New England IPA "Northeast" style IPA

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1bottlerocket

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I personally would not pitch a liquid yeast unless you can be certain it is active, i.e make a starter or verify through a Wyeast Smack Pack. Not knowing the age of your yeast or what it may have been subject to I would suggest the quickest solution would be using the SO4 after rehydrating in a little sweetened water to confirm viability. If your gear is clean and sanitized the wort should be ok for a couple of days but not getting it fermenting is risky.
I have a follow up question.

I went to repitch some S-04 and when I opened the fermenting bucket the Vermont Pale ale yeast had taken off. It looked a little sluggish judging by the amount of krausen and the bubbles coming out of the air lock. Do you think it is s good idea to pitch the S-04 anyway or just let the Vermont yeast do its thing?

Thanks again!
 

tld6008

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I have a follow up question.

I went to repitch some S-04 and when I opened the fermenting bucket the Vermont Pale ale yeast had taken off. It looked a little sluggish judging by the amount of krausen and the bubbles coming out of the air lock. Do you think it is s good idea to pitch the S-04 anyway or just let the Vermont yeast do its thing?

Thanks again!
I would let it go. I frequently have a 18-24 hr lag time before liquid yeast takes off. If it was longer I would start to be concerned. I only ferment in carboys as I can't stand not seeing what is going on
 

1bottlerocket

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The lag time was longer than 24 hours.
I would let it go. I frequently have a 18-24 hr lag time before liquid yeast takes off. If it was longer I would start to be concerned. I only ferment in carboys as I can't stand not seeing what is going on
It was about a 48 hour lag time, which made me nervous. I am already unsure about the whole batch and this added to my being list of things to think about.
 

divrack

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The lag time was longer than 24 hours.

It was about a 48 hour lag time, which made me nervous. I am already unsure about the whole batch and this added to my being list of things to think about.
i used two packets of london iii in 10gal batch that didnt do anything for 72hrs pitched some burton and it started but the resultant beer is not great. definitely some wild yeast taste in it now
 

1bottlerocket

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Is your temp still 72?
The ambient is sitting at 69.8 in my cellar. The airlock is going quite strong today. The bubbles were rolling out. it is very fragrant in my cellar with the smell of hops now too. This is the first time I have had such a long lag time. It seems to be within the range they recommend.

I read somewhere they recommend pitching a second vial of yeast (Vermont Ale) to finish up the fermentation. Has anyone ever done this?
 

isomerization

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The ambient is sitting at 69.8 in my cellar. The airlock is going quite strong today. The bubbles were rolling out. it is very fragrant in my cellar with the smell of hops now too. This is the first time I have had such a long lag time. It seems to be within the range they recommend.

I read somewhere they recommend pitching a second vial of yeast (Vermont Ale) to finish up the fermentation. Has anyone ever done this?
Where did you read that? Seems like a really strange process to me, especially if its a vial not an active starter.

You should really invest in making liquid yeast starters. You absolutely do not have to have a stir plate (helps speed up the process though), you can give the yeast a good swirl every couple of hours and accomplish what needs to be done (yeast multiplication).
 
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The ambient is sitting at 69.8 in my cellar. The airlock is going quite strong today. The bubbles were rolling out. it is very fragrant in my cellar with the smell of hops now too. This is the first time I have had such a long lag time. It seems to be within the range they recommend.

I read somewhere they recommend pitching a second vial of yeast (Vermont Ale) to finish up the fermentation. Has anyone ever done this?
Pitching a second vial of yeast (especially something like vermont ale) is not recommended procedure. The only time that is really something to do is if you are maybe brewing a beer and through process error you pitch unhealthy yeast, or ferment at too low of a temp, or whatever....... and as a result you have a beer that totally stalls out and won't finish. Then, it might be advisable to pitch a pack of US05 or some other dry, attenuative yeast in an attempt to save your beer from dumping.
But, it is not "normal" procedure at all. In my experience, the best thing you can do with Vermont ale yeast is to do the following:
1.) Make a 1 Liter starter 18 hours before you brew
2.) Brew a low ABV blonde ale (1.40-1.45 gravity) with low hops, no dry hop
3.) When it comes time to keg the blonde, leave a quart+ of beer behind in fermenter.
4.) Swirly the yeast/beer up into solution
5.) Collect 4-6 mason jars (sanitized) of yeast slurry
6.) Use each jar to make a 1L starter 18 hours before you want to brew this (or other) beer.
7.) Pitch the entire, actively fermenting starter into your beer.

