Overnight force carbonation

[autobaun70]

So, I let a competition sneak up on me, and tasting is tomorrow night. Beer is sitting in the firm in her bra hopping, and I have to keg it and get it carbed up before this time tomorrow. Recommendations please.

Initial thought is to bump the pressure to 30 PSI immediately after kegging and shake the **** out of it for about 20 minutes, then drop it back to 13 over night. Recipe is a fairly run-of-the-mill 6% RPA.

 

[jerbrew]

Take it up to 30 and shake the crap out of it for a while. Just sit there and roll it on the floor with your feet for 45 minutes or so (you can count this as exercise and reward yourself with beer) take it down to serving and pour a bit. If it still likes some carbonation leave it at 30 overnight and check it in the morning. Depending on the dissolved CO2 present initially in the beer you should be able to make it no problem.

 

[day_trippr]

Or...set the CO2 pressure using our favorite carbonation table, THEN shake the keg until you don't hear any more gas being accepted (listen to the regulator).

Let it sit for 30 minutes, then do the same thing again. Repeat until no more gas is accepted and your beer will have reached the target carbonation level...without risking over-carbonation....

Cheers!

 

[TravelingLight]

Or...set the CO2 pressure using our favorite carbonation table, THEN shake the keg until you don't hear any more gas being accepted (listen to the regulator).

Let it sit for 30 minutes, then do the same thing again. Repeat until no more gas is accepted and your beer will have reached the target carbonation level...without risking over-carbonation....

Cheers!

I've been force carbing since I started kegging (which was when I started brewing, eff bottling). But I've never done it this way. I like the sound of this. I'll be trying it on my next beer! In the past I've set it to 30 psi, rolled the hell out of it, then let it sit overnight. I like your idea of redoing it 30 minutes later.

 

[TheMadKing]

I think you're going to have issues with carbonic acid bite. You can carbonate in a day, but it doesn't smooth out or condition correctly for a week or more. You likely will not score as well as you would have, given the correct time span. That being said:

I would forgo the shaking, turn the PSI up to 40, let it sit at 40PSI for 18 hours. Purge it, set it at 12 and let it sit for a couple hours then bottle for the comp after pouring out the first few pints. You'll give it more time for sediment to settle, and it's less work.

 

[Special Hops]

not sure but bra hopping sounds interesting...

 

[GreyRaven]

not sure but bra hopping sounds interesting...

I know, right?

 

[MagicMatt]

I would forgo the shaking, turn the PSI up to 40, let it sit at 40PSI for 18 hours. Purge it, set it at 12 and let it sit for a couple hours then bottle for the comp after pouring out the first few pints. You'll give it more time for sediment to settle, and it's less work.

That's not going to get it carbed in time.

Here's a chart showing what level the carbonation is at for beer at a given temp (y-axis) and hooked up to 40psi CO2 for the given amount of time (x-axis).

Even if his beer was at 30°F, it would still take about 2.5 days to get it to ~2.5 vols doing what you recommend (just sitting at 40psi, no shaking).

The only way to quick-carb a keg fully to the desired level is to do what day_trippr suggested and set the pressure to the same as you would for the "set and forget" carb method (i.e. the pressure that correlates with the temp of your beer to give you a certain volume of CO2), and then shake repeatedly over the course of an hour or two.

It's impossible to over carb it this way (setting it to 40psi and shaking is just asking for this), and you'll know exactly when it's fully carbed as you won't hear anymore gas going into the keg.

Doing this right after you transfer to the keg will negate the need to worry about rousing and sediment, since there won't be any yet.

 

[autobaun70]

Got the carbonation dead on, but I think the carbonic acid issue mentioned above was a hold up. Beer wasn't bad, but I can definitely tell it needs some time to condition. Pretty happy that I was able to get it to the completion at all. Live has gotten busy. 5 month old and rigging out a new boat have been eating pretty much all of my time lately.

 

[TheMadKing]

That's not going to get it carbed in time.

Here's a chart showing what level the carbonation is at for beer at a given temp (y-axis) and hooked up to 40psi CO2 for the given amount of time (x-axis).

Even if his beer was at 30°F, it would still take about 2.5 days to get it to ~2.5 vols doing what you recommend (just sitting at 40psi, no shaking).

that can't be right.. If I set a beer to 40 psi for 2.5 days, I would be ridiculously over carbonated. This is how I carbonate all my beers and I've over carbonated one after just 26 hours.

