Show me your Grant build

[Btaz]

Show me your Grant build. I'm interested in hearing how you prevent underflow and overflow issues. As well as where you found parts?

 

[Jayjay1976]

What's a gant?

 

[govner1]

I think @Btaz means a "grant".

 

[Btaz]

Ha. Yes. It's now corrected. Well if seems I cannot fix the thread title.

 

[SleepyCreekBrews]

a grant build ?

 

[Jayjay1976]

I'm still in the dark.

Is this "grant" you speak of some sort of raspberry pi controlled automaton, bearing a resemblance to Hugh Grant, which breaks up dough balls in your mash tun? Creepy concept, but I'll subscribe out of sheer morbid curiosity...

 

[Btaz]

I'm still in the dark.

Is this "grant" you speak of some sort of raspberry pi controlled automaton, bearing a resemblance to Hugh Grant, which breaks up dough balls in your mash tun? Creepy concept, but I'll subscribe out of sheer morbid curiosity...

No. A grant is used in between a MLT and pump (and other places) to avoid back pressure, provide a sample area, and other good things.

 

[Gadjobrinus]

Actually, I love grants, for the reasons you mention. Trying to figure how they work with non-self priming pumps?

 

[crane]

No. A grant is used in between a MLT and pump (and other places) to avoid back pressure, provide a sample area, and other good things.

Not sure I'm convinced of the need on the Homebrew scale. I can take a sample from the BK or MT just as easy as a grant. I have never had any issues with back pressure, so I don't need to avoid it. Finally I'm at a loss for any other "good things" they might contribute on the Homebrew scale.

My understanding is that some brew houses use positive displacent self priming pumps where you cannot use a ball valve on the output of the pump to throttle back the flow. In this case the grant is filled up, pump cicles on to drain the grant quickly, grant empties and pump turns off. Repeat cycling the pump on/off as the grant fills up until you are done sparging. Given that most all homebrewers are using magnetic drive pumps that you can throttle back the speed by using a ball valve, I see no need for a grant.

 

[Gadjobrinus]

Crane, where do you draw your samples from on the MLT. Say, to determine final runnings and when to stop runoff?

 

[Btaz]

Actually, I love grants, for the reasons you mention. Trying to figure how they work with non-self priming pumps?

I have a low cost method in my stand now where I have a valve and long tube on the output end of my system. I open it up with the pump of f, suck up some wort past the pump, close the valve, and then start the pump. Once that goes then I have to babysit my grant to make sure I don't lose the prime or overflow the grant. I'm looking for ideas in this thread.

 

[Btaz]

Not sure I'm convinced of the need on the Homebrew scale. I can take a sample from the BK or MT just as easy as a grant. I have never had any issues with back pressure, so I don't need to avoid it. Finally I'm at a loss for any other "good things" they might contribute on the Homebrew scale.

My understanding is that some brew houses use positive displacent self priming pumps where you cannot use a ball valve on the output of the pump to throttle back the flow. In this case the grant is filled up, pump cicles on to drain the grant quickly, grant empties and pump turns off. Repeat cycling the pump on/off as the grant fills up until you are done sparging. Given that most all homebrewers are using magnetic drive pumps that you can throttle back the speed by using a ball valve, I see no need for a grant.

My system can do almost ~30G batches. Prior to a grant I would frequently get a stuck mash and/or not be able to easily detect that the flow rate from the mash tun (or kettle for cooling) had turned into a trickle. I have PTSD from this to try a no grant again.

 

[Btaz]

I thinking that I might add a float switch to the bottom of the grant and connected to the pump to stop the pump before the grant empties. Then another float switch up top connected to an electric ball valve which will close on overflow. Any simpler ideas?

 

[Drumminguy81]

I used an ssbrewtech 5.5 gallon kettle for my grant. I got a custom false bottom for it from normal brewing. I love it. Might be a little big for some systems but I brew 20 gallon batches so it's just right. On my previous keggle system I used the bottom 1/3 of a 1/6th bbl keg cut off. It worked really nicely as well.

