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Still full layer of kraeusen after 3 weeks!

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nasmeyer

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I had a previous question on bottling my Solsun Ale after 3 weeks in my primary here https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f39/3-weeks-airlock-still-active-109842/ since my airlock was still active (bubble every 20 seconds) I decided to take a gravity reading and found out it is still fully covered with a nice thick layer of kraeusen!! My question now would not be when do I bottle but why do I still have kraeusen after 3 weeks? is it just fermenting slowly due to me keeping it at low 64-66* fermenting temp? Should I wait it out? or move it to a warmer room to speed fermentation up? rack to a secondary? Does 3724 take longer than other ale yeast? My other 4 batches started clearing between 7-14 days but all were done in a warmer part of the house.
 
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nasmeyer

nasmeyer

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I have only had slow fermentation like that in 2 instances. High gravity ales and low O2 content. Did you oxygenate the wort before yeast addition?
Yes, I shook my boiled (and cooled) H2O before I added it to the cooled wort, and I shook the primary before adding the yeast for 45 seconds, should have had plenty of oxygen.
 
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nasmeyer

nasmeyer

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Check the Wyeast website. This Saison yeast is slow AND likes a higher temperature.
I saw their temps too, but after I followed the recipe from my local brew store that said 64-68*

Anyone know what problems or off flavors I might have if I move it to a warmer location now? It will likely be in the primary for 4-5 weeks total and fermented through 2 temp ranges when done.
 

beerthirty

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Most fermentation occurs at the beginning, you should be safe to move to a warmer location now. When making Belgians the norm is to start low for the first 2-3 days then ramp up. I know its not Belgian but yeast are the same creature just different strains.
 

SumnerH

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Most fermentation occurs at the beginning, you should be safe to move to a warmer location now. When making Belgians the norm is to start low for the first 2-3 days then ramp up.
This is true but note that "ramp up" usually just means "let the temperature climb as it wants", not "raise the ambient temp".

Usually if you have an ale that wants to ferment at 65, you'll pitch it slightly below there and then as it generates fermentation activity you'll work to keep the temperature right at 65 (by cooling the ambient temp).

With most belgians you let them ramp up as they see fit: you'd pitch at 65 and let the yeast's natural activity raise the ferm temp (ie don't swamp-cooler the fermentor or otherwise keep it reigned in as you normally do with most ales), but you still don't actively raise the ambient temperatures.
 
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nasmeyer

nasmeyer

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OK, I brought my primary back upstairs where it is 69-70* How long should I expect it to "pick up where it left off" and finish fermentation? will the 3 weeks at 65* cause any adverse problems especially if I go 4-5 weeks total in the primary? Would there be any advantage to racking to a secondary to help clean anything up (from the 3 weeks of slow fermentation) when the primary is done?
 

HotbreakHotel

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When the yeast is fermenting at the higher temps, it will produce more esters, which are typically desirable in a Saison. When it's fermenting at the lower temps, it will produce fewer esters. So the time it was at the lower temp will cause it to have fewer esters, that's all, a little cleaner taste. It certainly won't ruin the beer, but it could lack some yeast character you might be looking for (or who knows, you might like it better). In theory, there would be less to "clean up".

You might want to rack because of risk of yeast autolysis after 3 weeks of heavy fermentation. Others may have a different opinion, but if it were me I'd rack.
 
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nasmeyer

nasmeyer

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You might want to rack because of risk of yeast autolysis after 3 weeks of heavy fermentation. Others may have a different opinion, but if it were me I'd rack.
Are you suggesting I rack now after the first 3 weeks of fermentation? or rack after 3 more weeks which would be 6 weeks total? Im not sure how heavy the fermentation was for the first 3 weeks but it was bubbling throught the airlock steady at first, and then every 20 seconds the 2nd and 3rd weeks.
 

beerthirty

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This is true but note that "ramp up" usually just means "let the temperature climb as it wants", not "raise the ambient temp".

Usually if you have an ale that wants to ferment at 65, you'll pitch it slightly below there and then as it generates fermentation activity you'll work to keep the temperature right at 65 (by cooling the ambient temp).

With most belgians you let them ramp up as they see fit: you'd pitch at 65 and let the yeast's natural activity raise the ferm temp (ie don't swamp-cooler the fermentor or otherwise keep it reigned in as you normally do with most ales), but you still don't actively raise the ambient temperatures.
There has been some discussion on this in other threads. I wont say whether its right or wrong as I haven't tired it yet. By raising the ambient temp you encourage the yeast to finish at a lower FG. This can be detrimental during the first couple days when fermentation is the strongest( causing excess esters). By ramping ambient after that time the end product ends being a clean fully fermented beverage.

I have let beers sit for 8 weeks with no signs of autolysis.
 

enderwig

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Jamil mentions having needed to raise the temp to 85 with saison yeast before. He said something along the lines of it needing to stay above 75 after the first 3-4 days. Give this podcast a listen.
 
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