Poll: Do you have, or plan to get, an electric car?

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Do you have an electric car or plan to get one?

  • Yes

  • No

  • I plan to

  • Over my dead body


Results are only viewable after voting.
I like PHEV as a concept, but I'm not sure it would make all that much sense economically. The problem with PHEV is that you're adding all the cost/infrastructure of the BEV (but thankfully lower cost/capacity of battery), but you're not eliminating any of the ICEV stuff. From a reliability / mechanical complexity standpoint, you now have two powertrains to support, and ~twice the number of potential failure points.

If PHEV was essentially the same cost as ICEV, it would be a slam dunk. But a quick google search suggests it's ~15% higher than an equivalent ICEV.

If my next vehicle is going to be battery-powered, I think it's better to go pure BEV than worry about PHEV. I think PHEVs are mostly a "gateway drug" to BEV. People buy a PHEV and then buy one tank of gas every 4-6 months and realize "maybe I don't need that combustion engine in there!"

At least that's my thought... @Kent88 would you agree as someone who lived it?
For the few PHEV I have owned, one ex-wife Pacifica and one Ford C-Max for my kids, both of which had small plug in batteries, it was about having the option to go on long trips and in cold weather without having to worry about battery capacity. It definitely worked well for us. The ex hardly drove more than 10 miles a day, the kids mostly the same.

I would say in my world it was definitely a gateway. My own driving needs just don’t add up for electric yet. I have a hybrid F-150 that I love. It allows me to tow my boat or other trailers, go to the big box stores on the weekend, and not get embarrassingly bad mileage when I do day trips for work that can exceed 300 miles round trip. It also allows me to get to meetings when we have a big snow fall, which I like.

I have contemplated getting a second vehicle for when I don’t need the truck, but the extra insurance alone puts me off. Between the extra upfront costs and the extra insurance it would never offset the savings in mileage.

I am sure I will go electric someday, just not quite yet.
 
Everyone who spouts easily disproven lies about EV. They’re either doing it on purpose to protect big oil, or being willfully ignorant.

There’s a big difference between “I’m not into them, I don’t want to charge on roadtrips,” vs, “I can’t drive a car that might stop at any moment because the battery died suddenly.”
 
On a full battery I can go about 75 hours just running heat.

That's quite a while. I have no idea how long my primary car would run/idle on a full tank of gas to keep the heat on continuously.

That said, how often would you be stuck in the middle of nowhere with a fully charged battery? I typically fill the gas tank before I head to the middle of nowhere but it's not still full when I get there.




(Before too many get their knickers in a twist, I'm just having a little fun with the scenario.)
 
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That said, how often would you be stuck in the middle of nowhere with a fully charged battery? I typically fill the gas tank before I head to the middle of nowhere but it's not still full when I get there.

, I'm up here living in a place that typically gets snow 4-6 months of the year. One thing you learn when you grow up in this area, is that you cut wayyyy back on unnecessary trips when the snow starts to fly. You also learn that everyone who matters is pretty forgiving if you need to cancel plans because there's a blizzard or a cold snap. The Christmas before last, we had a heckuva cold snap (did you know that cold temps also negatively impact ICE vehicles? It was pretty obvious that week) and blizzard, and my spouse and I pride ourselves on being able to visit our families on holidays. We didn't make it that year, and nobody is holding a grudge because of it.

You know what lots of people do on winter road trips around here? Wear base layers and bring along clothes you can put over them. Lots of people have emergency blankets here. Sure, there are some unfortunate souls who don't learn it soon enough, but most do. My in-laws love to ice fish, so we have clothes for when we need to sit in the freezing cold for hours and hours. I appreciate your concern for us up here, but a lot of us who have spent our lives in this terrific climate know how it goes. And the people who move here learn how to prepare for winter pretty quickly.