I never, ever have a problem with vermont ale yeast with that process.

If I was not going to take it through a beer to collect yeast, I would make a 1L starter several days/week before I wanted to brew, ferment it out, decant most of the liquid the day before I wanted to brew and add in a new 1L of wort (18 hours before brewing). I would then pitch the entire 1L, actively fermenting starter.
 

GnenieGone

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Just general chit-chat. The NEIPA-ish brewed yesterday took off in about 5hrs, bubbles noticed. Never seen such a thing so early. Used Imperial A38 "Juice" and after 20hrs firing on all cylinders. 4oz of hops added to wort chilling at around 140F. IDK how it's going to end up. Used flaked Barley, white wheat and some lactose along with this 72%-78% attenuation yeast. ****, at this point I'm happy with any drinkable IPA! Plan on Citra/Mosaic cryo hops and galaxy for fermentation hopping then probably keep .5oz or so for keg hopping. Of course, doing a closed loop transfer.
 
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Andre3000

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Ok people. I have the following hops in inventory:

Citra
Simcoe
El Dorado
Huell Melon
Mandarina Bavaria
Centennial
Amarillo
Azacca
Cascade
Motueka

My favorite by far is Citra / Mosaic but I'm out of Mosaic. So I just did a Citra / El Dorado 1:0.8. While it wasn't terrible, it was too heavy on the El Dorado still I found. Might go 2:1 or less if I had to do it again.

Looking for new suggestions based on the above!
 

divrack

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Just general chit-chat. The NEIPA-ish brewed yesterday took off in about 5hrs, bubbles noticed. Never seen such a thing so early. Used Imperial A38 "Juice" and after 20hrs firing on all cylinders. 4oz of hops added to wort chilling at around 140F. IDK how it's going to end up. Used flaked Barley, white wheat and some lactose along with this 72%-78% attenuation yeast. ****, at this point I'm happy with any drinkable IPA! Plan on Citra/Mosaic cryo hops and galaxy for fermentation hopping then probably keep .5oz or so for keg hopping. Of course, doing a closed loop transfer.
Still having problems with o2?
I just did an experiment re that issue due to your problems. Neipa recipe, all hops added in whirlpool and active ferment (tonnes), transferred by co2 from ss cronical to liquid purged kegs. The remaining gallon or two I transferred splashing into an air filled keg, sealed and shook under co2 to carbonate, no purging.
I did notice a rapid decline in hop punch that surprised me, by a week it was definitely a bit muddy but still very hoppy.
There was maybe a slight darkening but none of the weird purple/black colouration that I've heard reported.

Maybe it wasn't enough time. I'd meant to keep some longer but accidentally drank it all... Some scientist am I.

I'm happy to report the other kegs still punchy as hell, but also slightly diminished
 

MrBlackrock

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Ok people. I have the following hops in inventory:

Citra
Simcoe
El Dorado
Huell Melon
Mandarina Bavaria
Centennial
Amarillo
Azacca
Cascade
Motueka

My favorite by far is Citra / Mosaic but I'm out of Mosaic. So I just did a Citra / El Dorado 1:0.8. While it wasn't terrible, it was too heavy on the El Dorado still I found. Might go 2:1 or less if I had to do it again.

