Northern Brewer - Buyer Beware

[mac_1103]

I had no idea their warehouse was in SC.

Just moved as I understand it. Might still be in the process of moving all the inventory for all I know.

 

[dmbrew48]

You may have (or have not) seen the story on new NB owners - FYI
https://www.jpparkinc.com/press-release-jppa-acquires-northern-brewer

HODGES, SC (September 2024) – J&P Park, Inc., a prominent leader in gardening and hobby-based products, is pleased to announce its acquisition of Northern Brewer, a leader in the homebrewing industry."
One press story said they were hiring multiple staff levels..

 

[BrewnWKopperKat]

https://governor.sc.gov/news/2024-09/jp-park-inc-expands-greenwood-county-operations

 

[BrewnWKopperKat]

The hate for the previous owners was very well deserved

... and accomplished nothing.

---

Moving forward, all the online stores that I work with have
1) pricing equal to (or better than) MoreBeer
2) same day order fulfillment, and
3) typically three day delivery of the order

 

[mac_1103]

and accomplished nothing

Venting rarely does. I don't think that's the point. Except maybe for the "buyer beware" part I guess. And "give the new owners a fair chance" is just the flip side of that coin.

 

[Dog House Brew]

Thanks for the recommendation. I'll check them out over the weekend. There's a local shop here in NJ that's about 40 minutes away. Tough part about using them is their limited supply. I haven't come across BrewHardware before so I appreciate it. Always great to have options.

2nd to none IMO

 

[Bobby_M]

Me also.

---

In the mean time, can everyone else stop 'hating on' the previous owners of NB and give the new owners some time to "digest" the purchase and the impact of the 100 year storm?

I think it's fair to be generous and give a business the benefit of the doubt for the future. It's also equally fair to expect a business in transition to be transparent about what to expect. Don't pose as a huge well oiled commerce machine and drop the ball. It's a great way to ensure getting bashed on public forums by people who didn't know their purchase was coming with hidden baggage. I have gotten into the weeds a half a dozen times in the last 14 years of doing business and a front page notice went up immediately every time and stayed up until the smoke cleared.

 

[matt_m]

Kind of disingenuous to blame your customer service that's been abysmal for years on a weather event.

 

[tracer bullet]

Kind of disingenuous to blame your customer service that's been abysmal for years on a weather event.

Unless said weather event has genuinely affected them.

If it was a 4 year old message related to Covid I'd agree. This could be real especially if only recently put up as a notice.

 

[mac_1103]

Kind of disingenuous to blame your customer service that's been abysmal for years on a weather event.

It's also kind of disingenuous to blame people who bought the company last month for years of abysmal customer service.

 

[matt_m]

Nah, the problem is the company. The buyer knew what they were buying (or didn't do their due diligence) and took actions that made it even worse before the weather.

 

[mac_1103]

the problem is the company

This doesn't make any sense. By all accounts, "the company" used to be quite good back in the day. Then two different (or maybe indifferent) corporate owners screwed it up. It appears that all the new owners bought was the name and the inventory. Relocating, hiring new people, etc. Maybe they'll fix it and maybe they won't, but it's going to take more than a month to find out.

 

[MaxStout]

Or...the new company DID their due diligence, knowing full well what they were getting into, and bought a clusterfark on the premise that they could improve things, make it more efficient. Just because new owners bought an entity with some past issues doesn't mean they hold the values and business methods of their predecessors.

Too soon to tell. Let's wait and see. They have their work cut out.

 

[BrewnWKopperKat]

It's also equally fair to expect a business in transition to be transparent about what to expect.

A valid point. My guess is that NB's current software leaves them at a disadvantage. Hopefully the new owners got a discount on the purchase price to account for that.

Too soon to tell. Let's wait and see. They have their work cut out.

Agreed (x 3).

---

Beyond that, persona(s) that used to have AIH as a local home brew store have entered the discussion (full disclosure: mine was MidWest Supplies). So it's probably best to dis-engage from the discussion for a couple of days.

 

[matt_m]

But that's not what they did. They bought it and continued to take orders knowing they would be significantly delayed while they packed up the warehouse and moved it. And its the third time this company has done this with move in recent years and when they bought and burned down AIH.

 

[MaxStout]

Of course they're going to keep taking orders. They can't just sit and wait until all the wrinkles are ironed out. A gap in service means customers will defect in hordes.

Sucks for some of the customers caught up during the transition, but the new company has to hit the ground running.

Again, it's a wait-and-see. If, months from now, they have crappy service, we can all dogpile on them.

 

[jschein]

So it's probably best to dis-engage from the discussion for a couple of days.

Why, if you have relevant information?

 

[shoengine]

It's threads like these that make me feel oddly special to have two homebrew shops within 30 miles of me. No WLP028 or substitutes at my shop about 15 minutes away, so I had to drive an hour to the other one for a couple 1728s.

 

[BrewnWKopperKat]

Why, if you have relevant information?

read #237 and then #255.

If the answer to the question is "no", then it's time for me to dis-engage for a couple of days.

