So I brewed a Milk Stout with Peanut Butter Chocolate Balls Cereal

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CascadesBrewer

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I brewed a 2.5 gal batch of Milk Stout with Organic Peanut Butter Chocolate Balls cereal for a club competition. I did some research and technique (mash? boil? dry hop?) and amount (4 oz to entire box) were all over the place. I figured that the mash would be the best place to deal with whatever crud the cereal would add and I should go for a lot of cereal to make sure the flavor survived the boil and ferment.

I did not fully count for the volume that 1 lb of cereal would take up in my mash pot. I had an inch or two of space, but had to be careful mixing it up. I should have added and mixed the grain first instead of dumping both in at the same time. The cereal eventually mostly dissolved, but there were still balls remaining at the end of the mash.

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I was not positive how much sugar/gravity 1 lb of cereal would add. I only scaled back the grain in the recipe by 1/2 lb, but I guess I should have scaled it back more. The base recipe was in the 1.060 range, and I figured I would get at least 1.065...but hit 1.080! Fermenter volume was 2.6 gal vs the target 2.75 gal, but geez! (I am not sure I can actually fit 2.75 in my 3 gal fermenter...prob need to adjust that number in BeerSmith.)

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This is what she looks like now sitting in the fermenter at 64F. Does it make you want to pour a pint!

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CascadesBrewer

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I probably should have waited to post to make sure it is not a dumper. Here is the recipe for a 2.5 gal batch (well, target was 2.75 into fermenter and actual was 2.6):
  • 4.5 lb Crisp Floor Malted Maris Otter Malt
  • 1 lb Peanut Butter/Cocoa Balls (365 Everyday Value, Organic)
  • 4 oz Munich Malt (Briess, 20L)
  • 4 oz Crystal 120 (Briess, 120L)
  • 4 oz Black Barley (Briess, 500L)
  • 4 oz Black Malt (Briess, 500L)
  • 8 oz Lactose (10 min Boil)
  • 1 oz Willamette (4.1%) 60 min
  • 0.5 oz East Kent Goldings (4.5%) 15 min
  • WLP013 (London Ale), 6 oz of harvested slurry
  • 60 min Single Infusion Mash, Target 153 F, Actual 152F to 148F
I don't normally do an iodine test but I did with this batch. Even at 60 minutes the test showed purple. I am guessing that the cereal must contribute starches. I picked that brand cereal since the ingredient list looked like stuff I might add to a beer, vs the label on Reese's cereal.
 

bracconiere

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(well, target was 2.75 into fermenter and actual was 2.6):
.
damn, you small batch brewers must have some accurate measuring sticks! when i do a 10 gal batch, i can't tell if it's 10 or 11 gals into the fermenter! :mug:

edit: did the math... a 0.15 differnce would be 2 and a half cups....
 

don_bran321

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Also subscribing to see the results. This sounds fun. Thought about trying a fruitloop NEIPA
 

isomerization

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I’m interested to see if you gravity numbers much up with the equivalent amount of sugar added from the cereal. For example, if you used 10 servings of sugar and each has 15 g per serving, did you get the equivalent gravity boost as adding 150 g of sugar?
 
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I’m interested to see if you gravity numbers much up with the equivalent amount of sugar added from the cereal. For example, if you used 10 servings of sugar and each has 15 g per serving, did you get the equivalent gravity boost as adding 150 g of sugar?
I had not modeled the recipe in BS before, since I did not know how to count the cereal. If I count the 1 lb of cereal as 1 lb of table sugar, adjust my efficiency up to 75% and adjust the fermenter volume to 2.6 gal BS estimates the 1.080 gravity. Just changing the fermenter volume up to 2.75 drops the target OG by 4 points (to 1.076). A few cups has quite an impact on these smaller batches.

I am still trying to dial in my stovetop BIAB process and numbers. I brewed this milk stout recipe as a 2.5 gal batch recently and hit 1.072 but only got 2.4 gal into the fermenter.