Looking for new suggestions based on the above!
I would go Citra/Azacca/Cascade
 

1bottlerocket

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Pitching a second vial of yeast (especially something like vermont ale) is not recommended procedure. The only time that is really something to do is if you are maybe brewing a beer and through process error you pitch unhealthy yeast, or ferment at too low of a temp, or whatever....... and as a result you have a beer that totally stalls out and won't finish. Then, it might be advisable to pitch a pack of US05 or some other dry, attenuative yeast in an attempt to save your beer from dumping.
But, it is not "normal" procedure at all. In my experience, the best thing you can do with Vermont ale yeast is to do the following:
1.) Make a 1 Liter starter 18 hours before you brew
2.) Brew a low ABV blonde ale (1.40-1.45 gravity) with low hops, no dry hop
3.) When it comes time to keg the blonde, leave a quart+ of beer behind in fermenter.
4.) Swirly the yeast/beer up into solution
5.) Collect 4-6 mason jars (sanitized) of yeast slurry
6.) Use each jar to make a 1L starter 18 hours before you want to brew this (or other) beer.
7.) Pitch the entire, actively fermenting starter into your beer.

I never, ever have a problem with vermont ale yeast with that process.

If I was not going to take it through a beer to collect yeast, I would make a 1L starter several days/week before I wanted to brew, ferment it out, decant most of the liquid the day before I wanted to brew and add in a new 1L of wort (18 hours before brewing). I would then pitch the entire 1L, actively fermenting starter.

Thank you for all the wonderful information. I can't locate the page right now where I read about pitching a second vial of yeast but suffice to say I will not be doing that! I did a second dry hop today and took a gravity reading. It is sitting at 1.020 (my target FG is 1.017) The wort is sitting at 71°F in the fermentor and the ambient temperature is about 69°F despite all the high heat we have been getting. I am going to check the gravity again on 1 Aug. There seems to be a bit if fermenting still happening, albeit slow.

I am going to look into the yeast harvesting and try to make the low ABV blonde beer. This will be my first all-grain batch of beer. Now to search for an all-grain recipe for this.

It also seems a keg system will be necessary. Onward and upward!

Thanks again!
 
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Braufessor

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Ok people. I have the following hops in inventory:

Citra
Simcoe
El Dorado
Huell Melon
Mandarina Bavaria
Centennial
Amarillo
Azacca
Cascade
Motueka

My favorite by far is Citra / Mosaic but I'm out of Mosaic. So I just did a Citra / El Dorado 1:0.8. While it wasn't terrible, it was too heavy on the El Dorado still I found. Might go 2:1 or less if I had to do it again.

Looking for new suggestions based on the above!
I have done quite a few with Centennial/Simcoe/Amarillo in 1:1:1 ratio and really liked them. Not as bold as Citra/Mosaic/galaxy combos. I especially like that combo in lower ABV. versions.

If you wanted something more bold in the NE IPA realm, Citra/Simcoe/Amarillo would also be very good. Could go 1:1:1 or hedge toward more citra if you wanted as well.
 

ttuato

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Ok people. I have the following hops in inventory:

Citra
Simcoe
El Dorado
Huell Melon
Mandarina Bavaria
Centennial
Amarillo
Azacca
Cascade
Motueka

My favorite by far is Citra / Mosaic but I'm out of Mosaic. So I just did a Citra / El Dorado 1:0.8. While it wasn't terrible, it was too heavy on the El Dorado still I found. Might go 2:1 or less if I had to do it again.

Looking for new suggestions based on the above!

Citra / Simcoe - 1:1 for whirlpool

Citra / Simcoe / Moteuka - 1:1:2 for dryhop

Above will give nice big citrus with a hint of earthy for balance.

I am not a fan of El Dorado or Azacca.
 

Andre3000

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I have done quite a few with Centennial/Simcoe/Amarillo in 1:1:1 ratio and really liked them. Not as bold as Citra/Mosaic/galaxy combos. I especially like that combo in lower ABV. versions.

If you wanted something more bold in the NE IPA realm, Citra/Simcoe/Amarillo would also be very good. Could go 1:1:1 or hedge toward more citra if you wanted as well.
For the Centennial/Simcoe/Amarillo you whirlpool all three but keep the centennial out of the dry hop, correct?
Citra / Simcoe - 1:1 for whirlpool

Citra / Simcoe / Moteuka - 1:1:2 for dryhop

Above will give nice big citrus with a hint of earthy for balance.

