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saison recipe help?

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Billybrewer09

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I'm brewing a saison tomorrow and I'm still not sure which recipe I want to use. Here are my choices. Any and all feed back is greatly appreciated.
1st recipe
5# pilsner
2# wheat malt
2#flaked corn
.5# Munich malt
.5# carapils
.25 magnum(60)
.50 simcoe (20)
.50 Amarillo (15)
1oz Amarillo (DH)

2nd recipe...
7# pale ale malt
2# flaked corn
1# wheat malt
Same hop schedule as above.
wyeast 3711

If you were brewing which would you choose or make changes to.
 

sudndeth

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Out of the two I'd go for the second, but personally I'd use Pilsner instead of Pale ale malt. I like the simple grain bill and let the yeast shine. 3711 is a great yeast too. What temp are you going to mash at?
 
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Billybrewer09

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I had thought about switching the pale out for pilsner. I'm going to mash at 154 for an hour.
 

avidhomebrewer

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I use pale for my base, including saisons. Turns out quite tasty, but I like either bitter or sweet orange peel in my saisaons. 3711 is an excellent choice.
 

jeffencourt

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I agree with using pilsner for a saison, as well as putting some orange peel in. im also thinking about trying some rosehips in my next saison to see what happens with that.
 

Quaker

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Can you explain why you included flaked corn? I've not used it, but I thought it was to lighten up the body of a beer, but you also include wheat or carapils which adds body. Not criticizing; just curious how you thought through the recipes.
 

rebel80

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Also, you might want to think about mashing a little lower (like maybe 148 or 149) but be sure to mash for 90 minutes to get full conversion. These beers are supposed to finish very dry.
 

terodox

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I have to agree on the orange peel suggested above. I also agree on using pilsner instead of pale. A big thing to keep in mind beyond this grain bill is your fermentation temps. 3711 likes a pretty hot fermentation and in my experience will stall at some point after the first 4-6 days, but if you let it hang out will pick back up and finish out.

Anyway, I think the second recipe looks delicious, and I also agree about the lower mash temp, dry this thing out.

Let us know how it turns out!
 

sudndeth

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One reason why there's Pilsner on the first recipe and Pale on the second is possibly the SRM. I believe Pilsner is lighter therefore the munich darkened it up.
 

JLW

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I like the simple recipe and would also use Pilsner and not pale malt. As an example here is my recipe:

Amt Name Type # %/IBU
9 lbs Pilsner (2 Row) Bel (2.0 SRM) Grain 1 69.2 %
3 lbs Munich Malt (9.0 SRM) Grain 2 23.1 %
1 lbs Vienna Malt (3.5 SRM) Grain 3 7.7 %
1.75 oz Fuggles [4.50 %] - Boil 60.0 min Hop 4 23.6 IBUs
2.00 oz Fuggles [4.50 %] - Dry Hop 7.0 Days Hop 8 0.0 IBUs
1.00 oz Styrian Goldings [5.40 %] - Boil 20.0 mi Hop 5 9.8 IBUs
1.10 Items Whirlfloc Tablet (Boil 15.0 mins) Fining 6 -
1.0 pkg French Saison (Wyeast Labs #3711) [50.00 Yeast 7 -
 

JLW

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One other thought. The 3711 yeast is a beast. My OG was close to 1.070 and took my FG all the way down to 1.001 I also fermented hot 75*+.
 
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Billybrewer09

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I brewed this Sunday using the pale malt recipe and I added a half pound of honey malt.
I did not come up with either one of these recipes. They were taken out of the recipe data base on here.
I did mash this at 154 for the simple reason as I knew the corn would lighten the body up and the yeast would possibly dry it out so I wanted to balance the body with a higher mash temp.
I started fermentation at 68° and am slowly raising it over the next few days. So I guess I will see how it turns out in a month or so.
 

JLW

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I brewed this Sunday using the pale malt recipe and I added a half pound of honey malt.
I did not come up with either one of these recipes. They were taken out of the recipe data base on here.
I did mash this at 154 for the simple reason as I knew the corn would lighten the body up and the yeast would possibly dry it out so I wanted to balance the body with a higher mash temp.
I started fermentation at 68° and am slowly raising it over the next few days. So I guess I will see how it turns out in a month or so.
It will be good.
 

JLW

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I'm not really sure. I think mine was finished fermenting in a week or less. I let it sit in primary for a full week and then dry hopped for one week. Bottled and let condition for two weeks and it was ready. I have been reading about sasions and long age periods. So my next two will be aged for several months.
 
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Billybrewer09

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Thanks JLW. I will let it set in primary for a couple weeks and dry hop. Also thanks for the link. I will check it out
 
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