrew I just threw out these benders with 400 and 500 Ridgid series model numbers without mentioning the minimum tubing wall thicknesses before wrinkling becomes a problem. I took it for granted on these minimum thickness as a given or known limits from working with SS and copper hand benders.
Keep the slipper oiled as the material is like a sponge, I use 80-90 wt gear oil having sulfur with a high shear strength.
BTW why are you looking at 1/2" tubing as this is a OD measurement? Example; .049" wall your at .402" ID.
With 5/8" SS tubing at .065" wall your at .495" ID, with .083 wall you'll have .459" ID.
My thinking for a correctly built SS plumbed system is to use 5/8" .065" wall tubing to keep the complete system at 1/2" ID (.495" ID with .065" wall) for high volume low restriction pumping. There's one more Ridgid 5/8" rachet Ridgid bender on ebay at $159 you pay shipping unless it has been "buy it now" sold. I paid $189 free shipping from Pa.

 

[BrewBeemer]

Kladue; check this out, a 555 Greenlee by any chance vs Swagelok painted on the bender or a 555 made by Swagelok.

EuBrew, good luck finding a MS-HTB-8 bender as all i've run across are 1/4" and 3/8" Swagelok benders used on ebay, those available were overpriced.

A recon Parker 412, hold your hat on the used price;
http://www.trysurplus.com/parker-412-tube-bender-reconditioned.aspx

 

[kladue]

The 412 is the smaller version of the 424 Parker which runs about $5K with all the shoes and bars from 1/4" -1-1/4". I have used and abused the Greenlee 555 bending pipe and heavy wall tubing for hydraulic systems, lot's of fun when you are working solo and trying to hold the pipe and press the buttons. The company has benders for up to 4" pipe, beyond that we send it to a shop that is setup to do large bore pipe. Most interesting tube to bend was the 150K PSI tubing for water knife application on a paper machine, 3/8" Od 3/32 Id stainless, like bending a solid rod.
http://www.autoclave.com/products/fittings_and_tubing/high/high_pressure_tubing.html

 

[BrewBeemer]

I saw a loaded with dies a 555 go for $750, such a deal.
Yeah too bad that water knife tubing didn't come in 2" OD,
add pressed journals for a grain mill.
We had water knives back in 76 at Weyerhauser on the corrugator,
respect working maintenance tripping a photo cell while it's still hot.
A leaking hydraulic line with only oil vapor smell can cut you to the bone instantly.
Kevin; you by chance know if 5/8" tube Swagelok to 1/2" and 3/4" NPT what the ID is at both fittings at the NPT end?
There's plenty of meat left to bore out to 1/2" even on a 1/2" NPT fitting to maintain a 1/2" ID tubing and fitting system without restrictions is my thinking.

 

[BrewBeemer]

EuBrew; backing up to reply #6 if you compare your 1/2" OD tubing with .402" ID vs 5/8" OD tube of .495" ID the 5/8" has 1.516 times more cross sectional area, 1/x equals .659 cross sectional area. A simple choice which size tube flows more with less pump restriction and back pressure.

 

[EuBrew]

EuBrew; backing up to reply #6 if you compare your 1/2" OD tubing with .402" ID vs 5/8" OD tube of .495" ID the 5/8" has 1.516 times more cross sectional area, 1/x equals .659 cross sectional area. A simple choice which size tube flows more with less pump restriction and back pressure.

Agreed that the flow is better in the 5/8 and I'm just starting my materials list for my build so maybe you can help me out with the restriction problem. Obviously you want to keep restriction points down to a minimum but what real world problems does this cause? Not playing devil's advocate here I simply don't know the answer. Also sourcing 5/8 from the little time I've spent on looking since your first post looks like a nightmare. These fittings are expensive enough without having to pay retail for all of them!

 

[BrewBeemer]

Here's a quick ebay example of 1/2" Swagelok fittings, rather cheap you just have to shop around.http://cgi.ebay.com/Swagelok-Stainl...337?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item35ad090999
At my end my company has a great connection with a metals supplier I still get a special rate on materials like 5/8" x .065" tubing i'll need.
With 5/8" Swagelock fittings my custom SS marine fab shop friend can get me fittings at his cost. I'm lucky this way reducing my material bill to 1/2 or 1/3 the cost you'll find on the net. Heart attack time you bet if I had to pay the advertized full prices your seeing. Call me cheap, saved money spent on other needed items.
With my planned 26 gallon brewery build I decided on 1/2" ID tubing thru out the system preventing flow problems going with smaller tubing, i'd rather throttle down flows than have weak flows.

