Portable spa panel

[summerofgeorge]

I've been thinking about this lately and just read that jtkratzer did it for his build. Most people tend to hard-wire the spa panel to their main panel and then use a power cord to go from the spa panel to brewing control panel. Is there any reason to not just hard-wire a regular outlet to the main panel and then attach a power cord to the spa panel?

Not that I plan on brewing off premises often but it would be nice to have the option. It would also allow someone with a full main panel and dryer/range outlet to just unplug that device and plug in the spa panel. The only downside I see is that you'd need the additional outlet and plug.

 

[amurphyz]

Don't know why it wouldn't work, hard wiring or plug in, it's still making contact right, a plug won't affect the gfci. Not an electrician, but I don't see the problem! Good call!!

 

[emjay]

Should work fine, though you really should keep the spa panel somewhere it can't get wet.

I took the exact opposite approach, pulling the breaker out of the spa panel and putting it in the main panel.

 

[NewBrewB]

I took the exact opposite approach, pulling the breaker out of the spa panel and putting it in the main panel.

Was this fairly self-explanatory or should I be looking for a DIY thread talking more about 'salvaging' a GFCI from a spa panel?



I'm torn--- I like both of these ideas.

 

[ChuckO]

I took the exact opposite approach, pulling the breaker out of the spa panel and putting it in the main panel.

That method works great if you have a spa panel with a GFCI that will fit your breaker box. If the GFCI isn't directly compatible with you breaker box you won't be able to do that safely.

 

[emjay]

That method works great if you have a spa panel with a GFCI that will fit your breaker box. If the GFCI isn't directly compatible with you breaker box you won't be able to do that safely.

This is true. Since most people don't have a spare spa panel lying around though, people generally have to buy one. I just made sure to buy the right kind.

 

[emjay]

Was this fairly self-explanatory or should I be looking for a DIY thread talking more about 'salvaging' a GFCI from a spa panel?

I'm torn--- I like both of these ideas.

It is definitely self-explanatory, but you need to make sure the panel uses the same type of breaker. You can usually find what kind your main panel uses on the inside of the door.

 

[shroomzofdoom]

The spa panel, for most people, is a cheaper way to get a GFCI and place your outlet in the box.

You may not need it in your configuration and I am not an electrician-but there may be something in the code about not mounting anything directly to the main breaker panel box. Only through conduit or romex with clamps to an outlet box, etc. Hopefully you'll get some more on this from others.

 

[sethhobrin]

I have a 50A outlet running to my main panel. I have a spa panel with a short 6g plug to that outlet. then my rig also has a 6g plug that plugs in to the spa panel.

 

[summerofgeorge]

I have a 50A outlet running to my main panel. I have a spa panel with a short 6g plug to that outlet. then my rig also has a 6g plug that plugs in to the spa panel.

This is exactly what I was thinking. The location of everything won't change but I'd have the additional 50A outlet/plug between the main and spa panels for portability. I'm just surprised that more people don't go this route.

 

[emjay]

This is exactly what I was thinking. The location of everything won't change but I'd have the additional 50A outlet/plug between the main and spa panels for portability. I'm just surprised that more people don't go this route.

It'll technically work, but it won't be up to code. Plus, I doubt many people expect to be able to plug in somewhere else.

Personally, I prefer not to have the GFCI in the same room, for increased safety.

One thing I should add is that you should probably check the main breaker before using an outlet somewhere else. Although the outlet is a 50A, it's often (I would even say USUALLY) only on a 40A circuit.

 

[P-J]

It'll technically work, but it won't be up to code. Plus, I doubt many people expect to be able to plug in somewhere else.

Personally, I prefer not to have the GFCI in the same room, for increased safety.

One thing I should add is that you should probably check the breaker before using an outlet somewhere else. Although the outlet is a 50A, it's often (I would even say USUALLY) only on a 40A circuit.

What????

 

[emjay]

What????

Which part? I assume the last?

