Scottish Ale yeast confusion

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bferullo

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Ok, so after reading up most people use scottish yeast. I have seen Jamil's recipe's using WLP001 and fermenting a little higher than scottish yeasts.

I don't have a fermentation chamber, so I am subject to basement temps. this time of year I can get fermentation around 65 degrees +/- a degree or so. So it would seem logical for me to go the Jamil route.

I am not necessarily looking to have the "slight smoke" flavor that seems to be attached to Wyeast 1728 and cioncerned about keeping the temp low enough for this yeast.

Any advice/thoughts appreciated.
 

AnchorBock

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Ok, so after reading up most people use scottish yeast. I have seen Jamil's recipe's using WLP001 and fermenting a little higher than scottish yeasts.

I don't have a fermentation chamber, so I am subject to basement temps. this time of year I can get fermentation around 65 degrees +/- a degree or so. So it would seem logical for me to go the Jamil route.

I am not necessarily looking to have the "slight smoke" flavor that seems to be attached to Wyeast 1728 and cioncerned about keeping the temp low enough for this yeast.

Any advice/thoughts appreciated.
If you can chill the wort to like 61 or 62 and then pitch. Fermentation will take it up to 65 or so as it ramps up, but you should be ok with 001 even a little above 65 as long as you pitch lower.
 

weirdboy

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Nottingham or WLP001/US-05 works fine IMO. I don't like fermenting so high as AnchorBock is saying, even with a cleaner yeast. These beers are traditionally fermented quite low, like in the 50's. I have heard of some people fermenting in the high 40's even. You shouldn't have esters in this beer, IMO, although "low fruitiness" is OK in the lighter Scottish Ales, and "low to moderate" is OK in a wee heavy. I dunno I just think the cleaner fermentation tastes better, personally.
 

cooper

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What recipe are you looking at? I've been wanting to do a Scottish Ale so I figured I'd ask. I do agree though to keep the fermenting temps down to 60ish for Scottish Ales
 

AnchorBock

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Nottingham or WLP001/US-05 works fine IMO. I don't like fermenting so high as AnchorBock is saying, even with a cleaner yeast. These beers are traditionally fermented quite low, like in the 50's. I have heard of some people fermenting in the high 40's even. You shouldn't have esters in this beer, IMO, although "low fruitiness" is OK in the lighter Scottish Ales, and "low to moderate" is OK in a wee heavy. I dunno I just think the cleaner fermentation tastes better, personally.
The OP was asking if it would be ok to ferment at 65* give or take, without the ability to ferment lower. Obviously the lower end of the strain he can ferment at the better, but in this case I think 65*ish would do just fine especially if pitched in 61-62* wort. I've brewed Jamil's scottish ales at 65* with WLP001 and they turn out fantastic.
 

weirdboy

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I agree that if you cannot control the temperature, going with the cleanest yeast you can find is best.

That being said, not having a fermentation chamber is no excuse for not being able to ferment colder. For the $20 purchase of a cooler you can control temps down to 40's and 50's if you fill it with water and stick the fermenter in there with some ice bottles.
 

stpug

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Quite honestly, I've found 1728 to be a pretty forgiving strain. I once had a high gravity ale (lightweight barleywine) get away from me badly and get into the low 80s before I quickly brought the temp down into the mid-60s, and the beer turned out splendid. I DID give it plenty of time on the cake (~4 weeks) though. This was a highly hopped beer with a few ounces of dry hops as well, so perhaps this helps mask any off flavors. I did not noticed any smoke attributes to this beer at all.

I then washed a reused a portion of this yeast (which was my first time without much thought as to gravities and alcohol) in an 80 shilling ale, however this time I made sure to keep the temp between 60-65F. This beer also turned out great considering is was a partial mash (very mild extract twang). I've really liked how this one turned out and have been wanting to redo this using all grain and with the same yeast. Again, I did not notice any smokiness.

IMO, I really like this yeast and find it pretty easy to work with. In fact, I'm planning a robust porter with this yeast in the next few days :D
 
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bferullo

bferullo

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What recipe are you looking at? I've been wanting to do a Scottish Ale so I figured I'd ask. I do agree though to keep the fermenting temps down to 60ish for Scottish Ales
A recipe I have been toying around with. Not that complex...will do a 90 minute boil and the 1st runnings caramelization....batch size is 6 gallons with 72% eff.

6.5 lbs MO
4 lbs pale 2-row
1 lb 5 oz carapils
11 oz crisp caramel 45
4 oz roasted barley

2 oz EKG @ 45 minutes (AA% about 6.5)
 

weirdboy

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That's an awful lot of hops for a Scottish ale, and the grain bill puts the OG into a sort of weird place...probably higher gravity than an 80 shilling, but not really big enough to be a wee heavy. Maybe it's a 10 gallon recipe?

I still think even at 10 gallons and saying it's a 60/- that it's going to be too bitter.
 
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bferullo

bferullo

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OOPS.....actually i had 1.6 oz in the recipe. it came out with a OG:BU ratio of around 0.5. Daniels suggests 0.4-0.6ish. The IBU came out to be just under 30.

According to Beersmith I am slightly out of range on ABV and OG, but I figured based on my varying efficiency I will end up with an OG closer to 1.052-1.055 and thus the ABV will then fall into range. With my latest setup I have been overestimating to compensate for lower efficiency levels.
 

MVKTR2

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fwiw 'overpitching' or at least pitching a larger amount of yeast reduces the possibility for off flavors from esters. IIRC most of the esters in beer occur during the ramping up stage or the first 2 days of fermentation when the yeast are dividing. By reducing the need for so much cell division you reduce the impact of esters. Translation pitching more yeast produces a cleaner fermentation. What this means for bferullo is you can ferment at 65 degrees and reduce the probability of off flavors.
 
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