Palisade Pale Ale (MO/Palisade SMaSH)

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Pelikan

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I've always been intrigued with the SMaSH concept, and now find myself with a surplus of both Maris Otter and Palisade.

Thus, I'm considering a MO/Palisade SMaSH. Wondering what those of you in the know think about this recipe (as I'm not at all familiar with SMaSH protocol).

Based upon 75% mash efficiency, and the use of 4oz 43ppg DME for the starter.

Palisade Pale Ale

Style: American Pale Ale
Size: 5.25 gallons
Mash Temp: 154*F
Color: ~5 SRM
Bitterness: ~35 IBU
OG: 1.056
FG: 1.013
ABV: 5.6%

10lb Maris Otter

1 oz Palisade 7.5% AA (60 min)
.75 oz Palisade " " (10 min)
1 oz Palisade " " (5 min)

Yeast: WLP001 California Ale

White Labs said:
This yeast is famous for its clean flavors, balance and ability to be used in almost any style ale. It accentuates the hop flavors and is extremely versatile.
 
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Pelikan

Pelikan

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Also, one important tid-bit that I overlooked. Water. I've been using RO with the following "all around" mineral addition: 1 gram epsom salts, 2.5 grams gypsum, 2 grams calcium chloride, which yields -- Calcium 60 ppm, Sulfates 94 ppm, Magnesium 5 ppm, Chloride 51 ppm.

Too much, too light, just right? FYI I do use buffer 5.2, so am not so much concerned about mash pH.
 

cytokine

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I just tried something similar with MO and Centennial. I'm planning on bottling next week so I don't have any results yet.

Basically it was 13 lbs of MO mashed at 152 for an OG of 1.074

1 oz Centennial at 60 min
1 oz Centennial at 20 min
1 oz Centennial at 5 min

Nottingham starter

Dry hop for 1 week in secondary with 1 oz Centennial before bottling.

I used grocery store bottled water for this.

Yours looks very similar with a lower OG due to the reduced grain bill.

Mine smells like Bells Two Hearted and I'm looking forward to trying it.

Let us know what you decide on and how it comes out.
 
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Pelikan

Pelikan

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Tweaked the recipe just a bit. Bumped up the Maris Otter and tooled with the hop schedule a bit.
 
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Pelikan

Pelikan

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Hmm...guess I'll just roll with the recipe as posted? All things considered, it seems fairly solid.
 

Kilgore_Trout

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Never used palisade but the hop schedule looks just fine. Nice aroma/flavor without too much bittering.
 

AnOldUR

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:off:
You say you have a surplus of Palisade Hops, so I'm guessing you've used and like them. The descriptions say they have the characteristics of Tett and Williamette. Sounds good, and I'd like to give them a try, but then I’ve read stuff like this:
Personally, I didn't find them anything like Willamette. I made a Palisade single-hop pale ale, and it had kind of perfumey aroma and a very mild flavor to them. The bitterness, even though it was calculated at 40 IBUs, was very very smooth to the point where I felt that the beer was underbittered. I would like to try them again, but haven't been able to find whole Palisade since getting that grab bag.
What do you think of them?
 
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Pelikan

Pelikan

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They're quite nice. I find the aroma unique, I guess something to the tune of centennial combined with nugget, insofar as it's got a predominantly floral component, followed in the back by an herbal/grassy note. Perhaps how you would imagine an Alpine meadow to smell, I suppose? The short and long of it is that if you like Centennial and other floral varieties, you'll probably like Palisade.

The bittering is smooth, but no more or less so when compared to Nugget, or another low coh. hop. I'd go out on a limb and say that the quote above is in reference to untested Palisades. That could mean anywhere from 5.5-10% AA, and who knows what the guy making the recipe used to come up with his IBU. He did say he'd be willing to try them again, so that has to count for something.

I've also read up quite a bit on these, especially pre-purchase. There was another homebrew forum that had a "strain of the week" thread on Palisade. The basic gist was that 75% of the people using Palisade liked them, and the remaining folks didn't, mostly for the reasons you highlighted above. The only response I can offer is that pretty much all Palisades on the market (that I'm aware of) are untested. As such, one should make a recipe that takes into account what it would turn out like if the hops ended up being on the high end (9-10%), and the low end (5.5%). From experience/taste, I've been using 7.5% AA, and they seem to come out true to form with that number.

EDIT: Here's the link to that hop of the week thread: Palisade

Of the 12 people who responded to the poll, 8 gave it a rating of average or better (three 3s, three 4s, two 5s), with four giving it unsatisfactory marks (two 2s, one 1). You'd probably get a spread about like that with pretty much any hop variety out there.

And of course, like all strains, Palisade is at its best when combined with others. I do, however, feel it can hold up on its own just fine, and indeed I'm banking on that fact with this SMaSH. Brew day will be a few weeks down the line, so I guess it's a "wait and see" proposition.
 

Malticulous

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I've used Palisade in a few beers now. A mild I bittered with Willamette with a dash of Palisade for flavor. When I brew it again I think I'll switch the hops and bitter with Palisades or just use all Willamette. A all Palisade Brown Porter, the chocolate malt is so dominant to the flavor I think the Palisades pass as Fuggle. I also used them mixed with Willamette in my Stout and to bitter my Amber ale that are still fermenting. I like them but I think I'd prefer other hops for the flavor additions. Good luck with your smash.
 

AnOldUR

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Thanks to both of you. I'll have to give the Palisade Hops a try.

Be interested to hear how your SMaSH comes out . . .
 
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Pelikan

Pelikan

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I'll update the thread once I have a finished product. It'll probably be 2-3 months before I have something tasteable/testable (due to other brews being in the queue before this one), but I'll def put something up.
 

bionara

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Update? I'm planning a single malt (pale malt) single hop (Palisade) this week. Just a 10litre batch, but curious how yours came out!
 
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