I am not a fan of El Dorado or Azacca.
Interesting. Thanks I may try this. I absolutely love the smell of Azacca but I'm not certain what the taste is like. In general I'd agree with you on the El Dorado. At least not in equal parts.

I think I just need to get my hands on more Mosaic.

Is there a reasonable method for making a hop tea from pellets or some such and combining it with a blonde ale, where you can simulate what these combinations might taste like before committing to a whole batch?
 
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Braufessor

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I have done both......
1:1:1 in whirlpool/flame out and then 0 Centennial and 1:1 amarillo/simcoe in dry hop

and, I have also done straight 1:1:1 in all additions.

Both are good. Leaving centennial out of dry hop probably makes it a bit more toward a typical NE IPA. The centennial can be a bit drier/crisper toward a "normal" IPA profile.
 

GnenieGone

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Still having problems with o2?
I just did an experiment re that issue due to your problems. Neipa recipe, all hops added in whirlpool and active ferment (tonnes), transferred by co2 from ss cronical to liquid purged kegs. The remaining gallon or two I transferred splashing into an air filled keg, sealed and shook under co2 to carbonate, no purging.
I did notice a rapid decline in hop punch that surprised me, by a week it was definitely a bit muddy but still very hoppy.
There was maybe a slight darkening but none of the weird purple/black colouration that I've heard reported.

Maybe it wasn't enough time. I'd meant to keep some longer but accidentally drank it all... Some scientist am I.

I'm happy to report the other kegs still punchy as hell, but also slightly diminished
Love the scientific approach for sure. Doing the same thing with close loop transfer. But will fill keg with starsans for sanitation. Going from a 5gal batch in a plastic bucket. Will purge bucket via makeshift port entire time. Hoping gravity and luck, aka no clogs, gets a 2.5gal keg full. Did the 1 truly successful NEIPA this way before. Thanks for the thoughts.
 

ca_baracus

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Ok people. I have the following hops in inventory:

Citra
Simcoe
El Dorado
Huell Melon
Mandarina Bavaria
Centennial
Amarillo
Azacca
Cascade
Motueka

My favorite by far is Citra / Mosaic but I'm out of Mosaic. So I just did a Citra / El Dorado 1:0.8. While it wasn't terrible, it was too heavy on the El Dorado still I found. Might go 2:1 or less if I had to do it again.

Looking for new suggestions based on the above!
Just brewed my second batch of Citra/El Dorado/Galaxy (3:2:1) yesterday. Turned out really well the first time around. It was lacking in aroma, so trying some Citra cryo hops in the keg this time.
 

Andre3000

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Just brewed my second batch of Citra/El Dorado/Galaxy (3:2:1) yesterday. Turned out really well the first time around. It was lacking in aroma, so trying some Citra cryo hops in the keg this time.
Would love to but Galaxy is a hard one to come by in my area it seems.
 

1bottlerocket

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Update 2: The gravity is now sitting at 1.018 and the color has gone to a hazy orange color. The hop nose is amazing and it taste really nice (to me!) I am pretty excited by this beer and recipe.

I did 2 dry hop additions. One on day 2 and the other on Day 7 of fermenting. I used a mixture of Citra, Mosaic, and Galaxy hops at 1:1:1 ratio. 2oz ea.

I am planning on racking to secondary this evening, taking one more gravity reading tomorrow. If it is stabilised then I will prime and bottle. The plan is to use 3/4c glucose to 2 cups water and mix in, then bottle.

Does this seem like a good plan? Any advice or something I am overlooking would be appreciated. I do not have a keg system in place yet and I do understand about the issues of oxidizing after reading the thread.
 
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Braufessor

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Update 2: The gravity is now sitting at 1.018 and the color has gone to a hazy orange color. The hop nose is amazing and it taste really nice (to me!) I am pretty excited by this beer and recipe.

I did 2 dry hop additions. One on day 2 and the other on Day 7 of fermenting. I used a mixture of Citra, Mosaic, and Galaxy hops at 1:1:1 ratio. 2oz ea.

I am planning on racking to secondary this evening, taking one more gravity reading tomorrow. If it is stabilised then I will prime and bottle. The plan is to use 3/4c glucose to 2 cups water and mix in, then bottle.

