Phantasm NEIPA

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jackbflyin

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I’m making an NEIPA using phantasm. I thought I’d post it for comments.

Phantasm Citra/Mosaic NEIPA - 7.4%
OG: 1.072
FG: 1.016
SRM:5.6
Batch Size: 6 gal
Brewhouse Efficiency: 70%

8 lb 8 oz - Brewers Malt 2-Row 1.9
2 lb 5 oz - Pilsner 1.8 °L (13.6%)
1 lb 12 oz - Golden Naked Oats 7.3
1 lb 10 oz - Rye Malt 2.8 °L (9.5%)
1 lb - Oats, Flaked 1.6 °L (5.9%)
12 oz - Chit Malt 1.5 °L (4.4%)
12 oz - Corn Sugar 0 °L (4.4%)
6 oz - Rice Hulls 0 °L (2.2%)
1 oz - Cascade - 13% (13 IBU)

Mash Profile
113 °F - 20 min - protien rest
156 °F - 60 min - Sacharification
168 °F - 10 min - Mash Out

Boil
15 min - Boil - 0.5 items - Whirlfloc
10 min - Boil - 0.5 tsp - Yeast Nutrients
5 min - 0.2 oz -cryo Citra - 25% (5 IBU)
5 min - 0.2 oz - cryo Mosaic - 22% (5 IBU)
Flameout - 100 g - Phantasm

Hop Stand
20 min hopstand @ 185 °F- 0.5 oz - cryo Sabro - 14% (4 IBU)
20 min 185 °F - 0.75 oz - cryo Citra - 25% (11 IBU)
20 min 185 °F - 0.75 oz - cryo Mosaic - 22% (10 IBU)

Dry Hops
Day 2 - 1.25 oz - cryo Citra - 25%
Day 2 - 1.25 oz - cryo Mosaic - 22%
Day 2 - 50 g - Phantasm

Miscellaneous
Mash - 6.09 g - Calcium Chloride (CaCl2)
Mash - 0.8 g - Canning Salt (NaCl)
Mash - 1.02 g - Epsom Salt (MgSO4)
Mash - 1.44 g - Gypsum (CaSO4)
Mash - 0.5 g - Sodium Metabisulfite (Na2S2O5)
Sparge - 5.31 g - Calcium Chloride (CaCl2)
Sparge - 0.7 g - Canning Salt (NaCl)
Sparge - 0.89 g - Epsom Salt (MgSO4)
Sparge - 1.25 g - Gypsum (CaSO4)
Sparge - 0.44 g - Sodium Metabisulfite (Na2S2O5)

Yeast
1 pkg - Omega Cosmic Punch OYL-402
Ale

Fermenting
66 °F - 1 days - Primary
74 °F (7 day ramp) - 1 days - Primary

Water Profile
Ca 100 Mg 5 Na 22 Cl 171 SO 85
SO/Cl ratio: 0.5

 
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jackbflyin

jackbflyin

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Hopcraft Supply Company. Shipped quickly.
 

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t^3

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Great to see phantasm being sold to the public, I definitely want to try it. It will be great to hear your results. Anyone know if this stuff dissolves in beer or does it suck up beer like hops do?
 

Atterazlac

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I’m making an NEIPA using phantasm. I thought I’d post it for comments.

Phantasm Citra/Mosaic NEIPA - 7.4%
OG: 1.072
FG: 1.016
SRM:5.6
Batch Size: 6 gal
Brewhouse Efficiency: 70%

8 lb 8 oz - Brewers Malt 2-Row 1.9
2 lb 5 oz - Pilsner 1.8 °L (13.6%)
1 lb 12 oz - Golden Naked Oats 7.3
1 lb 10 oz - Rye Malt 2.8 °L (9.5%)
1 lb - Oats, Flaked 1.6 °L (5.9%)
12 oz - Chit Malt 1.5 °L (4.4%)
12 oz - Corn Sugar 0 °L (4.4%)
6 oz - Rice Hulls 0 °L (2.2%)
1 oz - Cascade - 13% (13 IBU)

Mash Profile
113 °F - 20 min - protien rest
156 °F - 60 min - Sacharification
168 °F - 10 min - Mash Out

Boil
15 min - Boil - 0.5 items - Whirlfloc
10 min - Boil - 0.5 tsp - Yeast Nutrients
5 min - 0.2 oz -cryo Citra - 25% (5 IBU)
5 min - 0.2 oz - cryo Mosaic - 22% (5 IBU)
Flameout - 100 g - Phantasm

Hop Stand
20 min hopstand @ 185 °F- 0.5 oz - cryo Sabro - 14% (4 IBU)
20 min 185 °F - 0.75 oz - cryo Citra - 25% (11 IBU)
20 min 185 °F - 0.75 oz - cryo Mosaic - 22% (10 IBU)

Dry Hops
Day 2 - 1.25 oz - cryo Citra - 25%
Day 2 - 1.25 oz - cryo Mosaic - 22%
Day 2 - 50 g - Phantasm

