Spike Brewing - Ben Caya

[genotype]

And their reply

"Nope, we are not welding them. We are using the Flexseal as a reinforcing joint. Since doing this about 1-2 months ago we've seen 0 leaks. We are confident this will fix your issue and apologize in advance for the inconvenience!! Please confirm your shipping address to send the sealant to, thanks!"

Back at ya

Please send me a replacement chiller with the fix already applied. I'm on my 3rd unit and I should not be expected to attempt to fix what was obviously a design fault in the unit.

 

[wickedbeernut]

(deleted)

 

[Thorrak]

I'm experiencing the exact same thing right now -- received my second unit back in December, and found a puddle of glycol on the floor this past weekend. Their recommended solution is the same as well -- sending out a bottle of flex seal that they want me to apply. I'm politely declining that, but I don't know what (if any) alternatives are available in this case.

Send them this picture of Spike Glycol Chiller reservoirs with TIG-welded seams and a welded female nipple to accept the bottom drain. Tell them you want one of these. Don't settle for Flex Seal, even if Spike is willing to apply it. That's just yet another Band-Aid that will also fail with time.

View attachment 869260

Any idea where these photos came from? I saw you (I think?) linked them on Reddit via Imgur, but the Imgur link now seems to be deleted.

 

[wickedbeernut]

(deleted)

 

[wickedbeernut]

Note that Spike is currently selling refurbished Glycol Chillers in the "Bargain Cave" for $699. If you preordered the Spike Glycol Chiller as part of the "kickstarter" in early September 2023, you paid $850. I'd hate to think anyone paid $999 for the Spike Glycol Chiller 1.0 or 2.0. If you settle for anything less than a brand new Spike Glycol Chiller 3.0 with a TIG-welded reservoir, you're getting screwed. If you agree to apply Flex Seal, you just devalued your Spike Glycol Chiller by $300. Don't do it!

 

[shoengine]

Having just had to pump all of the coolant out of my chiller, I can definitely see the value in a drain, but if it isn't made properly then that reduces the value entirely.

I don't own any Spike equipment but I kinda liked them. I hope they pull out of what looks like a tail spin.

 

[wickedbeernut]

(deleted)

 

[genotype]

I just sent them the picture of the welded seams and nipple. Waiting to hear back.

 

[shoengine]

I get your points, and partially agree to them but I said there was value in a bottom drain. A gimmick is something with no intrinsic value. Even my refrigerator having wifi to notify me that it needs its filter changed has some value, although that really is sort of borderline with gimmick.

If you want to drain the reservoir, turn on the pump.

I feel entitled to nitpick because I had to drain my chiller recently several times. A bottom drain would have been exceptionally helpful. As it was, I did use the pump to drain it out those times but I was still left with 2-3 inches of liquid. That would be a lot of rags. Fortunately I had a drill driven pump I had bought decades ago that I had never used for a specific project and was able to extract all but a thimbleful of liquid which I sopped up with rags.

Earlier I was not stating an opinion, I was stating a fact. A bottom drain has value. If it leaks, it no longer has value and is a liability.

 

[Deadalus]

I get your points, and partially agree to them but I said there was value in a bottom drain. A gimmick is something with no intrinsic value. Even my refrigerator having wifi to notify me that it needs its filter changed has some value, although that really is sort of borderline with gimmick.



I feel entitled to nitpick because I had to drain my chiller recently several times. A bottom drain would have been exceptionally helpful. As it was, I did use the pump to drain it out those times but I was still left with 2-3 inches of liquid. That would be a lot of rags. Fortunately I had a drill driven pump I had bought decades ago that I had never used for a specific project and was able to extract all but a thimbleful of liquid which I sopped up with rags.

Earlier I was not stating an opinion, I was stating a fact. A bottom drain has value. If it leaks, it no longer has value and is a liability.

Fridge water and air filter notification by wifi would be a gimmick to me as I already ignore the red warning lights until I am ready to order! The wifi itself can be very helpful in diagnosing issues depending on manufacturer.

An autosiphon could be used pretty easily too. I have a side drain on my Brewbuilt but haven't had to drain it.

 

[genotype]

Per Spike support:

I really can't speak to the reservoirs some guy on Reddit is claiming. I can tell you that we have 0 chillers with that reservoir.

