re-circulating cooled wort into hot kettle?

[jamie3]

i built a CFC using 1/4" OD pipe and 30' length and a 5/8" hose.

i was able to test it out and it brought the wort down to 25 F but extremely slow. took roughly 30 minutes to for 10 gallon batch.

i dont want to be waiting around for a long time to transfer the wort into the buckets so i was wondering if it would be ok to re-circulate (as fast as possible) the wort back into the kettle while still cooling. once the temp reaches my optimal temp i could transfer to the buckets.

i've never heard of anyone ever doing this. what problems could arise from this?

 

[jculler82]

25F? Is that correct?

You're better off working on using colder water in your CF than recircing. I've tried the method you describe with my Shirron and it doesn't seem to work any faster. I use an immersion chiller sitting in a bucket of ice inline before my plate chiller, which during the summer when my tap water is 80F+ allows me to get my wort down to 68F into the fermenter. I am also am able to cool a degree or two lower by slowing the wort speed down by closing the ball valve a little coming out of my pump.

 

[3 Dog Brew]

Look for "Whirlpooling". Many homebrewers and pro brewers alike use this method. In fact in certain Pale Ale recipes it is the only way to get a certain type of hop flavor.

On another note, I'm sure that is a typo, you are not chilling wort to 25 F, that's below freezing. Did you mean reduced by 25F? Or down to 65F?

 

[jculler82]

Look for "Whirlpooling". Many homebrewers and pro brewers alike use this method. In fact in certain Pale Ale recipes it is the only way to get a certain type of hop flavor.

On another note, I'm sure that is a typo, you are not chilling wort to 25 F, that's below freezing. Did you mean reduced by 25F? Or down to 65F?

Seeing where he is from, I am now assuming he meant 25C. Also whirlpooling by probrewers is generally done hot, it is a good technique to look into, but it wouldn't aid in cooling.

 

[jamie3]

yeah sorry i meant 25C. although my mind works in metric my hands sometimes think in imperial.

ideally i want to cool wort within 10-15 min down to 20C (i've been able to do this before with a plate CFC) but currently it is taking 30+ minutes to cool down to 25-30C (which is roughly the same amount of time when i had my immersion chiller). mind you i tried this on a really hot day. maybe ill try again on a cooler day to see the differences.

as for my original question? if i re-circulate 25C wort back into 200C wort and keep re-circulating until then entire 10g is 20C what sort of problems will i encounter? DMS, flavour, etc?

 

[jculler82]

DMS shouldn't be a problem if you are getting below 140F (don't know the conversion) relatively quickly. After that I would make sure it is covered and you should be fine.

 

[jamie3]

25F? Is that correct?

You're better off working on using colder water in your CF than recircing. I've tried the method you describe with my Shirron and it doesn't seem to work any faster. I use an immersion chiller sitting in a bucket of ice inline before my plate chiller, which during the summer when my tap water is 80F+ allows me to get my wort down to 68F into the fermenter. I am also am able to cool a degree or two lower by slowing the wort speed down by closing the ball valve a little coming out of my pump.

yeah i have a ball valve at one end of the pump to control the flow. still it takes 30+ minutes to cool 10 gallons. i think i will try it again with regular hot water and see the results. and if that doesnt suffice i can do an ice bath at the output.

 

[Theis]

I have a 20 foot CFC and with city water temps in the 70's during the summer I will recirculate from the kettle through the CFC and back into the kettle until chilled wort coming from the CFC is <80. The first 100 degrees goes really quick but with recirculation you aren't just lowering the temp of the wort but also your brew rig and a 15.5 gallon sanke has a bit of thermal mass. It usually takes about 20 minutes to get the 11 gallons of wort cooled, much faster on a 5.5 gallon batch- much much faster in winter with 58 degree water.

 

[duckmanco]

Of course it's ok....and been done and well documented here:

http://www.mrmalty.com/chiller.php

 

[jamie3]

perfect. this will dramatically make it quicker!

 

[bja]

perfect. this will dramatically make it quicker!

No it won't, unless you use an ice bath. Of course you could use an ice bath without recirculating.

Recirculating will not be any quicker.

 

[jamie3]

ill probably use an ice bath on the output from the CFC see if that works first.