Look, when you move here, or decide you aren't going to move away, you accept some risk that you're going to live with unique to parts of the world that get snow. Every decision you make in the winter creates new potential problems. I've heard of people with ICE vehicles, nearly full gas tanks, who go off-road in a blizzard, call for help, and while they wait for rescue the snow keeps coming down and they don't clean the snow away from their tailpipe.

It isn't just vehicles. If you don't keep your furnace in good shape, you could end up with no heat and pipes burst. If you don't shovel your driveway and sidewalks you can slip and break a leg. If it's an ice storm that could happen anyway because how do you shovel ice?

I could go on.

Everywhere in the world has its challenges. One of the jobs my spouse looked at after college would've had us move to Arizona. I have a family member who lived there for a couple years after graduating high school, and he told us about some of the challenges they have that are different from what we deal with.

If you're that concerned about the what-ifs in life and want to be better prepared there are probably dozens of prepper forums on the internet you could go create accounts on, or you can make a thread on the topic here in Chit Chat. If you aren't that hardcore and just want to be prepared for road trip through an unfamiliar part of the world or some short hikes at a park or wilderness area, I suggest a waterproof phone case, backup phone battery, and a kit you make after reading Les Stroud's book. And if you have the money and want even more peace of mind, a GPS with an SOS button. (Edit: which I believe most EVs have built in with a service like OnStar)
 
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@Kent88

As you quoted me, it's not clear to me if the point was to build on/expand what I said in a general way, or is something directed specifically to/at me?
 
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One of the jobs my spouse looked at after college would've had us move to Arizona. I have a family member who lived there for a couple years after graduating high school, and he told us about some of the challenges they have that are different from what we deal with.
Which part? Arizona is a big state. You can experience three seasons in a day on a road trip at the right time of year.

I have an Aunt who moved to Phoenix to be closer to her daughters. The way she puts it is, "Summer in Phoenix is like winter in Newark - I just don't go outside."
 
@Kent88

It's not clear to me if the point of that was to build on/expand what I said or is something else more negative in implication. Which?

It wasn't clear to me what the point of your scenario was. Almost nobody gets stranded at a gas pump or an EV charging station in such a way that you're in danger of being stuck there without fast access to a tow truck, a place to get out of the elements, and water. Of course you've depleted your tank or battery at least a little to get to a place where access to those sorts of things would be difficult.

I didn't understand where you were going with that, so I was reaching for how to respond in a way that might move the conversation along. I figured I'd beat the dead horse of what happens if you're stranded in the middle of nowhere and it's snowing and you're in a BEV. I imagine it's not too different from being stranded in an ICEV.

Edit:
In response to your "... is something directed specifically to/at me?". My intention was and is not to be aggressive towards you, if that's what you're concerned about.
 
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It wasn't clear to me what the point of your scenario was. Almost nobody gets stranded at a gas pump or an EV charging station in such a way that you're in danger of being stuck there without fast access to a tow truck, a place to get out of the elements, and water.

The part in bold was the underlying implication of what I posted.

Meaning, yeah, it's pretty amazing a full battery lasts 75 hours running the heater but full battery wouldn't be the stranded in the middle of nowhere scenario (actually put forth by TexasTea).
 
I'm not sure whether you're asking for feedback or commenting that 75 hours of just having the heat on is a long time.
 
Neither. Just saying that it's amazing to me the battery can/will provide heat for 75 hours if the implication is 75 hours continuous.

I doubt my 3.6L car can/would idle and provide heat for 75 hours continuous on 15gal of gas.
 