The chiller you would be sent is a brand new chiller that we still sell for $1,000. The chillers in the Bargain Cave are chillers that are used and have leaked which we have fixed (as stated on the website).

 

[Yesfan]

Per Spike support:

I really can't speak to the reservoirs some guy on Reddit is claiming. I can tell you that we have 0 chillers with that reservoir.

The chiller you would be sent is a brand new chiller that we still sell for $1,000. The chillers in the Bargain Cave are chillers that are used and have leaked which we have fixed (as stated on the website).

No mention on how they fixed those leaks (flexseal or tig welded?). No problem reminding you all sales are final if you purchase one. At the very least, I think @SpikeBrewing should list how those repairs were made, so the home brewer knows what they are getting.

 

[hilljack13]

If you unscrew the adjustment knob you can pull the plunger assembly. I just wipe some on the seal with my finger.

Is the leak referred to on the AIO when all the CO2 runs through the top instead of the three side holes? Both of my AIO's are doing this now. I questioned Spike and they said it was normal??? Before they both released all CO2 through the side holes so I don't believe it is normal.

 

[matt_m]

There’s no seal above the holes so it could come out the top or the sides. Either way it’s bubbling through the liquid

 

[wickedbeernut]

(deleted)

 

[SpikeBrewing]

Holy out of control thread! Ben with Spike here. I haven't been on HBT in years. Glad the forum is still around! Thanks to whoever tagged us so we go notified.

LOTS of misinformation being spread here mainly by Joe (wickedbeernut). I'll try to give some clarity but I'll monitor this thread for a few days so people can ask questions and get actual information.

Ben Story
About 3 years ago I took a step back from the day to day and gave the keys to our leadership team to run. I moved to Texas and started another company. That's been my main focus recently. There have been huge issues with out of stock products, long lead times, quality issues, delayed product launches, etc, etc. In Oct 2024 I decided the only way to right the ship was to jump back in the day to day. It's been a lot of 12hr+ days over the last few months but I can confidently say that we are caught up and better than ever. Orders are going out mostly same day. If you look at our site there is currently one product out of stock (CF5 heater). We track quality as a % by each product line and we only have 5 total part numbers with a replacement rate over 2% (our action threshold). 5 is the lowest it's been in a LONG time. Customer service tickets are also down massively. Things are just running insanely smoothly and better than they ever have.

Layoffs
I decided to let about 5 people go in late 2024. Home brewing is down about 70% and commercial is down about 90%. We're mainly home brewing but either way it doesn't make sense to have 3 welders on staff when 1 works; simple math. At one point we had 5 people in Engineering. However that was when we spent about $2m in R&D developing the All-In-One PRV, Solo Panel, Flow Pump, Grain Mill, Counterflow Chiller, Mill, Solo and Trio tables, and probably another half dozen I'm forgetting. There isn't a need for 5 engineers now that all those projects are done and at steady state. This goes department by department. We just don't need 3 people in a department anymore when 1 person or even 1 part time person can handle it.

Current Staff
It was mentioned we only have 6 people or something like that. I wish we could operate that lean. For staff/in house people, we have about 6 full time. However that doesn't count the other 10 people that are part time, contract, remote, etc. We have 4 contract welders alone that help with all the welding. The fact that Joe is poking at my Dad coming in to work with his son and help out just shows the character that he has. It's really sad and disgusting.

Facebook User Group Bans
I've seen multiple places that we are banning people and we are controlling the Spike User Group. I'd recommend you reach out to Brandon Starkey who is the main Admin of the group who has no affiliation with Spike. The decision was made to start banning detractors from the group. This was not a Spike decision or order. The group is suppose to be a positive place to discuss brewing beer. A few people, who stated they will never buy Spike again, decided that they were going to comment negatively on every single post that ever got brought up. The group started to get hostile and just overall negative. Those detractors can go complain else where (thus this thread being created).

State of Homebrewing
Like I mentioned, home brewing is down about 70%. Nobody (relative to previous years) is brewing beer, buying equipment or even patronizing craft breweries. We've seen more breweries closing than opening. Our main competitors are Blichmann and Ss and I wouldn't be surprised if one or both go under in 2025. Ss was bought for their commercial side. That has pretty much gone to 0 and Middleby is rolling that brand into Deutsche Equipment. Wouldn't be surprised if they shut the home brew arm down. Blichmann is in the same boat from my POV. They hasn't really been any innovation on the home side and they've really pivoted to the commercial side over the last few years. Well, that side is completely dried up and now you have all that overhead to maintain. We'll see what happens with them...