Miscellaneous
Mash - 6.09 g - Calcium Chloride (CaCl2)
Mash - 0.8 g - Canning Salt (NaCl)
Mash - 1.02 g - Epsom Salt (MgSO4)
Mash - 1.44 g - Gypsum (CaSO4)
Mash - 0.5 g - Sodium Metabisulfite (Na2S2O5)
Sparge - 5.31 g - Calcium Chloride (CaCl2)
Sparge - 0.7 g - Canning Salt (NaCl)
Sparge - 0.89 g - Epsom Salt (MgSO4)
Sparge - 1.25 g - Gypsum (CaSO4)
Sparge - 0.44 g - Sodium Metabisulfite (Na2S2O5)

Yeast
1 pkg - Omega Cosmic Punch OYL-402
Ale

Fermenting
66 °F - 1 days - Primary
74 °F (7 day ramp) - 1 days - Primary

Water Profile
Ca 100 Mg 5 Na 22 Cl 171 SO 85
SO/Cl ratio: 0.5

Did you brew this yet? Would you be willing to share comments, impressions, and pictures? I was also able to snag 1 pound of Phantasm and am looking to brew with it this month. Thanks!
 
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jackbflyin

jackbflyin

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I’d be happy to share. I brewed the beer and took it to my brew club tonight. Overwhelmingly the response was positive. Comments were mellow, tropical, very drinkable. I additionally might describe it as a bit of mamosa flavor. It’s interesting. The question I have is was in in part due to the phantasm. I’d like to brew the recipe again to see how different it is. And what effect the cosmic punch has. But what I brewed has a good flavor and everyone really liked it. Please let me know what you think.

file:///var/mobile/Library/SMS/Attachments/2f/15/44FC10A2-5EF3-45A7-AB2A-BA3BE51DFB18/Brewfather_Batch1_20220519.pdf
 

TBA

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I saw that and that he said in post 4 it was sold out. Wasn’t clear he got in before it sold out. Guess I was hoping he got it at another vendor.
 
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jackbflyin

jackbflyin

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I saw that and that he said in post 4 it was sold out. Wasn’t clear he got in before it sold out. Guess I was hoping he got it at another vendor.
Yes- I was fortunate to find it in stock at that store but haven’t been able to find it in stock anywhere since. Maybe next season.
 

Pianoman

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@jackbflyin out of curiosity, did the brew come out on the salty side? The recipe shows a LOT more chemicals then I would use. Also, unsure why one would need Sodium Metabisulfate since we're boiling anyway, any insight?
 
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jackbflyin

jackbflyin

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@jackbflyin out of curiosity, did the brew come out on the salty side? The recipe shows a LOT more chemicals then I would use. Also, unsure why one would need Sodium Metabisulfate since we're boiling anyway, any insight?
@jackbflyin out of curiosity, did the brew come out on the salty side? The recipe shows a LOT more chemicals then I would use. Also, unsure why one would need Sodium Metabisulfate since we're boiling anyway, any insight?
This is the water profile:
Ca 100 Mg 5 Na 22 Cl 171 SO 85. I start with RO water. It’s not salty. The sodium metabisulfate is below flavor threshold and is there as a oxygen reduction effort. Not necessary but I still do it.
 

Pianoman

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This is the water profile:
Ca 100 Mg 5 Na 22 Cl 171 SO 85. I start with RO water. It’s not salty. The sodium metabisulfate is below flavor threshold and is there as a oxygen reduction effort. Not necessary but I still do it.
Thanks. Recently had chatter about why some commercial NEIPAs taste so salty to me. I've assumed it's the chemicals. I've tried Ascorbic acid in the keg for oxygen control also. I couldn't tell you if it made any difference though. Just throwing it out there. Congratulations on your success!
 

superiorsat

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I’m making an NEIPA using phantasm. I thought I’d post it for comments.

After reading up on Phantasm a little bit it seems commercial breweries seem to think you can use small amounts of this and cut back on expensive hops. I see that it is $17.99 plus tax and shipping. Looks like you used the whole bag along with all the other expensive hops. Would you consider it worth the price?
 
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jackbflyin

jackbflyin

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Thanks. Recently had chatter about why some commercial NEIPAs taste so salty to me. I've assumed it's the chemicals. I've tried Ascorbic acid in the keg for oxygen control also. I couldn't tell you if it made any difference though. Just throwing it out there. Congratulations on your success!
After reading up on Phantasm a little bit it seems commercial breweries seem to think you can use small amounts of this and cut back on expensive hops. I see that it is $17.99 plus tax and shipping. Looks like you used the whole bag along with all the other expensive hops. Would you consider it worth the price?
I don’t think it’s worth it as a regular home beer but I’m glad I did the brew with it because it is different. It did produce a fruity beer I may describe as if it were a Sunday brunch mamosa. Is this the Sauvignon Blanc skins that have done it? I thought the thiols give aroma and not flavor but how could this not impart flavor too. I tried to approximate the proportion of Phantasm similar to ScottJanish.com, The Locksmith and had a little left over so I just tossed it into the primary day one with active fermentation. It’s nice beer and a little different in taste which I assume is because of the Phantasm. I think it’s worth playing with it just to see. Later in the summer I’ll brew it again but without the Phantasm to compare. Kind of fun. But for now I can’t see buying more, even if I could find it.
 

