Partially frozen smack pack

[SaisonMan]

Hi, everyone. The other day, I noticed that the Wyeast 1214 I had in the fridge had more than a few lumpy ice pieces in it. The pack had probably been in there a month. I upped the temp, and the ice went away. I smacked it several hours ago in anticipation of making a yeast starter this afternoon. There's been a little swelling but not a whole lot. Any thoughts? Should there be more activity? Is it usable? I had planned on brewing Sunday. The Best if Used By Date is 5/23/22. Thanks!

 

[VikeMan]

The only way to know for sure what you've got would be to count viable cells. But it didn't freeze solid and I would bet there are some live yeast there. And the smack pack swelling indicates that too.

But since you're not brewing today, why not go ahead and build the yeast starter? That way you'll find out for sure if there are significant viable cells, and if the viable count was a bit low, you'll build it back up.

 

[SaisonMan]

The only way to know for sure what you've got would be to count viable cells. But it didn't freeze solid and I would bet there are some live yeast there. And the smack pack swelling indicates that too.

But since you're not brewing today, why not go ahead and build the yeast starter? That way you'll find out for sure if there are significant viable cells, and if the viable count was a bit low, you'll build it back up.

Yeah, that's what I was thinking too. Thanks. We'll see what happens!

 

[bwible]

This just happened to me with my pack of Imperial Pub. I had it inside of my kegerator and it was close to the back wall where I guess its colder. It got as you said partially frozen. It was an out of date pack that I got for free anyway so I had nothing to lose. I made a starter and to my surprise it came up pretty quickly. I stepped that starter up again and then just pitched it into a best bitter on Wed which has been happily fermenting away.

 

[SaisonMan]

This just happened to me with my pack of Imperial Pub. I had it inside of my kegerator and it was close to the back wall where I guess its colder. It got as you said partially frozen. It was an out of date pack that I got for free anyway so I had nothing to lose. I made a starter and to my surprise it came up pretty quickly. I stepped that starter up again and then just pitched it into a best bitter on Wed which has been happily fermenting away.

That’s great. I hope I have similar luck. I think I’m seeing a layer of sediment at the bottom of my flask, but it’s only a little lighter in color than the wort so I’m wondering if I’m seeing things. I’ll take a hydrometer reading at the 24-hour mark and hope for the best!

 

[Yesfan]

Definitely make a starter. Yeast are pretty resilient. A couple of years ago, I had some free dry yeast a friend of mine gave me that was 3 years old. Definitely past it expiration date. I made a starter and was shocked how quickly I recovered the colony. Pitched it on the next brew day for a 7% beer and it turned out pretty good!

 

[SaisonMan]

Definitely make a starter. Yeast are pretty resilient. A couple of years ago, I had some free dry yeast a friend of mine gave me that was 3 years old. Definitely past it expiration date. I made a starter and was shocked how quickly I recovered the colony. Pitched it on the next brew day for a 7% beer and it turned out pretty good!

Nice!

 

[SaisonMan]

Just took a hydrometer reading after 22 hours: 1.035. So I'm guessing the yeast is dead?

 

[tracer bullet]

Just took a hydrometer reading after 22 hours: 1.035. So I'm guessing the yeast is dead?

Maybe, but maybe not. Yeast reproduction is first, then it starts converting sugar to alcohol. Kinda like how you don't get beer in just 24 hours. Have you seen any signs of activity? Krausen layer, things like that?

 

[VikeMan]

Just took a hydrometer reading after 22 hours: 1.035. So I'm guessing the yeast is dead?

Assuming it started at 1.035, it might be.

 

[VikeMan]

Yeast reproduction is first, then it starts converting sugar to alcohol.

Yeast have already started to metabolize sugars while they are reproducing. They wouldn't get very far without it. A somewhat simplified view could be to say that sugar is turned into three things: biomass, alcohol, and CO2. No drop in gravity means that reproduction hasn't really got started.

There's a lot of adaptation types of things happening in the Lag phase, but there's little if any reproduction happening yet. That happens in the Logarithmic Growth (or "Log") phase. It's unfortunate that two very different phases have such similar names, i.e. Lag and Log. I've seen the distinction neatly fumbled by more than one blogger/article writer that should have known better.

Of course, real (yeast) life, with hundreds of billions of cells in a pitch, isn't quite so simple, and in reality the phases overlap a little.

 

[ike8228]

I do a starter everytime dry or liquid, just to get the juices flowing. Most of the time I get activity in the first 12 hours +/- 2. But I have had some take as much as 72 hrs before anything happens. There are a lot of factors that could be lagging. Because it was frozen, you may only have X% alive, which takes it that much long to reproduce. Yeast growth is exponential. Less to start with takes longer to get anything of significance. Give it more time. You can always increase your temp by a degree or two. That seems to do the trick for me sometimes. It just was a little too nippy to get ‘busy’.

 

[JeffersonStateBrewing]

@SaisonMan

Any updates on your stater? I recently had 10 or so smack packs freeze. I am planning a brew next weekend or the following and winner if i should go ahead and buy new yeast NOW, or wait until midweek to make a starter and hope the year is viable for brew day.

 

[SaisonMan]

@SaisonMan

Any updates on your stater? I recently had 10 or so smack packs freeze. I am planning a brew next weekend or the following and winner if i should go ahead and buy new yeast NOW, or wait until midweek to make a starter and hope the year is viable for brew day.