Perhaps it's not that way in the US (though I could've sworn it is in most states), but in Canada, the standard 50A outlets are used for 40A kitchen ranges, and as such most have 40A breakers and 8AWG wiring, as wiring the circuit for 50A is an unneeded expense. Even the person I had help me find the outlet at Home Depot (when I was buying the stuff to run a 50A line) had *no* idea what I meant when talking about a 50A outlet... when I said they're typically used for stoves, he showed me the outlet I was looking for, but insisted it was a 40A until I pointed out the small lettering on it.

 

[CidahMastah]

the standard 50A outlets are used for 40A kitchen ranges, and as such most have 40A breakers and 8AWG wiring, as wiring the circuit for 50A is an unneeded expense. Even the person I had help me find the outlet at Home Depot (when I was buying the stuff to run a 50A line) had *no* idea what I meant when talking about a 50A outlet... when I said they're typically used for stoves, he showed me the outlet I was looking for, but insisted it was a 40A until I pointed out the small lettering on it.

My understanding regarding your comment on the 50amp breaker is that:
1. the 50 amp GFI breakers are far more common, thus much cheaper (than 40 amp). This is why they are used for ranges requiring 40 amps.

Although the outlet is a 50A, it's often (I would even say USUALLY) only on a 40A circuit.

It just doesn't make any sense that they would call it a 50amp breaker if it was really rated for 40 amps. Not sure if that is what you are trying to say there. They may be more commonly found on a 40 amp circuit because ranges require 40 amp and the 50 amp breakers are cheaper and more common.

Personally, I prefer not to have the GFCI in the same room, for increased safety.

As for your statesmen regarding the GFI, why would it be safer to have it in another room? As long as the GFI doesn't ahve some other risk attached to it (near water, etc.), i would think a GFI that is placed closer to the rig would be potentially safer.

I am not a licensed electrician, so if you are I would defer to your experience, or PJ's, as I know he has a lot of years experience as a wire bender

 

[emjay]

I'm not saying the breakers are 50A. In the circumstances I'm talking about, they're 40A and there's no confusion. I'm saying that 50A outlets are used on a 40A breaker/wiring.

As for it being safer... you're brewing. That's plenty "near water". In fact, that's why a GFCI is an absolute requirement. Keeping it in another room keeps it safe from nearly everything you're trying to protect yourself from in the first place.

 

[CidahMastah]

I'm not saying the breakers are 50A. In the circumstances I'm talking about, they're 40A and there's no confusion. I'm saying that 50A outlets are used on a 40A breaker/wiring.

Gotcha - my misread.

As for it being safer... you're brewing. That's plenty "near water". In fact, that's why a GFCI is an absolute requirement. Keeping it in another room keeps it safe from nearly everything you're trying to protect yourself from in the first place.

I think that is a personal preference vs. a requirement (placement in another room).

If you put your panel on the wall at a good height, out of the way in your brewing room, I think that is perfectly safe. Mine is set up like this in a 20X12 ish ssized room with 15 ft or so power cords from the breaker outlets to the control panel. Unless your brewing room is the size of a closet.

If you have water jetting out, then yes. You would need to consider your panel location wisely.

 

[emjay]

Gotcha - my misread.

I think that is a personal preference vs. a requirement (placement in another room).

If you put your panel on the wall at a good height, out of the way in your brewing room, I think that is perfectly safe. Mine is set up like this in a 20X12 ish ssized room with 15 ft or so power cords from the breaker outlets to the control panel. Unless your brewing room is the size of a closet.

If you have water jetting out, then yes. You would need to consider your panel location wisely.

No, I agree. I wasn't touting it as a requirement, just stating my preference.

 

[CidahMastah]

I hear ya. Like a lot of things, when common sense comes into play some people don't have it. So your recommendation certainly isn't a bad one

 

[summerofgeorge]

It'll technically work, but it won't be up to code. Plus, I doubt many people expect to be able to plug in somewhere else.

Can you explain why it won't be up to code? If the outlet connected to the main breaker is installed to code, isn't that what really matters? The spa panel basically becomes an extension cord with a breaker in it. How is stringing them together different (as far as code goes) than moving the GFCI breaker to the control panel? Not trying to stir anything up; I honestly don't know the answer.

I'm not intending on brewing off premises but figured why not spend a few extra bucks now to have the option later.