Does this seem like a good plan? Any advice or something I am overlooking would be appreciated. I do not have a keg system in place yet and I do understand about the issues of oxidizing after reading the thread.
How long has it been since the day you brewed it??

Also..... how do you plan on priming/bottling? Are you going to dump the priming solution into the secondary? Or are you planning to rack it to a bottling bucket or something like that? I ask, because I would move that beer as little as possible. I would do the following if I was going to bottle:
* Leave in primary until you plan to bottle
* Move the primary fermenter up onto the counter 1-2 days before you want to bottle and leave it there to allow as much to settle as possible.
* Bottling day - Make priming solution, boil, add it to whatever vessel you plan to bottle out of. Rack beer from primary onto the priming solution to help with mixing. Make sure tubing goes to bottom so there is no splashing.
* Keep racking off of bottom as much as possible to limit amount of debris to minimum
* Bottle..... place cap on immediately, and ideally have a second person to cap as you fill. Or, cap after every 2-3 bottles.

*****Or, Put primary on counter and let things settle. Make priming solution. Add directly to primary, stir very gently (avoiding stirring up the bottom sediment..... just get it swirling and starting to mix) with sanitary stainless spoon, put lid back on fermenter, let it sit for 30 minutes or so, and bottle straight out of the primary. Keep racking cane or however you are bottling up off bottom to minimize debris.
 

1bottlerocket

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How long has it been since the day you brewed it??

Also..... how do you plan on priming/bottling? Are you going to dump the priming solution into the secondary? Or are you planning to rack it to a bottling bucket or something like that? I ask, because I would move that beer as little as possible. I would do the following if I was going to bottle:
* Leave in primary until you plan to bottle
* Move the primary fermenter up onto the counter 1-2 days before you want to bottle and leave it there to allow as much to settle as possible.
* Bottling day - Make priming solution, boil, add it to whatever vessel you plan to bottle out of. Rack beer from primary onto the priming solution to help with mixing. Make sure tubing goes to bottom so there is no splashing.
* Keep racking off of bottom as much as possible to limit amount of debris to minimum
* Bottle..... place cap on immediately, and ideally have a second person to cap as you fill. Or, cap after every 2-3 bottles.

*****Or, Put primary on counter and let things settle. Make priming solution. Add directly to primary, stir very gently (avoiding stirring up the bottom sediment..... just get it swirling and starting to mix) with sanitary stainless spoon, put lid back on fermenter, let it sit for 30 minutes or so, and bottle straight out of the primary. Keep racking cane or however you are bottling up off bottom to minimize debris.
I brewed the beer on the 20th so it has been 11 days since brewing.

The plan for priming is to add the priming solution to a bottling bucket and the siphon from primary to the bucket. I have a bottling cane attached to that and fill from there. The bottles all have Grolsch-style bail tops so I am able to seal immediately.

I also have a small CO2 gun I borrowed so I can purge the bottles right before filling them. I thought it may be a good idea to try and reduce exposure to oxygen as much as possible.

Thanks a lot for the feedback, I really appreciate it.
 

tld6008

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I brewed the beer on the 20th so it has been 11 days since brewing.

The plan for priming is to add the priming solution to a bottling bucket and the siphon from primary to the bucket. I have a bottling cane attached to that and fill from there. The bottles all have Grolsch-style bail tops so I am able to seal immediately.

I also have a small CO2 gun I borrowed so I can purge the bottles right before filling them. I thought it may be a good idea to try and reduce exposure to oxygen as much as possible.

Thanks a lot for the feedback, I really appreciate it.
Seems like a decent plan. I also only use Grolsch type bottles when bottling, it definitely makes things much easier.
 
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Braufessor

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I brewed the beer on the 20th so it has been 11 days since brewing.

The plan for priming is to add the priming solution to a bottling bucket and the siphon from primary to the bucket. I have a bottling cane attached to that and fill from there. The bottles all have Grolsch-style bail tops so I am able to seal immediately.