 

[matt_m]

The last two and current owners of NB/MS/AIH/AHS are VC firms. They don't GAF about you or their employees. They do nothing to support the hobby that doesn't make them a disproportionate buck. Pretty sad to see the hug-fest for them while they f*ck over their customers and unceremoniously drop their employees while there are real business owners trying to make it.

 

[tracer bullet]

It's threads like these that make me feel oddly special to have two homebrew shops within 30 miles of me.

Enjoy it! That was me until NB / MW closed their doors.

The last two and current owners of NB/MS/AIH/AHS are VC firms. They don't GAF about you or their employees. They do nothing to support the hobby that doesn't make them a disproportionate buck. Pretty sad to see the hug-fest for them while they f*ck over their customers and unceremoniously drop their employees while there are real business owners trying to make it.

I really try hard to see all sides, but it's hard for me to disagree with you when I look to choose where I buy from. I know that normal people will work in their warehouses and such, but when you have a lot of places to choose from, the owners go a long ways for me. If I'm choosing between someone who started their own shop and a fund manager, I'll go for the shop owner every time. When those shops have cheaper prices, respond to your emails, and ship the next day it's icing on the cake.

 

[mac_1103]

Pretty sad to see the hug-fest for them

There's no hug-fest except possibly in your imagination.

 

[Closet Fermenter]

You may have (or have not) seen the story on new NB owners - FYI
https://www.jpparkinc.com/press-release-jppa-acquires-northern-brewer

HODGES, SC (September 2024) – J&P Park, Inc., a prominent leader in gardening and hobby-based products, is pleased to announce its acquisition of Northern Brewer, a leader in the homebrewing industry."
One press story said they were hiring multiple staff levels..

This is great news! It’s now 1,100 miles closer to me!! Heck, I could drive to Hodges in two hours.

 

[BrewnWKopperKat]

putting this here for future readers.

NWS: https://www.weather.gov/gsp/TropicalEventSummary for NC/SC

Click on the "Impacts Reported" link and scan by county. For example:

A SC map with just county names on it:
https://scdhec.gov/sites/default/files/media/image/sc_county_map_all_regions-hi-res.png

Greenville (NW of Hodges/Greenwood) reported some 20"+ rainfall amounts.

eta: a regional map of major cities and roads

 

[Bobby_M]

It's also kind of disingenuous to blame people who bought the company last month for years of abysmal customer service.

I don't agree with this at all. When you buy a company, it's everything. You're buying the assets and liabilities including real things and reputations. For example, NB has the asset of being a recognizable name having been in business a long time and all the high Google search results that go along with it. They have the liability of a pretty big collection of customer complaints and negative reviews in recent years.

IF I bought a company that was suffering from really bad optics (which is why you'd get it at a steep discount), I'd start with a damage control campaign. The first thing that should pop up on the page when you land is a video of the new owner apologizing for the poor service in the past few years and explaining that you bought the business because you wanted to restore customer faith, etc,

It's common in the real world to just put up a banner that says "under new management" which is polite code for "we know this place sucked before but please give us another chance". Internet commerce stores still need a version of this. I'm still convinced that the level of transparency required is proportional to the level of customer discontent. When people wait 3 weeks and don't even get a status update, it has to come with a "hey, we really screwed things up. Here's what happened. Here's how we're working to fix it. Finally, here's what we're willing to do to earn your business back"

Specifically back to NB, in looking at their website, nothing on the front page or in the FAQ or About Us pages has any transparency at all. No acknowledgements of problems, no notice of order delays, ownership changes, nothing. They do talk up their customer service quite a bit though. That is directly counter to thinking your order is going to take a really long time to arrive.

 

[mac_1103]

It's common in the real world to just put up a banner that says "under new management" which is polite code for "we know this place sucked before"

It's also code for "but that wasn't us!"

 

[BongoYodeler]

I don't agree with this at all. When you buy a company, it's everything. You're buying the assets and liabilities including real things and reputations. For example, NB has the asset of being a recognizable name having been in business a long time and all the high Google search results that go along with it. They have the liability of a pretty big collection of customer complaints and negative reviews in recent years.

IF I bought a company that was suffering from really bad optics (which is why you'd get it at a steep discount), I'd start with a damage control campaign. The first thing that should pop up on the page when you land is a video of the new owner apologizing for the poor service in the past few years and explaining that you bought the business because you wanted to restore customer faith, etc,

It's common in the real world to just put up a banner that says "under new management" which is polite code for "we know this place sucked before but please give us another chance". Internet commerce stores still need a version of this. I'm still convinced that the level of transparency required is proportional to the level of customer discontent. When people wait 3 weeks and don't even get a status update, it has to come with a "hey, we really screwed things up. Here's what happened. Here's how we're working to fix it. Finally, here's what we're willing to do to earn your business back"

Well said Bobby. As one who recently waited over three weeks to receive a recent NB order (pre-hurricane, but after the new warehouse opened), I can attest that better communication would have gone a long way towards helping with customer satisfaction. Their only communication was in reply to mine. I even said so in my survey comments. Paraphrasing from memory, 'I understand moving to, and opening a new warehouse across the country can be difficult, but timely communication with your customers should not...'