View attachment 1505977253907.jpg

View attachment 1505977492278.jpg

 

[Btaz]

@Drumminguy81, how do you control overflow and underflow issues?

 

[Drumminguy81]

That is part of the reason I went with the 5.5 gallon. I use a ball valve on the pump output to control the flow. I have it down pretty good now to keep the balance but it does take a little monitoring until it's balanced.

 

[Jayjay1976]

The fact that I have absolutely no need for a grant in my system in no way decreases my desire to have one.

 

[Gadjobrinus]

I would love one, and have the stockpots, but outside of Btaz's method, don't know how to use one with a non-self priming pump. The in hose is in the wort in the grant, right? How do you guys flood the pump?

Edit: I should correct it to say, standard non-self priming pumps, like the Chuggers I have?

 

[Btaz]

That is part of the reason I went with the 5.5 gallon. I use a ball valve on the pump output to control the flow. I have it down pretty good now to keep the balance but it does take a little monitoring until it's balanced.

I suppose that is one way to do things. I use only a small 1/2 cooler as a grant and have to babysit it to avoid both under and over flow problems.

 

[narddawg314]

I use a bucket and dump it in my BK once it's full... keeping the pump primed was too difficult and not worth the effort to solve a step that is easily done manually. I love automation and tried but it just wasn't worth it for a brewery of my size about 3-4 bbls annually.

 

[Chief449]

.

 

[RocketBrewer]

Here is the grant I built for my 3 vessel E-HERMS. I connect it between the MLT and my wort pump. When I fly sparge, I gravity feed into the grant and when it's full, it pumps at full speed to the BK. The grant uses 2 float switches like these. I used a DPDT switch like this to divert the power from my wort pump switch to be controlled by a liquid level sensor like this. The liquid level controller also needs a 9-12v AC or DC power source. The floats are connected to my control panel with these aviation connectors. When the liquid level reaches the upper switch, it turns the pump on and it runs until the level drops below the lower switch. I also use a one way check valve on the pump outlet like this to keep the wort from back-flowing from the BK to the grant while the pump is off. I didn't plan it that way (though you probably could), but it pumps almost exactly a gallon per cycle, so you can easily check your sparge rate. Is it necessary? probably not, but I find it much easier to control and I don't have to listen to that pump the whole time. I also love to build stuff!

 

[narddawg314]

I also love to build stuff!

Hat's off to you sir. Very well done!!

 

[Soulshine2]

Show me your Grant build. I'm interested in hearing how you prevent underflow and overflow issues. As well as where you found parts?

And here I got all excited because I thought there was a fellow homebrewer living in the same town I do...

 

[Blazinlow86]

I would love one, and have the stockpots, but outside of Btaz's method, don't know how to use one with a non-self priming pump. The in hose is in the wort in the grant, right? How do you guys flood the pump?

Edit: I should correct it to say, standard non-self priming pumps, like the Chuggers I have?

I don't understand your question. You can use the grant manually just like you would flysparge without one. Once the grant is half full or whatever you open the grants valve and turn on the pump and adjust until you're desired level is maintained. If I was using one it would not even drain fully so repriming wouldn't be a issue. Cheers

 

[narddawg314]

I don't understand your question. You can use the grant manually just like you would flysparge without one. Once the grant is half full or whatever you open the grants valve and turn on the pump and adjust until you're desired level is maintained. If I was using one it would not even drain fully so repriming wouldn't be a issue. Cheers

the answer is your pump must be lower than the grant.

 

[Btaz]

I don't understand your question. You can use the grant manually just like you would flysparge without one. Once the grant is half full or whatever you open the grants valve and turn on the pump and adjust until you're desired level is maintained. If I was using one it would not even drain fully so repriming wouldn't be a issue. Cheers

I'm I correct thinking you keep the pump below the grant?

 

[Blazinlow86]

I'm I correct thinking you keep the pump below the grant?