I'm not saying I'm not wrong about the exact time, but I simply can't believe that it would take 2.5 days to carbonate at 40 psi.

Maybe my regulator is off by a lot and I'm way higher than I think I am or something.

EDIT: I found the source of that chart (some bored guy on the beersmith forums who made it in his spare time) and I don't particularly believe it. He assumed a linear relationship between time, pressure, and carb level between 0 and 14 days. We know that's not the case. The rate of CO2 absorption follows and exponential decay curve, he also made several assumptions in his calculations based on his personal experience. There's a TON of room for error in that chart, and it doesn't jive with my personal experience on countless batches. I'd love to see an experimental carb time chart though!

 

[MagicMatt]

that can't be right.. If I set a beer to 40 psi for 2.5 days, I would be ridiculously over carbonated. This is how I carbonate all my beers and I've over carbonated one after just 26 hours.

Interesting. I found it on Google Image search, and did think it ran a tad lower than it should. I used to do 30 psi for 30 hours and found it was only about 50-60% carbed. I found this chart a few months ago and have only needed it once to quick carb a keg and it seemed to give me ~2.7vols in about 80 hours.

Can you link the thread please?

And you're saying that 40 psi at 34°F for 24 hours would give >2.5 vols? I am actually kegging a beer right now that I need ready for Friday. I can test this out, but I don't want to overcarb it (much).

 

[TheMadKing]

Interesting. I found it on Google Image search, and did think it ran a tad lower than it should. I used to do 30 psi for 30 hours and found it was only about 50-60% carbed. I found this chart a few months ago and have only needed it once to quick carb a keg and it seemed to give me ~2.7vols in about 80 hours.

Can you link the thread please?

And you're saying that 40 psi at 34°F for 24 hours would give >2.5 vols? I am actually kegging a beer right now that I need ready for Friday. I can test this out, but I don't want to overcarb it (much).

http://www.beersmith.com/forum/index.php?topic=4042.0

There's the link to the thread.

Yes, I believe that somewhere between 18-24 hours at 40psi will get you right in the neighborhood of 2.5 vols.

My standard method is set it to 40PSI, leave it for 18-20 hours, then purge and set it to 12 (my serving pressure) and let it sit for a couple days to balance out. I always do a taste test when I drop the pressure and it's pretty close to fully carbed. I'm not measuring my CO2 content though, just going by feel, so it could be that I prefer less carbonation than most, but it seems pretty close to commercial standards.

I'll be really curious to see how yours turns out. I'm kegging a batch on Friday that I'm in no hurry with, so maybe I'll try the reverse and just leave it at 40 for 60 hours and see what happens!

It could be that exponential curve working in the favor of that chart. For example, since absorption slows, maybe it hits 2 vols at 20 hours and takes the remaining 40 to get the last .5 vols.

I'll be the first to admit when I've been doing something wrong for years haha, it's just worked so I haven't questioned it until now.

 

[MagicMatt]

Yeah after reading that thread I'm less convinced this chart is accurate.

I obviously can't measure how much CO2 is going in, but I'll try to hit it with 40 psi for 18 hours and then pull the gas and let it sit for a couple of days and see what pressure it levels out to, which should give an good indication.

 

[MagicMatt]

I hooked up the keg of freshly transferred 36°F beer to the CO2 at 40psi. Because I needed this ready by tomorrow night, and since I wasn't quite confident enough with just setting it to 40psi for ~20 hours, I shook it for about 5 minutes while at 40psi. Then I put it in the keezer still connected at 40psi. 12 hours later I pulled the gas and went to work. Later that night I checked the pressure and it was at 4psi, which would indicate about 1.9vols of CO2 if it was indeed equalized and not still dropping. I've had it hooked up to serving pressure (10psi) for 24 hours now and pulled a sample, and it was very undercarbed.

So preliminarily, it looks like 12 hours at 40psi and 36°F will get you less than 1.9 vols (remember I shook the keg for a few, so that introduced CO2 quicker than normal), which is too low for me.

I'm determined now to create my own table with real measured values. Usually I'm in no rush to get my kegs carbed, so I can take as long as needed next time and really get some hard numbers.