On the other hand, I saw this trend coming years ago. We were about 30% done with a new fame mounted 3bbl system and I killed it because I saw that nobody was going commercial especially with the interest rates the way they are. We have cut our head count from over 25 full time people during Covid to about 6 full time and the 10+ contract people that we can flex up or down as demand is needed. Basically, if there is a brand that is going under I'm 100% confident it won't be us. Our financials are super healthy, our balance sheet is even healthier and we have $1m+ in inventory.

Glycol Chiller
No beating around the bush... this was a failed product launch. The leaking issue was terrible and has plagued us up until recently. Luckily about 2mo ago we found a really solid fix. We reinforced the joints with an epoxy joint and then Flexseal over that. The epoxy adds strength and the Flexseal absorbs any impacts during shipping. Since we started shipping units like this I think we've had 1 leaker (and this is out of 100s of units). The units in the Bargain Cave are units that we've received back that were leakers. We've cleaned them up and sealing them using the new technique. Joe keeps posting the prototype welded tanks (which I sent in confidentially so I'm assuming he'll be getting a nice letter from our attorney soon...) however this is just a prototype. Best case scenario if everything passes my testing is these will be in house in late 2025. If you'd like to wait until then, go ahead! However, the units going out don't leak and won't leak. The tank design provides no functional differences to the end user so I'm not sure why it's such a big deal to some people. We stand behind all of our equipment (even the Bargain Cave Chillers we're selling).


Again, lots of misinformation from people with too much time on their hands. If you don't want to buy from us then don't; it's a free country. But not sure why some people want to make it there life's mission to try and talk negatively about a small company filled with really hard working dedicated employees. Soon enough we'll be the only home brew brand around so don't burn your bridge In the meantime if people want to have a cordial convo I'm happy to answer questions!

 

[wickedbeernut]

(deleted)

 

[SpikeBrewing]

It's unfortunate you feel the need to sic your attorney on me for sharing with the Spike community the fact that you will be offering a new Spike Glycol Chiller with a TIG-welded reservoir. This is exactly the kind of remark which resulted in this thread being created.

Joe,

As my email to you clearly stated, the information discussed was privileged and confidential. It's not "sic'ing" attorneys when you clearly broke the confidentiality. We are a very transparent company. The problem is IF (again if not for sure) we decide to change to the welded tank and try to do anything with patents you now publicly disclosed the design and we are now not able to do so. So again, I'll kindly ask you to remove any posts you've scattered around the internet. I don't want to pay my attorney to get involved but you're blatantly breaking confidentiality AND causing harm to my company.

You seem very fixated on this product and issue which doesn't concern you at all. You have a chiller and it works flawlessly. Like I stated in my email, I'd kindly ask that we part ways and you move on. We're not giving refunds on chillers that work. We're not doing a recall (as you keep pushing) on chillers that work. And if we do come out with an updated reservoir it'll be like the new iPhone and nothing will be done for people that already bought and have a perfectly working chiller. If people have issues we resolve them. Please for the love of the community just drop it and move one. If you want a refund on your chiller email me and I'd be happy to do it so we can put a pin in this.

(attachment was removed due to showing personal information - mod)

 

[Thorrak]

Joe,

As my email to you clearly stated, the information discussed was privileged and confidential. It's not "sic'ing" attorneys when you clearly broke the confidentiality. We are a very transparent company. The problem is IF (again if not for sure) we decide to change to the welded tank and try to do anything with patents you now publicly disclosed the design and we are now not able to do so. So again, I'll kindly ask you to remove any posts you've scattered around the internet. I don't want to pay my attorney to get involved but you're blatantly breaking confidentiality AND causing harm to my company.

You seem very fixated on this product and issue which doesn't concern you at all. You have a chiller and it works flawlessly. Like I stated in my email, I'd kindly ask that we part ways and you move on. We're not giving refunds on chillers that work. We're not doing a recall (as you keep pushing) on chillers that work. And if we do come out with an updated reservoir it'll be like the new iPhone and nothing will be done for people that already bought and have a perfectly working chiller. If people have issues we resolve them. Please for the love of the community just drop it and move one. If you want a refund on your chiller email me and I'd be happy to do it so we can put a pin in this.