It’s still at 1.035. There’s now some serious foam when I stir but it goes away incredibly quickly. I didn’t measure the OG when I made the starter, but I used about 200 grams of DME and 1600 ml of water. It doesn’t seem possible that the FG would be 1.035. But I’m a newb, so what do I know? Also, my smack pack might have been partially frozen for 2-3 weeks before I realized it. You might have a different experience than I did.

 

[JeffersonStateBrewing]

sucks man, sorry to hear that. i think mine have been frozen since last September . i just realized recently that my keezer temp was a few degrees off of actual. my kegs did not freeze nor did some of the food, but the gallon of milk and some gallon jugs of water (used for thermal mass) did freeze, not all of them tho. so who knows. might have to replace my entire yeast store.

 

[SaisonMan]

sucks man, sorry to hear that. i think mine have been frozen since last September . i just realized recently that my keezer temp was a few degrees off of actual. my kegs did not freeze nor did some of the food, but the gallon of milk and some gallon jugs of water (used for thermal mass) did freeze, not all of them tho. so who knows. might have to replace my entire yeast store.

Hope you don't have to!

 

[JP_BeerFan]

sucks man, sorry to hear that. i think mine have been frozen since last September . i just realized recently that my keezer temp was a few degrees off of actual. my kegs did not freeze nor did some of the food, but the gallon of milk and some gallon jugs of water (used for thermal mass) did freeze, not all of them tho. so who knows. might have to replace my entire yeast store.

Good luck on not needing to do that.

You might try setting up some kind of small fan inside, to stir the air and make it a more even temp over the whole interior. That should really reduce cold spots.

Getting a temp logger of some sort, like the Inkbird one that was on evaluation offer some months back, would be helpful to see what's going on over time. You might be surprised how wide the swing is. My home fridge swings as much as 8deg! The fan I put in my mini fridge changed it from swinging 4-5deg to just 1-2 when I was evaluating it for a ferm chamber.

A cheap freezer thermometer with a high/low capture can give you an idea, as well. Nice to have true logging and a graph over time, if you're a nerdy/OCD kinda guy...

 

[JeffersonStateBrewing]

You might try setting up some kind of small fan inside, to stir the air and make it a more even temp over the whole interior. That should really reduce cold spots.

When i started builting the keezer i actually planned ahead and added thru holes for power for a fan or 2, and additional thermometers if i felt the need later... I have not installed said fans or anything else for that matter YET. time just gets away from me.

Getting a temp logger of some sort, like the Inkbird one that was on evaluation offer some months back, would be helpful to see what's going on over time. You might be surprised how wide the swing is. My home fridge swings as much as 8deg! The fan I put in my mini fridge changed it from swinging 4-5deg to just 1-2 when I was evaluating it for a ferm chamber.

I am actually controlling the keezer using the inkbird 308 wifi and if i am not mistaken t has logging on it. NOT helpful when the dumb thing is not calibrated correctly and shows it is running at 34-36 when it is actually running in the 28-32 range.

A cheap freezer thermometer with a high/low capture can give you an idea, as well. Nice to have true logging and a graph over time, if you're a nerdy/OCD kinda guy...

I am not an OCD kinda guy, used to be a nerd to the core! but now i am just over all of that. however; I was cheating and had a gallon jug of water in the freezer with a spare TILT floating in it to keep tabs on temp. it does some great graph stuff for temps and what not BUT i cannot seem to access it for the past few months. i hate the way the tilt reports to google xcel or what ever it is called. then once in a while it just quits and you gotta start over. this is a rant for another day. but i think the battery died and i didnt notice, that tells you how OCD i really am. LOL

 

[JP_BeerFan]

When i started builting the keezer i actually planned ahead and added thru holes for power for a fan or 2, and additional thermometers if i felt the need later... I have not installed said fans or anything else for that matter YET. time just gets away from me.



I am actually controlling the keezer using the inkbird 308 wifi and if i am not mistaken t has logging on it. NOT helpful when the dumb thing is not calibrated correctly and shows it is running at 34-36 when it is actually running in the 28-32 range.



I am not an OCD kinda guy, used to be a nerd to the core! but now i am just over all of that. however; I was cheating and had a gallon jug of water in the freezer with a spare TILT floating in it to keep tabs on temp. it does some great graph stuff for temps and what not BUT i cannot seem to access it for the past few months. i hate the way the tilt reports to google xcel or what ever it is called. then once in a while it just quits and you gotta start over. this is a rant for another day. but i think the battery died and i didnt notice, that tells you how OCD i really am. LOL

Time gets away from me.... wow, I need to work on that one, myself! Like Feb to August, and here I am, answering because I just happened on this thread again....

Hope you got the fan in there, and are happily monitoring very consistent temps via the Inkbird.
A suggestion I wanted to make back then... invest in a decent thermometer, and calibrate up that controller! It's pretty easy, especially if you tape the sensor to some thermal mass (like a water jug) to make the reading more stable.

I would highly recommend a Thermoworks Dash, the longer probe one, for a reference and great all around thermometer. More accurate (+-1F) than their cheaper models, has the backlight and rotating screen, and still less than half the price of their flagship model. (goes on sale often, as well) One of the most useful tools for the kitchen and BBQ, as well as this hobby.