Please critique my Brew Day plan

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gwhite94621

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My friend and I recently acquired a brew system from a guy who had given the hobby up. We got all the equipment, but no "owner's manual" so I am trying to piece it together based on my own (limited) knowledge of brewing and a whole lot of reading and YouTube.

I think I've written a good Brew Day plan, but I am hoping more experienced eyes may catch some steps I have wrong or steps I may be missing altogether. For the sake of this post, lets pretend that all the equipment has been perfectly sanitized. I am mostly interested in making sure I have the steps in the right order.

Brewing Equipment Diagram

Brewing Step-By-Step (only the "Brew Day" tab)

Thanks for your time
 

Attachments

  • Brewing Equipment Diagram.pdf
    29.8 KB
  • Brewing Step-By-Step - Brew Day.pdf
    57.1 KB
You're jumping into a pretty complicated system type for being new and there are a million different ways to approach this. One glaring thing is that the brew day document has an unnecessary vorlauf step. When you run a HERMS system, the constant recirculation is a gigantic vorlauf so ditch that whole thing.

The way you have your "dough in" step setup is called underletting; filling the mash tun with water AFTER the grain is already in there. It's one of the harder moves regarding landing on the correct termpature because you have to anticipate heat loss to the grain AND to the mash tun itself.

The other challenge to fully emptying the HLT at dough in is that you'll never get cold water, via a refill, to heat up fast enough to participate in the HERMS temp hold. The more simple way to handle the start up is to set the strike water into the MLT and fill the HLT right at the beginning and heat the strike water passively through the HERMS coil.

1732588779467.png



all the steps illustrated here:

https://www.brewhardware.com/category_s/1973.htm
 
My plan would be to get a bag and a kettle.

One of the big dangers of brewing is falling in love with the machinery and the engineering so you end up wasting a lot of energy becoming a mechanic.

I blew a grand on a Braumeister, and I do mean "blew." It was fun messing with it and trying to optimize it, but it was a lot more work than BIAB, it could not do as much, and the beer was no better. Cleaning it was a royal pain. It breaks down into...let's see...8 must-be-washed parts, I think? Now I just throw a pot on the stove with a bag inside it. The bag goes in the washing machine.

I have never done HERMS, but I see people saying it's great because it's efficient. I don't even understand that. Maybe someone can explain it to me. I say spend $23 on grain instead of $20 and don't worry about it. Am I wrong? What are we talking about? In 2024, maybe the price of a bottle of water and a Snickers bar?
 
Thank you for replying. The comment on vorlauf makes sense, I'm gonna remove that now.

I think I understand what you mean about the better method to "dough in" but want to restate it to see if my understanding is correct.

I would pour my desired amount of mash water directly to the Mash Tun and circulate the water through the HERMS system. I would also fill the HLT with water and wait for the HLT to reach the desired temperature. The water in the Mash Tun would also come to temperature thanks to the HERMS system.

Once the water in the HLT and Mash Tun are at target temp I then add my grains to the Mash Tun.
 
My plan would be to get a bag and a kettle.

One of the big dangers of brewing is falling in love with the machinery and the engineering so you end up wasting a lot of energy becoming a mechanic.

I blew a grand on a Braumeister, and I do mean "blew." It was fun messing with it and trying to optimize it, but it was a lot more work than BIAB, it could not do as much, and the beer was no better. Cleaning it was a royal pain. It breaks down into...let's see...8 must-be-washed parts, I think? Now I just throw a pot on the stove with a bag inside it. The bag goes in the washing machine.

I have never done HERMS, but I see people saying it's great because it's efficient. I don't even understand that. Maybe someone can explain it to me. I say spend $23 on grain instead of $20 and don't worry about it. Am I wrong? What are we talking about? In 2024, maybe the price of a bottle of water and a Snickers bar?
I appreciate the response. I warned him when we were shopping this was a LOT of system. It was a heck of a deal on FB marketplace at least. We will definitely be brewing with water for the first round.
 
Sorry if I'm being a downer. I saw your post count and thought maybe you hadn't been warned. Everyone should do what they enjoy. I'm sure you'll do great, but if I had to wash that apparatus once, I'd start buying beer at the store. You'll be doing maybe 6 times as much washing as I do.
 
Wrt to the strike - the "underletting" is highly desirable vs the alternatives, which always tend toward creating "dough balls" of your grist, which is a pita and requires manual labor to "fix". Stick with underletting the strike - and consider employing a "brew day" software package, like Brewer's Friend, or BeerSmith, which will do the hard math, based on your grist bill and other inputs, to figure out the temperature and volume of your strike liquor, so you can predictably hit your initial mash temperature, whatever you choose that to be. I've been underletting the strike for years and would never use any alternative now...

Cheers!
 
Sorry if I'm being a downer. I saw your post count and thought maybe you hadn't been warned. Everyone should do what they enjoy. I'm sure you'll do great, but if I had to wash that apparatus once, I'd start buying beer at the store. You'll be doing maybe 6 times as much washing as I do.
Not at all Dude. Your advice is correct. I told my buddy I knew how to drive a 1987 Honda Civic and he went ahead and bought a Porsche since they're both cars. He and I like a good challenge and now we have one!
 
Wrt to the strike - the "underletting" is highly desirable vs the alternatives, which always tend toward creating "dough balls" of your grist, which is a pita and requires manual labor to "fix". Stick with underletting the strike - and consider employing a "brew day" software package, like Brewer's Friend, or BeerSmith, which will do the hard math, based on your grist bill and other inputs, to figure out the temperature and volume of your strike liquor, so you can predictably hit your initial mash temperature, whatever you choose that to be. I've been underletting the strike for years and would never use any alternative now...

