rice hulls

[DeRoux's Broux]

my brew bud and i were talking about #'s of grain and water needed for mash in. the question of rice hulls came up. he's say's you should account for the rice hulls when you have a large amount of rye or wheat in the grain bill, and should add water for their amount in the grist. i say no, because they are not a source of fermentables and are mainly a "mash" structure stabilizer (for lack of better words).

i'm right on this one, right?

 

[Kaiser]

i'm right on this one, right?

Not being an expert and knowing that you planned to do a decotion, I'd say you should be fine w/o. We are talking about the Dunkel-Weissbier, correct?

Kai

 

[DeRoux's Broux]

nope, i'm doing the decoction, but that's how the subject came up. we were talking about the grain bill for my wheat, and we started talking about Real Ale's Full Moon Pale Rye and how wheat is like rye in the mash, bla, bla, bla.....

 

[Baron von BeeGee]

Are we talking adding water to account for water absorption by the rice hulls? I don't think they really absorb a noticeable amount, but just guessing.

 

[david_42]

Rice hulls will absorb about the same amount of water by weight as grain will, but they are much lighter by volume.

 

[DeRoux's Broux]

Are we talking adding water to account for water absorption by the rice hulls? I don't think they really absorb a noticeable amount, but just guessing.

yes sir. i just figured they wouldn't absorb enough to matter. but, i'm doing a double decoction, so no worries!

 

[Baron von BeeGee]

I've never added more than 1/2 a pound, anyways, although some recipes have called for a full pound. A 1/2 pound of rice hulls is like a 1/2 pound of hops...it takes up a lot of space!

 

[casebrew]

Hmmm.... I've used 1 1/2# of hulls in each rye batch. But if 75% of the grains end up in the wort, that means 25% id left in the grain pile. SOoo, 1/2# of rice hulls ought to be good for 2# of rye? But an extra 59 cents for a lb of hulls is cheap, though my mash tun ends up full to the top...

Do rice hulls contribute tannins? Perhaps that would be another reason to cut down on them...

 

[DeRoux's Broux]

man, i'm whipped. doing a double decoction brew, rubb'n down a brisket for smoking tomorrow, and a loaf of Kai's spent grain beer bread in the oven......long day.....

 

[Kaiser]

I'll be doing a double decoction for my Doppelbock as well. Just like the Bavarian Monks did it, back in the days when they lived on that stuff during the time of lent. If it weren't for the 3# LME that I will add to get to 1.077, it would even be my first AG batch. But I have done a decoction for a partial mash before.

Not to confuse your Weizen recipe any further, but I came across an interesting article regarding enhancing the banana aroma of wheat beers:

The idea is to raise the glucose level by adding a Maltase rest at 45C after the 64C rest. Yes the temperature goes down again. The idea ist to prodce Maltose at 64C and convert some of the Maltose to Glucose at 45C. The increased glucose level will increase the banana-ester production of the yeast. The problem hower is, that the Maltase may not survive the 64C rest which requires the mash to be split. Once half is brought to 64C to generate Maltose and then combined with the rest to reach 45C and generate Glucose. After that its through the usual rests to mash-out. This mashing has been proposed by Markus Herrmann (Weihenstephan Institure Freising, Germany).
And it's even more work than a decoction.

I'll look into this further when I will be brewing Hefeweizens all through the summer. So far I was not able to find an english text on this though .

Kai

 

[DeRoux's Broux]

And it's even more work than a decoction.

uh, no thanks! i worked me arse off doingthe double decoction. i had only done a decoction once, and it was with another guy on his system. it would have been nice to have an extra set of hands.
here was my schedule:

mash in at 104 F for 5 min.
heat to 122 F in 10 min, hold for 25 min
pull 30-40% of the mash, heat in 15 min to 160 F, rest for 15 min
heat in 15 min to boiling, boil for 20 min, stirring to avoid scortching
add decoction back to main mash for a temp of about 145 F, hold for 10 min
pull 1/3 of the mash for a 2nd decoction and rasie temp to 160 F in 5 min
hold for 10 min
bring decoction to boil in 15 min, and boil for 20 min
mix back to main mash for a resulting temp of about 145 F, rest 15 min for saccharification rest
heat to 169 F and hold for 10 min
no recirculation, and sparge w/ 170-174 F water for 90-100 min
boiled for 105 min, added .5 oz German Perle hops @ 60.

long day!

 

[Dude]

So is this decoction mashing worth it to you guys, you think?

 

[Kaiser]

Good thing you did't change your Avatar, Orrelse. For a moment you got me confused here.

Or should I bow and say Dude.

So is this decoction mashing worth it to you guys, you think?

I only have a 5gal cooler as a mashtun an decotion mashes make it easy for me to do a step mash w/o having to start with a very thick mash. But I only plan to use them for darker German style beers where I actually want to do a step mash. American and British beers shouldn't have a problem with a single infusion mash since head retention (and maybe acidification) isn't so important anyway.

Kai

 

[DeRoux's Broux]

So is this decoction mashing worth it to you guys, you think?

i let you know once i taste the dunkel!

i've only done one other, and it was a group brew. it was doppelbock, and it came out good, but not a good comparison. i need a wheat vs. wheat.

it was fun, and a cool experience. i'll do it more often for sure.