As far as the beer goes. The layer of "crud" was slowly setting out. Last night there was a layer of very clear dark wort in the top 1/3 of the fermenter. This morning the settling line is down to the 2/3 mark, but the top layer is getting murky with yeast activity starting to mix it up. I suspect it will be back to a full murky mess when I get home this evening...and hopefully I have enough headspace in my fermenter.
 

tntpilsner

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I can't think of two things I like much more than Peanut Butter and beer, so I'm in. :)
Now pizza and beer would be totally irresistible, but this is pretty awesome.
 

odie

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1lb cereal is not1lb sugar...gotta read the nutritional label and determine the fermentables it added
 
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1lb cereal is not1lb sugar...gotta read the nutritional label and determine the fermentables it added
I don't have the package in front of me, I am not sure what exactly I would look at to determine fermentables...or how much I really care. Treating it as 1 lb of sugar seems to make BS happy so that is what I would do in the future if I added a sweetened cereal to a beer. It was 1 lb of this: https://www.wholefoodsmarket.com/pr...-organic-peanut-butter-and-cocoa-balls-cereal

I am not sure if this lines up with the package data: https://www.nutritionix.com/i/365-e...t-butter-cocoa-balls/53a435f8a0d391bd1f73c261

status? has fermentation kicked up yet? Looks like a ton of protein in the fermenter. I'd love to see a pic of that churned up during active fermentation haha.
There were solid signs of fermentation starting this morning but...wait...am I supposed to be working?
 

odie

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Should say grams of sugar per serving. Then figure out servings per pound.
 

plazola86

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I’m interested to see if you gravity numbers much up with the equivalent amount of sugar added from the cereal. For example, if you used 10 servings of sugar and each has 15 g per serving, did you get the equivalent gravity boost as adding 150 g of sugar?
That's usually how I estimate my additions like this. I'm curious to see how this is going to mess with fermentation (if at all) with all the additives and crap they add to any "food in a box" these days. I've added cereal before but added it post fermentation.
 

isomerization

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That's usually how I estimate my additions like this. I'm curious to see how this is going to mess with fermentation (if at all) with all the additives and crap they add to any "food in a box" these days. I've added cereal before but added it post fermentation.
Vitamin E (tocopherol) apparently helps!

https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/pdf/10.1002/jib.327

I don't have the package in front of me, I am not sure what exactly I would look at to determine fermentables...or how much I really care. Treating it as 1 lb of sugar seems to make BS happy so that is what I would do in the future if I added a sweetened cereal to a beer. It was 1 lb of this: https://www.wholefoodsmarket.com/products/365-everyday-value®-organic-peanut-butter-and-cocoa-balls-cereal

I am not sure if this lines up with the package data: https://www.nutritionix.com/i/365-e...t-butter-cocoa-balls/53a435f8a0d391bd1f73c261



There were solid signs of fermentation starting this morning but...wait...am I supposed to be working?
How many servings per box? Multiply by 7g of sugar, that’s your total sugar contribution. Although you mashed this, so maybe the other sugars could have been converted? Hard to say!
 
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CascadesBrewer

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That's usually how I estimate my additions like this. I'm curious to see how this is going to mess with fermentation (if at all) with all the additives and crap they add to any "food in a box" these days. I've added cereal before but added it post fermentation.
The ingredient list on this stuff actually sounded like stuff I might add to a brew myself (vs the Reese's version which has a ton of odd stuff and a ground up multi-vitamin added). I was curious how the Salt, Calcium Carbonate (chalk), and Baking Soda messed with my water chemistry (my mash pH was around 5.2).

ORGANIC CORN FLOUR, ORGANIC WHOLE GRAIN CORN FLOUR, ORGANIC CANE SUGAR, ORGANIC PEANUT BUTTER (ORGANIC PEANUTS, SALT), ORGANIC WHOLE GRAIN OAT FLOUR, ORGANIC COCOA POWDER (PROCESSED WITH ALKALI)*, ORGANIC RICE FLOUR, ORGANIC OAT HULL FIBER, SEA SALT, CALCIUM CARBONATE, NATURAL FLAVOR, BAKING SODA (SODIUM BICARBONATE), MIXED TOCOPHEROLS (VITAMIN E) ADDED TO MAINTAIN FRESHNESS, ORGANIC MALTED BARLEY EXTRACT. *FAIRLY TRADED INGREDIENT​

How many servings per box? Multiply by 7g of sugar, that’s your total sugar contribution. Although you mashed this, so maybe the other sugars could have been converted? Hard to say!
Exactly my point. A 30g serving has 7g of sugar, so I am pretty sure that 1 lb added more than 23% fermentables (105g, 3.7oz). Adding to the boil may have just added the 7g of sugar to the gravity.
 