 

[kladue]

With the swagelok fittings you can get the tube to pipe fittings "Bore Through" so the tubing Od is maintained through the fitting. With the new system plumbing all in 1/2" tubing it looks like the tubing pressure drop is not going to be a limiting factor, grain bed compaction over 1 GPM flow will be the limiting factor. With a series 3 LG pump pushing, it is not hard to exceed the 1.3 GPM limit of the flow meter, so I do not think you will have problems with 1/2" tubing as most of the runs will be fairly short. If you go copper water tube then the 5/8" fittings would be the way to go, better if you had the ratchet bender by Rigid to bend the copper to reduce the number of fittings and pressure drop there.

 

[EuBrew]

Here's a quick ebay example of 1/2" Swagelok fittings, rather cheap you just have to shop around.http://cgi.ebay.com/Swagelok-Stainl...337?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item35ad090999
At my end my company has a great connection with a metals supplier I still get a special rate on materials like 5/8" x .065" tubing i'll need.
With 5/8" Swagelock fittings my custom SS marine fab shop friend can get me fittings at his cost. I'm lucky this way reducing my material bill to 1/2 or 1/3 the cost you'll find on the net. Heart attack time you bet if I had to pay the advertized full prices your seeing. Call me cheap, saved money spent on other needed items.
With my planned 26 gallon brewery build I decided on 1/2" ID tubing thru out the system preventing flow problems going with smaller tubing, i'd rather throttle down flows than have weak flows.

Unfortunately I don't have the connections so I'll be limited to ebay and scouring the net for parts. My tubing will be the smallest diameter I use in my build and as stated earlier will be .430ish inside diameter with .035 wall tubing. I'd love to be able to go with 5/8 through the build but I can't justify the cost and extra time it will take to source the parts. There are plenty of systems out there running with less than optimal fluid path diameter so I think I'll be ok. Thanks for the input though, it's always good to see what other opinions are to build the best mouse trap!

 

[BrewBeemer]

With the swagelok fittings you can get the tube to pipe fittings "Bore Through" so the tubing Od is maintained through the fitting. With the new system plumbing all in 1/2" tubing it looks like the tubing pressure drop is not going to be a limiting factor, grain bed compaction over 1 GPM flow will be the limiting factor. With a series 3 LG pump pushing, it is not hard to exceed the 1.3 GPM limit of the flow meter, so I do not think you will have problems with 1/2" tubing as most of the runs will be fairly short. If you go copper water tube then the 5/8" fittings would be the way to go, better if you had the ratchet bender by Rigid to bend the copper to reduce the number of fittings and pressure drop there.

My plan is to bore out to 1/2" and still maintain the step for the tubing to butt inside the fitting for a smooth bore with flow preventing any step causing spots for collecting grain particles. With larger 1/2" tubing compaction problems limits the flow amount but not with transfering to the BK, whirlpooling and CFC. Biggest investment has been the racheting bender which I plan to use for the HERMS coil. BTW Kevin I recall you have a SS coil bent into a octagon, this built that way with a tubong bender vs rolled or a "as found" coil and put to use?

 

[BrewBeemer]

Unfortunately I don't have the connections so I'll be limited to ebay and scouring the net for parts. My tubing will be the smallest diameter I use in my build and as stated earlier will be .430ish inside diameter with .035 wall tubing. I'd love to be able to go with 5/8 through the build but I can't justify the cost and extra time it will take to source the parts. There are plenty of systems out there running with less than optimal fluid path diameter so I think I'll be ok. Thanks for the input though, it's always good to see what other opinions are to build the best mouse trap!

The .035" wall thickness mentioned scares me even with my 5/8" bender with a roller arm causing possible tubing collapse and wrinkling problems, this is why I plan on using .065" wall. On your stainless purchase be sure to get the softest annealed stainless available as it comes in different hardness unless your switching over to copper.

 

[bad coffee]

depending on how big your tube is, you can fill it with water and freeze overnight. It will help thin wall stuff keep it's shape while bending.

B

 

[kladue]

The "Octagon CFC" is 1/2" od tube inside and 1" od tube outside 20' long, bent 45 Deg at each bend. A lot of fun when trying to bend it with tight coil spacing and working by ones self. This is an upsized and more compact version of the 3/8" inside 5/8" outside rectangle CFC on the old system. The CFC is fed with 30 degree coolant from the cooling system built with 2 remote water chillers, a 50L keg for a storage tank, and a march mdxt-3 pump for circulation.

 

[jpc]

depending on how big your tube is, you can fill it with water and freeze overnight. It will help thin wall stuff keep it's shape while bending.

B

Never heard that before... But I have heard of people filling the tubing with sand prior to bending, for the same reason.

 

[BrewBeemer]

Water frozen to -22*C will produce 2,700 atm. or 40,000 PSI of pressure, i'd bet just freezing water with thin wall stainless would split it when straight not alone at a higher stressed location as during a bending process.

In the past i've used this metal, filled small brass tubing up to 1/4" bend it then melted it out in a pot of boiling water.
It's not a food grade item, melts at 158*F and fun to work with.