Ulisses4677

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I don’t think it’s worth it as a regular home beer but I’m glad I did the brew with it because it is different. It did produce a fruity beer I may describe as if it were a Sunday brunch mamosa. Is this the Sauvignon Blanc skins that have done it? I thought the thiols give aroma and not flavor but how could this not impart flavor too. I tried to approximate the proportion of Phantasm similar to ScottJanish.com, The Locksmith and had a little left over so I just tossed it into the primary day one with active fermentation. It’s nice beer and a little different in taste which I assume is because of the Phantasm. I think it’s worth playing with it just to see. Later in the summer I’ll brew it again but without the Phantasm to compare. Kind of fun. But for now I can’t see buying more, even if I could find it.
To get the best use out of phantasm beer and brewing magazine suggests using it on the hot side not in fermentation. They recommend adding it into the mash. I’ve brewed a neipa with phantasm cosmic punch and a west coast with star party and I do notice a huge difference in aroma and flavor.
 

troxerX

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To get the best use out of phantasm beer and brewing magazine suggests using it on the hot side not in fermentation. They recommend adding it into the mash. I’ve brewed a neipa with phantasm cosmic punch and a west coast with star party and I do notice a huge difference in aroma and flavor.
+1 I brewed a NEIPA using a US equivalent of Phantasm and Simcoe both in the mash and fermented with Cosmic Punch and a starter of Hill Farmstead yeast. Rounded it up with Azacca, Citra, Nelson and Galaxy at flameout and DDH with Citra and Galaxy. Beer came up insane. Will recommend moving everything to the mash as many references online mention order to take advantage of the mash enzymes to make more thiols available for the yeast to transform later on.
 

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Ulisses4677

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+1 I brewed a NEIPA using a US equivalent of Phantasm and Simcoe both in the mash and fermented with Cosmic Punch and a starter of Hill Farmstead yeast. Rounded it up with Azacca, Citra, Nelson and Galaxy at flameout and DDH with Citra and Galaxy. Beer came up insane. Will recommend moving everything to the mash as many references online mention order to take advantage of the mash enzymes to make more thiols available for the yeast to transform later on.
Looks great cheers.
 
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jackbflyin

jackbflyin

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+1 I brewed a NEIPA using a US equivalent of Phantasm and Simcoe both in the mash and fermented with Cosmic Punch and a starter of Hill Farmstead yeast. Rounded it up with Azacca, Citra, Nelson and Galaxy at flameout and DDH with Citra and Galaxy. Beer came up insane. Will recommend moving everything to the mash as many references online mention order to take advantage of the mash enzymes to make more thiols available for the yeast to transform later on.
Recipe?
 

troxerX

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BIAB w/4.2 gals of distilled water w/ LODO/YOS at a ratio of 2g/gal for each of bread yeast and sucrose starting @110F (allowing natural temp decay) for 1hr then adjusting with CACl, gypsum and magsulf following YOS.

TF Golden Promise 5Lb
Rahr 2-Row 1/2 Lb
Flaked Wheat 1Lb

Mashed @158F for 1hr using Anova Sous Vide for control w/ 2oz Simcoe and 1oz of grape/wine powder (both well mixed throughout). Pre-boil gravity: ~1.060

Boiled (not too aggressively) w/ 10oz dextrose midway until OG of 1.078 with 2oz Citra, 1oz Azacca, 1oz Nelson and 1oz Galaxy @ flameout.

Fermented with Cosmic Punch and Hill Farmstead yeast (from a Double Citra starter I keep). FG ~1.015. Single-fast dry hop with 2oz Citra and 2oz Galaxy for 8 hours right before low oxygen bottling (sorry, way too complex bottling procedure to post here).
 

marc1

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+1 I brewed a NEIPA using a US equivalent of Phantasm and Simcoe both in the mash and fermented with Cosmic Punch and a starter of Hill Farmstead yeast. Rounded it up with Azacca, Citra, Nelson and Galaxy at flameout and DDH with Citra and Galaxy. Beer came up insane. Will recommend moving everything to the mash as many references online mention order to take advantage of the mash enzymes to make more thiols available for the yeast to transform later on.
What's the US equivalent of Phantasm? Do you have a link?
 

troxerX

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Grape skin/wine powder/wine flour blends from New York Finger Lakes, there are multiple brands and multiple grape products.. I used the Riesling one but there’s red blends as well. Amazon carry most of them.
 

ZReynolds

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Grape skin/wine powder/wine flour blends from New York Finger Lakes, there are multiple brands and multiple grape products.. I used the Riesling one but there’s red blends as well. Amazon carry most of them.
Where can I find that stuff? I live in that region and would love to use local ingredients.
 

troxerX

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Just go into Amazon and search for finger lakes wine powder, multiple brands and grapes are available, they’re typically in brown bags.
 

SanPancho

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Grape skin/wine powder/wine flour blends from New York Finger Lakes, there are multiple brands and multiple grape products.. I used the Riesling one but there’s red blends as well. Amazon carry most of them.
is there data pointing to high levels of thiols from NY whites? or is this just an idea on using whites in general?
 
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