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Nothing to crazy exciting yet. This is what it looked like last night...around 8 hours after pitch.

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This is what it looks like now with fermentation ramping up. I don't have much experience with WLP013 London Ale, but for the batch it came out of it never got churning like the WLP001 batch that was next to it. There is quite a bit of movement from the yeast.

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CascadesBrewer

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My guess is bland like any other processed food.
Awww...raining on my parade? :( I sampled some toward the end of the boil and the hydrometer sample after cooled. It is so sweet at that point, but I did feel like the chocolate flavors were there and there was a bready/grainy flavor from the cereal. I was not getting much peanut butter so that may have not survived the boil. I suspect fermentation will start to slow down in a day or two and I will be tempted to get a sample this weekend.
 
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This thing actually has some potential. I figured I would give the spigot on my new Fermonster a try and grabbed a sample to see how fermentation was going. I expect the FG to be in the 1.025 to 1.030 range (the lactose adds about .008 of unfermentable points)...so probably about 70% through fermentation so far. It is very yeasty, but there is a distinct, and pleasant, graham cracker flavor. Not sure about any peanut butter. It is hard to say if I get much chocolate or if I am just drinking something that looks like chocolate milk and I know there should be chocolate there. The actual cereal is much less sweet with less pb/chocolate flavor vs actual Reese's cereal.

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Fermentation has slowed down, but a bit higher than I had hoped (in the 1.036 range). I boosted the temps in the fermentation chamber a bit in hopes to keep it going. I learned that my small spacer heater might not be the best heat source for my chamber. By the time it is warm enough in the chamber to raise the temp of the beer 4F, the air is hot enough to trigger the heater's "overheat detection", which requires unplugging it for a few minutes to reset. It seems to work to boost temps 2F at a time though.

I am debating about pitching a pack of dried yeast though I suspect that will not really help anything. Around 1.030 would be in the 70% attenuation range (given the lactose add about 8 points), and 1.036 puts it in the only 61% range. I am not sure if the cereal adds any unfermentables. Lactose might have been a bad idea, but I liked the milk + cereal idea. It is very sweet right now.

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The cereal "stuff" is starting to settle out...hopefully it will compact below the spigot.

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bradccook

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Fermentation has slowed down, but a bit higher than I had hoped (in the 1.036 range). I boosted the temps in the fermentation chamber a bit in hopes to keep it going. I learned that my small spacer heater might not be the best heat source for my chamber. By the time it is warm enough in the chamber to raise the temp of the beer 4F, the air is hot enough to trigger the heater's "overheat detection", which requires unplugging it for a few minutes to reset. It seems to work to boost temps 2F at a time though.

I am debating about pitching a pack of dried yeast though I suspect that will not really help anything. Around 1.030 would be in the 70% attenuation range (given the lactose add about 8 points), and 1.036 puts it in the only 61% range. I am not sure if the cereal adds any unfermentables. Lactose might have been a bad idea, but I liked the milk + cereal idea. It is very sweet right now.

View attachment 616414

The cereal "stuff" is starting to settle out...hopefully it will compact below the spigot.

View attachment 616415
Any thing new yet?
 
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Any thing new yet?
It went into bottles on Friday evening. I kept it warm for several days (74F range) and gave it a swirl to see if the yeast would drive the FG down but it seems to have settled around 1.035. I then cold crashed for a few days to help it clear. It might end up being a rather sweet dessert beer. I am still not sure how much of the cereal character made it through, but it should be easier to tell once it carbonates.

