substitute CARAFA 2, 200L WEYERMANN for pale chocolate malt?

[chemman14]

I want to brew the old monster barley wine from brewing classic styles and it calls for .25 lb of pale chocolate malt. My LHBS doesnt carry pale chocolate malt but they carry a product called CARAFA 2, 200L WEYERMANN. The description is as follows from their website.
CARAFA 2, 200L WEYERMANN. The darkest German coloring grain. Adds the dark, dry flavor of Schwartzbier. A little to darken festbiers. De-husked, non-bittering.
Could I just substitute this for pale chocolate malt?

 

[Poobah58]

Carafa is german chocolate malt. Carafa II was in the 420L range, not 200L.

 

[Austinhomebrew]

Actually it is more like a smooth Black Patent. It is not a chocolate malt.

Forrest

 

[SpanishCastleAle]

Actually it is more like a smooth Black Patent. It is not a chocolate malt.

Forrest

Weyermann calls it 'Chocolate Roasted Malt' on their website so that's prob why it's commonly referred to as a chocolate malt. I've never used enough to really tell (I've only used an ounce or two for color). Maybe I should try it in a Porter if it's more similar to Black Patent.

 

[Austinhomebrew]

It really doesn't taste like chocolate malt, no matter what Weyermann says. I would use it in a recipe that calls for Black Patent but you want the flavor to be smother and less astringent.

Forrest

 

[remilard]

Get the pale chocolate online, there is no substitute for it.

 

[SpanishCastleAle]

Get the pale chocolate online, there is no substitute for it.

What is the difference between it and regular chocolate malt (other than the Lovibond rating)? I just got a pound to try out and was gonna use it (exclusively as far as dark roasted grains) in an Northern English Brown.

 

[chemman14]

ok, I will just order the pale chocolate malt and throw in the 1/4 lb with my other specialty grains in the mill at the LHBS. Hopefully they wont mind

 

[SpanishCastleAle]

ok, I will just order the pale chocolate malt and throw in the 1/4 lb with my other specialty grains in the mill at the LHBS. Hopefully they wont mind

I've heard jamilz say a similar thing remilard did, that there is no substitute. Maybe if you mention that there is no substitute they'll start to carry it.

 

[remilard]

What is the difference between it and regular chocolate malt (other than the Lovibond rating)? I just got a pound to try out and was gonna use it (exclusively as far as dark roasted grains) in an Northern English Brown.

It is less roasted/harsh and more chocolaty.

If you do something like a Northern Brown with like half a pound of it per 5 gallons, you basically can't make that beer without it. You could use half as much regular chocolate but it will be less chocolaty and more roasty (though at 4 oz per 5 gallons, not very roasty).

I also use it a lot in beers where I will use regular chocolate anyway, because I can push the total amount of chocolate malt and character higher without risking an objectionably flavor by using even parts of both.

 

[Bosium]

I have used pale choc (UK) before in place of normal chocolate malt and didn't care for the result one little bit. Beware, it is a lot more roasty / coffee-like than normal chocolate. There is no real substitute for it afaik.

 

[SpanishCastleAle]

I have used pale choc (UK) before in place of normal chocolate malt and didn't care for the result one little bit. Beware, it is a lot more roasty / coffee-like than normal chocolate. There is no real substitute for it afaik.

That's almost exactly opposite what remilard said about it. And it goes against intuition (not that that means much).

Pale Chocolate malt (~200 L) is MORE roasty/coffee-ish than regular Chocolate malt (~400 L)? Are you sure?

 

[Bosium]

Well for a start, chocolate malt here in the UK is 900-1200 EBC, (+- 450-600 SRM), and pale choc is 500-600 EBC (250-300 SRM).

I have used both and I noticed a more pronounced coffee flavour from the pale, although it was definitely smoother than regular chocolate. This is my own personal experience of course, but I definitely found them to have distinctly different tastes.

 

[SpanishCastleAle]

Those seem darker than the ones I get (although they are also from the UK). My reg Chocolate malt is Simpsons and is rated at 375-450 L (per the Midwest Supplies website) and the Pale Chocolate is T&F and is rated at 207 L (per same). I use 410L for the reg and 205L for the pale in my recipe calculator, but I haven't actually brewed with the pale yet. I guess I'll know firsthand soon enough.

 

[remilard]

I get the TF 200L. The only other one I have seen was Simpsons I think and also 200L, so I guess my comments apply only to the pale chocolate the homebrew shops in the US carry (though it is all English in origin).

 

[Bosium]

If I have muddied the waters, I do apologise. I just meant to share some of my personal experience with pale choc, but don't let me deter you. I'd be interested to see what your observations are. Good luck!