I... hate to be "that guy", but you might want to look at the picture you just attached to this post.

 

[sibelman]

@wickedbeernut and @SpikeBrewing ,I suggest that, now that you've shared all this, you consider moving further conversation elsewhere.

I'm glad to hear Spike is doing okay, and sad that some glycol chiller buyers have had serious trouble. Best wishes to you all.

 

[genotype]

@wickedbeernut and @SpikeBrewing ,I suggest that, now that you've shared all this, you consider moving further conversation elsewhere.

I'm glad to hear Spike is doing okay, and sad that some glycol chiller buyers have had serious trouble. Best wishes to you all.

I'm one of those that has serious trouble. I'm about to be on my 4th unit. It's been frustrating to say the least. And then to expect your customer to go through all the steps of applying the flex seal to correct the issue? Also, maybe Spike should offer some sort of compensation for the lost glycol, especially when it was purchased from them.

 

[Punx Clever]

Holy out of control thread! Ben with Spike here. I haven't been on HBT in years. Glad the forum is still around! Thanks to whoever tagged us so we go notified.

LOTS of misinformation being spread here mainly by (wickedbeernut). I'll try to give some clarity but I'll monitor this thread for a few days so people can ask questions and get actual information.

...

Facebook User Group Bans
I've seen multiple places that we are banning people and we are controlling the Spike User Group. I'd recommend you reach out to Brandon Starkey who is the main Admin of the group who has no affiliation with Spike. The decision was made to start banning detractors from the group. This was not a Spike decision or order. The group is suppose to be a positive place to discuss brewing beer. A few people, who stated they will never buy Spike again, decided that they were going to comment negatively on every single post that ever got brought up. The group started to get hostile and just overall negative. Those detractors can go complain else where (thus this thread being created).

...

Again, lots of misinformation from people with too much time on their hands. If you don't want to buy from us then don't; it's a free country. But not sure why some people want to make it there life's mission to try and talk negatively about a small company filled with really hard working dedicated employees. Soon enough we'll be the only home brew brand around so don't burn your bridge In the meantime if people want to have a cordial convo I'm happy to answer questions!

Ho boy. I kinda went back and forth even responding, but since I'm the "thus this thread being created" guy, well... might as well.

1) Can't really reach out to the admin of a Facebook group you are banned from. Doesn't work that way.

2) It's a 'user group' not a 'buyer group'. Even if I decided to never purchase from Spike again because you (on your personal FB account) doxxed a customer's purchases, I'm still a guy who bought into the Solo system at the start. Telling people how to deal with the mash basket, it's tendency to overrun the mash, the enormous amount of uncirculated dead space, and the best way to ditch the basket and go to a BIAB if that's what they want has nothing to do with not buying Spike in the future.

3) Speaking of doxxing folks... maybe it's hidden behind the deleted posts, but something tells me that wickedbeernut didn't publicly share his name here. Maybe that something is the moderator's edit: "(attachment was removed due to showing personal information - mod)". That probably explains why this thread disappeared for a while too.

But, hey, I suppose I've got too much time on my hands. Maybe folks don't want to know when the owner/founder of a company will publicly share personal information from sales records. Maybe it's just me.

 

[MaxStout]

Reading these posts from customers who appear to have legitimate issues, who have been quite civil in their criticism, and who are not receiving respect or satisfaction for the hard-earned money they have spent, tells me everything I need to know about this vendor.

This thread should serve as a cautionary tale for others.

 

[bailey mountain brewer]

Fwiw, I own numerous pieces from spike equipment, 30gal trio, 2 cf15s, flow pumps, aio prvs, and countless doodads.. I had 1 problem with my prv, talked to spike customer service, problem handled, no complaints here.. I understand that ppl have issues, but I'm willing to bet it's a small percentage overall.

 

[Skeeter686]

I've had a similarly good experience with them and while the Solo system that I own does require some adjustments to my brewing process, I feel that it's well built and I have no complaints.

However, I agree that the responses here are rather off-putting. This isn't how I would have expected the vendor to respond.