Hopefully I did not over prime the bottles. I have only bottle conditioned a handful of beers since I got my kegging system 20 years ago and only recently have had the ability to cold crash beers. 2 g of sugar per bottle worked well for the last beer I bottled, so that is what I did for this one. Afterward I looked at the Northern Brewer Priming Calculator and it says a beer at 40F only needs 1.2 g per bottle!
 

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It went into bottles on Friday evening. I kept it warm for several days (74F range) and gave it a swirl to see if the yeast would drive the FG down but it seems to have settled around 1.035. I then cold crashed for a few days to help it clear. It might end up being a rather sweet dessert beer. I am still not sure how much of the cereal character made it through, but it should be easier to tell once it carbonates.

Hopefully I did not over prime the bottles. I have only bottle conditioned a handful of beers since I got my kegging system 20 years ago and only recently have had the ability to cold crash beers. 2 g of sugar per bottle worked well for the last beer I bottled, so that is what I did for this one. Afterward I looked at the Northern Brewer Priming Calculator and it says a beer at 40F only needs 1.2 g per bottle!
You will be fine , don’t use the cold crash temp , use the hottest temp it fermented at . Also with a beer like that ( high abv ) you might add a little yeast at bottling as they are probably pretty tired at this point.
 

odie

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You will be fine , don’t use the cold crash temp , use the hottest temp it fermented at . Also with a beer like that ( high abv ) you might add a little yeast at bottling as they are probably pretty tired at this point.
Explain the temps? I’m not following the reasoning.
 

isomerization

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Explain the temps? I’m not following the reasoning.
As I recently learned, oxygen will come out of solution with increasing temperature, but will not go back into solution with decreasing temperature, unless pressure is applied.
 

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Go for it!!! I saw a article where a brewery did a lucky charms NEIPA.

Why not...lol
That was a brewery in Virginia Beach, Smartmouth. Actually there were some really upset people once they realized it didn’t taste like fruit loops. I imagine the Fruit Loops upped the ABV and died up the beer some.
 
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CascadesBrewer

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hmmm...hanging out at home on a Thursday drinking enough homebrew that opening a bottle after 6 days of conditioning seemed like a good idea (it was just that last partial fill bottle). I am not a huge "pastry stout" fan. I was worried this would just be way too sweet. Honestly, it is a solid beer. The head dissipated quickly and the beer is still rather flat. It has a nice "shortbread cookie" flavor with subtle chocolate and peanut butter notes, but it is not as sweet as I feared. I am really curious what somebody that does not know the ingredients will think. I have about 3 weeks until the competition that I brewed this for.

P.S. I am not sure if I have used WLP013 London Ale in the past. I really enjoy the NEIPA that I first pitched this into and I think it is a part of why I like this beer. I am planning to to use WLP013 in a porter I am brewing this weekend. I am feeling that WLP013 will replace S-04 as my standard Porter/Sweet Stout yeast.


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2 weeks in the bottle...tried a couple of them...

If the measure of success was the creation of a Chocolate Peanut Butter bomb stout, then it was a failure. I get no peanut butter character. Chocolate? There is sweetness and a roasty/chocolatey flavor but I don't detect actual chocolate character.

On the other hand, this is a damn good beer. It is hard to trust some random homebrewer, but I am pretty critical of my beers. There is a definite sweetness there. It is not cloying, but I am not sure I would drink multiple pints in a row. The cereal character is more of what I would expect from something like a Cap'n Crunch (the standard one). There is a bit of a sweet corn character. Clarity on the beer is excellent...it was very murky during fermentation.

The high OG and FG confuse me a bit (1.080 to 1.035). I am a little curious what types of unfermentables cereal would add. I feel like I managed the yeast pitch and fermentation well enough that it was not a "stuck" fermentation. I calculated that the lactose added about 8 points of unfermentables. The fact that an iodine test at 60 minutes showed purple might be a hint at something.

Would I brew this again? Probably not. There are likely much better ways to get chocolate, peanut butter and cracker flavors into a beer (and that is really not my style of beer anyway). The organic cereal I used really did not have much chocolate and peanut butter flavor to start with, but I am not sure I would be comfortable adding the ingredient list from other cereals into my beer. The base recipe is pretty good and I am digging WLP013.

Cheers...

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