Meaning, yeah, it's pretty amazing a full battery lasts 75 hours running the heater but full battery wouldn't be the stranded in the middle of nowhere scenario (actually put forth by TexasTea).
I personally just find it interesting that someone with the username TexasTea and has a profile designating him as living in Texas is really all that concerned with what happens when one gets stranded in a blizzard.
 
full battery wouldn't be the stranded in the middle of nowhere scenario
Would full gas tank be more likely?
I personally just find it interesting that someone with the username TexasTea and has a profile designating him as living in Texas is really all that concerned with what happens when one gets stranded in a blizzard.
I don't think he actually specified blizzard or any other specific weather event. Just getting stuck in the cold. But at any rate, blizzards are not unheard of in certain parts of Texas and are also more dangerous where they are rare, since people are less likely to be prepared or to take appropriate precautions (like staying the hell home for instance).
 
Those would be the questions, if one really wanted to make some sort of apples to apples comparison.

Since electricity to heat conversion is near 100% efficient (and presuming an EV always uses electric heater?) certainly it has a point of use advantage there.

How far back to the point of origin would a real analysis have to go? Too far to be of anything more than having a bit of fun with the scenario, for me anyway.
 
I personally just find it interesting that someone with the username TexasTea and has a profile designating him as living in Texas is really all that concerned with what happens when one gets stranded in a blizzard.

Nah, I appreciate the concern. I usually get concerned when I hear about the polar vortex hitting Texas, or a hurricane.

If I find myself in a hurricane, I would defer to someone who lived through one on the Texas gulf coast (not that I have any idea where he is, he could be on the completely opposite side of the state for all I know) if I could, though.
 
Sorry. So if one actually wanted to take this beyond just having a little fun with the scenario, I guess the relevant question would be how long you could idle an ICE vehicle per gallon vs how long you could run the heater in a BEV per kwh.

Different vehicles have different efficiency, though.

An Aptera is going to handle that test differently than a Rivian, which will be different from my Bolt.

Just like a Grand Wagoneer is going to handle that test differently than a Smart car vs a Maverick.
 
This February I went on a cruise with a Chinese factory owner I consult for. He asked me if I would ever buy and EV and I said no. He told me "Thats because you're smart". Then him and his wife told me a EV horror story from China. During Chinese New Year holidays this year in Feb, Thousands of EVs got stranded in a snowstorm. He said a 373 mile trip took 13 hours if you could even make it without losing charge. Many people couldn't make it, the batteries died. People abandonded vehicles , they got covered by snow, then chewed up by snowplows.

He was laughing about it. He said he would never have one of those things either.
 
... and the ICE vehicles just turned on their anti-snow halo and all the snow magically parted in front of them?

Blizzards affect the roads ICE vehicles travel on, too. If there's a foot of snow over a thick layer of ice and the plows aren't running, nobody is going anywhere. Regardless of whether you're powered by petrol or powered by electrons.
 
Theres an article on bloomberg about it. It's behind a paywall. long-charging-lines-snow-stymie-ev-drivers-in-china-new-year Basicaly, it says the reasons for the EV failures were:

1.) there aren't enough charging stations. Thats going to be a heavy lift to fix that
2.) Many people were on the road at once due to being a holiday.
They were running out charge due to congestion, long wait times for chargers.

The snow was just the icing on that EV crap sandwich.

WOULD NOT HAVE ONE.
 
and nobody has ever had to wait in line for gas at a gas station?

Edit: do you know where this billboard is?

gasnow.jpg
 
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Theres an article on bloomberg about it. It's behind a paywall. long-charging-lines-snow-stymie-ev-drivers-in-china-new-year Basicaly, it says the reasons for the EV failures were:

1.) there aren't enough charging stations. Thats going to be a heavy lift to fix that
2.) Many people were on the road at once due to being a holiday.
They were running out charge due to congestion, long wait times for chargers.

The snow was just the icing on that EV crap sandwich.

WOULD NOT HAVE ONE.
Sounds like a China problem. But you’re looking for anti-EV verification so it works for you. Bravo!
 
I’ve told this story before and I’ll tell it again.

In 2022 I had plane tickets set to head to Orlando for a gaming convention. Hurricane Ian canceled my flight. Around lunchtime on Thursday (I was originally flying Friday morning) my wife saw how I annoyed I was and convinced me to drive.