 

[TheMadKing]

I hooked up the keg of freshly transferred 36°F beer to the CO2 at 40psi. Because I needed this ready by tomorrow night, and since I wasn't quite confident enough with just setting it to 40psi for ~20 hours, I shook it for about 5 minutes while at 40psi. Then I put it in the keezer still connected at 40psi. 12 hours later I pulled the gas and went to work. Later that night I checked the pressure and it was at 4psi, which would indicate about 1.9vols of CO2 if it was indeed equalized and not still dropping. I've had it hooked up to serving pressure (10psi) for 24 hours now and pulled a sample, and it was very undercarbed.

So preliminarily, it looks like 12 hours at 40psi and 36°F will get you less than 1.9 vols (remember I shook the keg for a few, so that introduced CO2 quicker than normal), which is too low for me.

I'm determined now to create my own table with real measured values. Usually I'm in no rush to get my kegs carbed, so I can take as long as needed next time and really get some hard numbers.

Thanks for sharing!

I've got a porter that I put on 40PSI at noon today. I'll purge and check it around 9:00 tomorrow morning and report back.

 

[TheMadKing]

Ok so I purged the keg at nine, shut off the gas at the tank and let the pressure stabilize for a couple hours before measuring it. It levelled off at 10 PSI and hasn't moved in awhile.

I'll keep it there longer just to be sure, but that would put my CO2 level at 2.3 volumes at 38F.

Thats 21 hours at 40 PSI.

 

[Brewmegoodbeer]

Thank you for this. When you turned off the gas and then purged the keg, did you purge it down to 0 psi on the meter and waited hours to see what it went back up to?

 

[yowzers]

Chill it, set it to 12 psi, and shake the crap out of it until no more CO2 goes in. Might take 30 minutes or more.

 

[TheEccentricPrick]

So, I let a competition sneak up on me, and tasting is tomorrow night. Beer is sitting in the firm in her bra hopping, and I have to keg it and get it carbed up before this time tomorrow. Recommendations please.

Initial thought is to bump the pressure to 30 PSI immediately after kegging and shake the **** out of it for about 20 minutes, then drop it back to 13 over night. Recipe is a fairly run-of-the-mill 6% RPA.

So there are a few methods that work but at the brewery we have 2 that are utilized. The first was described already via using a co2 volume chart, looking at the column with the temp of said beer, then find the corresponding psi needed to reach the desired volumes of co2. You would then set the regulator to said psi, and shake that keg like a baby! (Please don't shake any babies. Its 2018 and I aparently need to say that) Or roll it till you hear no gas. Then roll it a bit more. Because as was previously pointed out, you cannot over-carbonate with this method, assuming your thermometer and regulator are accurate. Takes me roughly 30 min of agitation. I'll do sets of 3 to 5 min. Leaving it in the cooler between shakes. When done, leave at serving head pressure.

The other method is fast and loose. Set to 30 psi. Shake for exactly 2 min. Let It rest for 5 min. Blow down then put 20 psi on and shake for 30 sec. Rest for 5. Blow down head pressure again and then put your serving head pressure back on and leave overnight.

Hope that helps.

 

[TheEccentricPrick]

So, I let a competition sneak up on me, and tasting is tomorrow night. Beer is sitting in the firm in her bra hopping, and I have to keg it and get it carbed up before this time tomorrow. Recommendations please.

Initial thought is to bump the pressure to 30 PSI immediately after kegging and shake the **** out of it for about 20 minutes, then drop it back to 13 over night. Recipe is a fairly run-of-the-mill 6% RPA.

It should be noted that the second method I mentioned is less accurate for sure. Cheers mate!

 

[JONNYROTTEN]

post is from 2 years ago...good chance its carbed by now

 

[TheEccentricPrick]

post is from 2 years ago...good chance its carbed by now

One would hope.

Nonetheless, it never hurts to add to the thread with some more information for future readers

 

[Somegeek]

Ok so I purged the keg at nine, shut off the gas at the tank and let the pressure stabilize for a couple hours before measuring it. It levelled off at 10 PSI and hasn't moved in awhile.

I'll keep it there longer just to be sure, but that would put my CO2 level at 2.3 volumes at 38F.

Thats 21 hours at 40 PSI.

Gonna use this method... do need to wait though for my keg to come down in temp. Thanks for posting this result.