Yup

 

[Spargster]

Here is the grant I built for my 3 vessel E-HERMS. I connect it between the MLT and my wort pump. When I fly sparge, I gravity feed into the grant and when it's full, it pumps at full speed to the BK. The grant uses 2 float switches like these. I used a DPDT switch like this to divert the power from my wort pump switch to be controlled by a liquid level sensor like this. The liquid level controller also needs a 9-12v AC or DC power source. The floats are connected to my control panel with these aviation connectors. When the liquid level reaches the upper switch, it turns the pump on and it runs until the level drops below the lower switch. I also use a one way check valve on the pump outlet like this to keep the wort from back-flowing from the BK to the grant while the pump is off. I didn't plan it that way (though you probably could), but it pumps almost exactly a gallon per cycle, so you can easily check your sparge rate. Is it necessary? probably not, but I find it much easier to control and I don't have to listen to that pump the whole time. I also love to build stuff!View attachment 587040 View attachment 587041

Im very interested to know how this unit is working for you? Im thinking of making something similar but don't know how to proceed. I understand the mechanics but the electrical setup is greek. Do the floats feed into the control unit? and the control unit sends power on/off to the pump? I would be making this with its own control/power setup and pump, it would be separate from my brew controller(tower of power). Any thoughts or advice would be great.

 

[RocketBrewer]

The system has worked out very well for me. It's far easier to dial in the flow using gravity rather than throttling a pump down to that slow of flow (you also don't have to listen to the pumps running). I only need to set the flow to the grant, MUCH easier than trying to match and maintain flow of 2 pumps. The only issue I've had is that I need to replace one of the floats because of a broken wire lead. The insulated 2 wire conductors I use to connect the float switches to the controller are no problem, but I need to figure out a better way to support the leads coming out of the floats, as continuous flopping around of the wires will eventually break them. I had tried shrink wrap over the the metal threads, but that eventually worked it's way off. Maybe someone here has a good suggestion.
As far as the wiring goes, what you want will be simpler than mine. I set mine up to be able to switch from normal on/off to grant control with the flip of a switch on the panel. You wouldn't need the DPDT switch I mentioned. You could use a plastic enclosure (maybe like this) to house the electronics and power outlet. You need a low voltage power source for the liquid level controller (I used a 12v DC one). Something like this would probably work fine. You can secure the electronic boards to the enclosure with a hot glue gun. If you split the outlet and made 1 side always hot you could even use an old wall wort power supply and run it back into the enclosure (as long as it's in the 9-12v range). The wiring diagram they show on eBay is for 220V, but it's the same for 110V, the black lead they show would just be your neutral white wire. There are 3 terminals where the pump is connected, the center (#2) is power in. The controller is designed to either keep a container full or empty, so #1 and #3 are outputs and I believe #1 is what I used. If it doesn't work properly, switch #1 to #3. As far as the float wiring, their diagram is pretty weird as it's designed to just be bare wires and the liquid would be the conductor. I wired the floats with each one connecting one wire to the common in the center (doesn't matter which one) and one wire connected to the upper or lower level connection. I may even try eliminating the floats and use small stainless screws through the pot using an insulating rubber grommet, that would certainly make things simpler and more robust. The aviation connectors aren't necessary either, it could be hard wired or use many other options for connectors, there are numerous alternatives.

 

[RocketBrewer]

One thing I forgot to mention is that there are many sources for these liquid level controllers on ebay, but pay attention as some are kits that require you to solder all the components on the board yourself. I got one like that by accident. It was no big deal, as I can solder somewhat proficiently, but if you aren't comfortable soldering, it could be a problem.

 

[tinoespinosa69]

A really good option to avoid buying things in different online stores is to select this level control kit
https://www.filltronics.com/product/tiny-pump-controller-v2-case-and-hardware
You will need to add the 12VDC power supply as the one mentioned above by @RocketBrewer and the 2 level switch.

You can also look on the product guide on how to connect the pump for draining the wort.
I am really looking into it as I am always trying to build new things for my system.