Within 15 minutes I was in my car. No pre-planning at all. I drove 19 hours straight. Passed through the storm as it looped back into South Carolina. Not once did I have problems finding a charge. What I did witness - on the drive and in Orlando - was gas car drivers all lined up waiting for deliveries. Exactly what we went through here in NYC during Sandy in 2012.

I stayed 3 days and drove back home, again with zero issues and no pre-planning.

Over my 2.5 years of EV ownership (and 60,000 miles), I’ve learned that every single thing anti-EV’ers parrot is 100% false.

The only key point is having access to home charging. If have that, you’re 100% going to experience a better vehicle ownership situation than any gas car can provide. If you don’t, stick to gas.

Keep your inconvenient gas car, but drop the superiority act. It’s pathetic.
 
South Dakota

Specifically:

HIEB'S CENEX​

HWY 47 & 248
RELIANCE, SD 57569

"Too bad the sign is pointing an at an dilapidated barn and there’s nothing else in sight. Including an exit."

I've seen this sign in person.

There are places in the good ol' US of A where you can go miles on a major road/highway without seeing a gas station. Even after all these years of ICEV dominance. It's been something like 110 years since Horatio's drive, but we still don't have gas stations everywhere.

The density of gas stations vs charging stations in a particular area and at this point doesn't have anything to do with whether EVs are good vehicles as a whole.
 
This February I went on a cruise with a Chinese factory owner I consult for. He asked me if I would ever buy and EV and I said no. He told me "Thats because you're smart". Then him and his wife told me a EV horror story from China. During Chinese New Year holidays this year in Feb, Thousands of EVs got stranded in a snowstorm. He said a 373 mile trip took 13 hours if you could even make it without losing charge. Many people couldn't make it, the batteries died. People abandonded vehicles , they got covered by snow, then chewed up by snowplows.

He was laughing about it. He said he would never have one of those things either.
I've had a Tesla for over 6 years now and live in a state bordering Canada. It's kind of the middle of nowhere and it gets f'ing cold here. Never had a problem with the cold or charging infrastructure. This nonsense that EV die on cold days is about as true as the rumors they burst into flames more often then gas cars. My battery loss on really cold days is about 8% which is about on par with ICE vehicles. The rumors of bad outcomes in the cold are from cars without battery thermal management which for the most part really aren't made anymore.

I know you want to believe that ICE is superior and that all the EV owners are nutjobs but the truth is they really are better in almost every way except for maybe long distance towing applications. I've owned a lot of gas and diesel vehicles in my life and so have experience with both as opposed to working off somebody told me this or that. Don't rely on second hand stories but instead go find out the truth for yourself.
 
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Why do the haters and the media keep touting this report as “almost half” when it’s actually 29% - ie, less than one third?

Are they really this dumb or am I missing something?

Btw, I’m on vacation with our gas car and I can’t wait to get back to driving the Tesla. It’s annoying as hell. We stopped twice on the drive, for roughly 30 minutes each time. Exactly as we would have in the Tesla. The only difference is that rather than the car setting it up for me, I had to keep playing around on my phone to find places to stop. I kind of wish I had a Y, my 3 is not the family car.
 
Why do the haters and the media keep touting this report as “almost half” when it’s actually 29% - ie, less than one third?

Are they really this dumb or am I missing something?

Btw, I’m on vacation with our gas car and I can’t wait to get back to driving the Tesla. It’s annoying as hell. We stopped twice on the drive, for roughly 30 minutes each time. Exactly as we would have in the Tesla. The only difference is that rather than the car setting it up for me, I had to keep playing around on my phone to find places to stop. I kind of wish I had a Y, my 3 is not the family car.
The part about combining polling since 2021 is somewhat concerning as to the freshness of the data. Although I can see if they asked people stuck with using non NACS charging networks that might tend to tug that number in the wrong direction.
 
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