Cheers!
Underletting is a concept I wasn't familiar with, but from a quick google the logic seems sound.


One question about the "dough balls" -- does the vigorous stirring of the grains not break this sort of thing up?


I do have BeerSmith back from when I used to brew a bunch, hopefully I can find it again. I haven't shifted attention to individual recipies yet, right now I am trying to get the generic process down and then I'll layer in the unique values like how much water, grain and hops are added.
 
You're jumping into a pretty complicated system type for being new and there are a million different ways to approach this. One glaring thing is that the brew day document has an unnecessary vorlauf step. When you run a HERMS system, the constant recirculation is a gigantic vorlauf so ditch that whole thing.

The way you have your "dough in" step setup is called underletting; filling the mash tun with water AFTER the grain is already in there. It's one of the harder moves regarding landing on the correct termpature because you have to anticipate heat loss to the grain AND to the mash tun itself.

The other challenge to fully emptying the HLT at dough in is that you'll never get cold water, via a refill, to heat up fast enough to participate in the HERMS temp hold.
I don’t do HERMS, but I have been curious and really appreciate your detailed breakdown; that’s really awesome!
I do have one question: If I were wanting to utilize this system and take advantage of underletting the mash tun, could I not heat the strike water in the boil kettle while bringing the HLT up to temperature? Wouldn’t this put me on “go” with the HERMS simultaneously with the addition of the strike water addition to the mash tun?
 
Underletting is a concept I wasn't familiar with, but from a quick google the logic seems sound.


One question about the "dough balls" -- does the vigorous stirring of the grains not break this sort of thing up?


I do have BeerSmith back from when I used to brew a bunch, hopefully I can find it again. I haven't shifted attention to individual recipies yet, right now I am trying to get the generic process down and then I'll layer in the unique values like how much water, grain and hops are added.

Underletting is a valid technique, but stirring grain into water doesn't have to create dough balls. I've been stirring grain into water for 20 years and never had dough balls form. I use a large commercial whisk and just wave it side to side just under the surface of the water as the grain gets streamed in slow.

As I said, underletting is not without issues. The temperature of the strike water has to be about 12F hotter because it has to account for the temp loss to the cold mash tun.

You didn't mention how the system is heated. If the HLT and BK can be heated at the same time, you can fill the HLT to cover the HERMS coil and heat that while you heat the strike water in the BK. You can still underlet the mash if you wanted to but you'd have the HLT water appropriately hot for the mash phase to function.

The reason I like heating the mash tun's strike water passively through the HERMS coil is that the mash tun is fully preheated so that water only needs to be about 8F above your desired mash tun. It also has the entire system set up (all the hoses and valves) to the same mode that you'll stick with for the entire mash process. So, from system startup all the way through the mash, the system doesn't need to be touched/reconfigured. These 3 vessel systems are already complicated and a pain in the ass to run so the more simple you can keep it, the better.
 
I don’t do HERMS, but I have been curious and really appreciate your detailed breakdown; that’s really awesome!
I do have one question: If I were wanting to utilize this system and take advantage of underletting the mash tun, could I not heat the strike water in the boil kettle while bringing the HLT up to temperature? Wouldn’t this put me on “go” with the HERMS simultaneously with the addition of the strike water addition to the mash tun?

Yes, it's a valid process. The only downside is that it requires a few hose changes to get the water moved around.
 
My best suggestion is to make sure you take detailed notes throughout your brew day. What went well, what didn't, what would you change, etc. If you're using software like BeerSmith it likely has places where you can enter various measurements throughout the brew day (pre-boil volume, post boil volume, gravity readings at different steps, etc). If you don't use software make a sheet and record your measurements (with labels on what the measurement is!!!). This info will be very helpful as you refine your process and dial in your system.
 
In regards to Bobby's comments about the advantages of preheating the HERMS coil, I do just that (previously with my MT/RIMS loop, now with my external HERMS coil) but then I pump the water back out, bring it back to strike temp, dump in my grain to the MT and underlet my mash.
 
Underletting is a valid technique, but stirring grain into water doesn't have to create dough balls. I've been stirring grain into water for 20 years and never had dough balls form. I use a large commercial whisk and just wave it side to side just under the surface of the water as the grain gets streamed in slow.

As I said, underletting is not without issues. The temperature of the strike water has to be about 12F hotter because it has to account for the temp loss to the cold mash tun.

You didn't mention how the system is heated. If the HLT and BK can be heated at the same time, you can fill the HLT to cover the HERMS coil and heat that while you heat the strike water in the BK. You can still underlet the mash if you wanted to but you'd have the HLT water appropriately hot for the mash phase to function.

The reason I like heating the mash tun's strike water passively through the HERMS coil is that the mash tun is fully preheated so that water only needs to be about 8F above your desired mash tun. It also has the entire system set up (all the hoses and valves) to the same mode that you'll stick with for the entire mash process. So, from system startup all the way through the mash, the system doesn't need to be touched/reconfigured. These 3 vessel systems are already complicated and a pain in the ass to run so the more simple you can keep it, the better.
I didn't specify in my initial post, but I have a heating element in both the HLT and brew kettle, so I ultimately went with the 50amp configuration in the link you shared. As you suggested, we are going to pour grain into hot water vs the other way around. We're planning to brew water this weekend and beer next weekend. I greatly appreciate the advice. I'm sure I'll be back with questions after our first attempt!
 
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