I also have a small CO2 gun I borrowed so I can purge the bottles right before filling them. I thought it may be a good idea to try and reduce exposure to oxygen as much as possible.

Thanks a lot for the feedback, I really appreciate it.
Primary to
Secondary to
Bottling Bucket to
Bottle.......

I would try to cut that down if you feel you can.

I would either go primary to bottle
or
Primary to bottling bucket to bottle

Less transferring the better for a beer like this.
 

GnenieGone

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I brewed the beer on the 20th so it has been 11 days since brewing.

The plan for priming is to add the priming solution to a bottling bucket and the siphon from primary to the bucket. I have a bottling cane attached to that and fill from there. The bottles all have Grolsch-style bail tops so I am able to seal immediately.

I also have a small CO2 gun I borrowed so I can purge the bottles right before filling them. I thought it may be a good idea to try and reduce exposure to oxygen as much as possible.

Thanks a lot for the feedback, I really appreciate it.
Here's my set-up for NEIPAs along with 1st trial run. Extra port for keeping CO2 purging during cold crash and bottling. Spigot to bottle directly from primary. Dual regulator to keep bucket purged AND flush bottles with CO2. Basiclly here's what I did...

- Cold Crash and purge every few hours (leaving CO2 on port).
- Move to table and sit for a few hours.
- Rinse/sanitize bottle then use carbonation drops so you don't have to open fermenter.
- Now CO2 purge bottle, fill beer, CO2 again and cap.

Any oxygen that got in should be eaten by yeast I think.

Just a suggestion if you're not interested in spending $$$ on more equipment.

20180801_114608.jpeg
 

1bottlerocket

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Here's my set-up for NEIPAs along with 1st trial run. Extra port for keeping CO2 purging during cold crash and bottling. Spigot to bottle directly from primary. Dual regulator to keep bucket purged AND flush bottles with CO2. Basiclly here's what I did...

- Cold Crash and purge every few hours (leaving CO2 on port).
- Move to table and sit for a few hours.
- Rinse/sanitize bottle then use carbonation drops so you don't have to open fermenter.
- Now CO2 purge bottle, fill beer, CO2 again and cap.

Any oxygen that got in should be eaten by yeast I think.

Just a suggestion if you're not interested in spending $$$ on more equipment.

View attachment 581712
Wow! That looks like a cool set up! I would totally be into trying that out. It never occurred to me to have a CO2 port on the top of the bottling bucket. I also did not consider drops to carbonate. I really appreciate the feedback from everybody.

Thanks Braufessor for the tips on the steps. I am planing on going primary to bottling bucket and incorporating some of PianoMan's suggestions.

I would like to thank everyone for the feedback and helping me through the process! It is very much appreciated.
 

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Anyone try k97 yet? Thinking of trying it next. Had good success with other non standard neipa yeast like klosch. As k97 is a German ale, figured it might work well
 

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I've brewed a few IPAs with K-97 and it does not clear very well, so it would be good for the haze. The yeast itself is not really estery, even when fermenter higher, but it does not clash with the hops and lets both hops and malts to shine through. ( recipe dependent )

It's worth a try.
 

GnenieGone

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Lastest NEIPA. My 1st try a few days ago disappointed me. 1 week bottled now and no diacetyl nor oxygenation. Not a substantial amount of flavor but ill take it. Left is a Pinthouse Pizza DIPA. Right is mine.
20180809_215820.jpeg
 

ca_baracus

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Just kegged my second NEIPA batch last night and saw this:

IMG_0836 2.jpg

I dry hopped during high krausen (48hrs after pitching). I'm thinking (hoping) that it was just krausen/foam stuck on the dry hops that never dropped out. Beer smells and tastes great, so I don't think it's an infection. Anyone else run into this?
 

ca_baracus

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Just kegged my second NEIPA batch last night and saw this:

View attachment 582994

I dry hopped during high krausen (48hrs after pitching). I'm thinking (hoping) that it was just krausen/foam stuck on the dry hops that never dropped out. Beer smells and tastes great, so I don't think it's an infection. Anyone else run into this?
Never mind. All is well.
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