Also, to be up front and fair to NB, part of my dissatisfaction with the 3+ weeks wait should be directed towards UPS as my order sat in Greensboro, NC for nearly 72 hours as they were "...unable to dispatch a trailer on time." Seriously?

From the UPS tracking link:

 

[BrewnWKopperKat]

Greenwood County SC (wikipedia)

https://www.indexjournal.com/news/p...cle_bc4126aa-829f-11ef-b7cd-6f56d5eecc53.html

More than 13,500 Greenwood County addresses were still in the dark Saturday [Oct 5] in the wake of Hurricane Helene’s [...]

 

[BrewnWKopperKat]

dog pile

 

[BrewnWKopperKat]

one more before logging out for the night ...

 

[jschein]

one more before logging out for the night ...
View attachment 859431

Ahhh wrong thread; https://www.homebrewtalk.com/threads/dogs.13791/page-132#post-10405289

 

[rlrohan]

I don't agree with this at all. When you buy a company, it's everything. You're buying the assets and liabilities including real things and reputations. For example, NB has the asset of being a recognizable name having been in business a long time and all the high Google search results that go along with it. They have the liability of a pretty big collection of customer complaints and negative reviews in recent years.

IF I bought a company that was suffering from really bad optics (which is why you'd get it at a steep discount), I'd start with a damage control campaign. The first thing that should pop up on the page when you land is a video of the new owner apologizing for the poor service in the past few years and explaining that you bought the business because you wanted to restore customer faith, etc,

It's common in the real world to just put up a banner that says "under new management" which is polite code for "we know this place sucked before but please give us another chance". Internet commerce stores still need a version of this. I'm still convinced that the level of transparency required is proportional to the level of customer discontent. When people wait 3 weeks and don't even get a status update, it has to come with a "hey, we really screwed things up. Here's what happened. Here's how we're working to fix it. Finally, here's what we're willing to do to earn your business back"

Specifically back to NB, in looking at their website, nothing on the front page or in the FAQ or About Us pages has any transparency at all. No acknowledgements of problems, no notice of order delays, ownership changes, nothing. They do talk up their customer service quite a bit though. That is directly counter to thinking your order is going to take a really long time to arrive.

I agree with this. The previous business owner had the website up and running for everyone to see and order from. Many people don’t even know of the transition in ownership that is happening. It’s not that hard to let everyone know when they go to the website that things are changing and we as the new owners are going to make it better.
Full disclosure is always best here if customers are going to understand and probably they should quit taking orders until things get sorted.
It’s obvious they have their hands full and need time.

 

[mac_1103]

probably they should quit taking orders until things get sorted

This would be a great way to lose a bunch of customers permanently. I'm pretty sure that literally no one would do it. There's a huge difference between "under new management/working to make things better" and "closed until further notice."

 

[rlrohan]

Could be true that a lot of customers would not come back to the site, but how many are coming back after long delays in the order with little or no communication. Plus they are mad and spread their dissatisfaction all over social media.

 

[TalonsUpPuckDown]

I'm a former NB customer who got tired of their crap, switched to MoreBeer, and couldn't be happier. At this point I don't know why I'd shift my loyalty back regardless of their ownership status.

But that's just me.

 

[shoengine]

What's the advantage to sticking to one particular site for your ordering needs?

 

[TalonsUpPuckDown]

I know when I place my order it will be filled quickly and accurately. If i have an issue i can connect with a live person. They seem loyal to me, I’ll reciprocate. I brew small batches so I’m not worried about some other vendor being 2 cents cheaper on base malts.

NB used to do all that and I single sourced through them until they bleeped the bed. See no reason to go back.

 

[ncbrewer]

Many people don’t even know of the transition in ownership that is happening.

I didn't know they were undergoing yet another change in ownership until I read this thread.

 

[BrewnWKopperKat]

I didn't know they were undergoing yet another change in ownership until I read this thread.

The sale/move was mentioned in "NB - Still working?" around Sept 15th and that was based on an /r/homebrewing topic (from a reliable poster) from around Sept 8th.

Recently, /r/homebrewing has been a good source for timely topics on warehouse moves and store closures. HomeBrewTalk seems to lag by about a week (if it's even mentioned).

 

[Bobby_M]

The sale/move was mentioned in "NB - Still working?" around Sept 15th and that was based on an /r/homebrewing topic (from a reliable poster) from around Sept 8th.

Recently, /r/homebrewing has been a good source for timely topics on warehouse moves and store closures. HomeBrewTalk seems to lag by about a week (if it's even mentioned).

It shouldn't have to be discovered like it's a speakeasy, but I've already made my point on that a few times. A business is as good as a customer's last transaction. I don't want to put words in your mouth, but I understand you have a lot of built up good vibes with what is essentially just a name of a company at this point. It's just nostalgia.