New to kegs. Keg conditioning/CO2 purge questions

[bionicbelly]

Hey all, I really did try to find the answer to this, and I'm sure it is here somewhere, but I can't find it.
I have a couple of brews going, and will be filling my first kegs pretty soon.

My plan was to prime the kegs, fill, and condition for a few weeks. (Like I do with bottles) I have a couple of spunding valves to keep the pressure at around serving pressure. I'll be conditioning for a minimum of two weeks, and some could be months.

So, my question is, Do I need to purge the keg with CO2 before I fill it?, or is this just a thing when you are carbing with CO2, since there isn't that second fermentation with the priming sugar?

It would seem to me that I wouldn't need to. There is less headspace in a keg than bottles, and I am drinking ales that I bottled 8-10 months ago, and they are really good. (Better than they were fresh)

 

[sibelman]

As with bottling, the "second fermentation" may reduce but will not eliminate the effects of oxygen on flavor. That said, it's easier to reduce oxygen when kegging. I suggest you try it both ways and see whether purging provides benefits to your enjoyment of your beer.

 

[marc1]

Hey all, I really did try to find the answer to this, and I'm sure it is here somewhere, but I can't find it.
I have a couple of brews going, and will be filling my first kegs pretty soon.

My plan was to prime the kegs, fill, and condition for a few weeks. (Like I do with bottles) I have a couple of spunding valves to keep the pressure at around serving pressure. I'll be conditioning for a minimum of two weeks, and some could be months.

So, my question is, Do I need to purge the keg with CO2 before I fill it?, or is this just a thing when you are carbing with CO2, since there isn't that second fermentation with the priming sugar?

It would seem to me that I wouldn't need to. There is less headspace in a keg than bottles, and I am drinking ales that I bottled 8-10 months ago, and they are really good. (Better than they were fresh)

Unless you are doing closed transfers to the kegs, I'm not sure purging them first will make much of a difference. Certainly don't splash while transferring.

When you spund for carbonating in the keg, make sure that you adjust the pressure for the temperature you are carbonating at to get your desired volumes.

 

[brewbama]

O2 elimination in packaging and keeping beer cold are the two most important things you can do to preserve fresh flavor.

Do you purge your bottles with CO2 prior to counter pressure filling? If not, I recommend it.

Likewise, I recommend filling your keg completely with no foam sanitizer and pushing it out with CO2 prior to closed transferring beer from the fermenter to the keg.

Then keep the beer cold.

 

[Dland]

The sanitizer purge does work well. Another option is to use CO2 from fermentation to purge kegs, though they still should be sanitized first.

This is what I do, the CO2 is free and being produced by ones fermentor, if the keg is clean and sanitized, one can purge kegs w gas coming from your fermentor. Also end up w less starsan or whatever in beer. Yeah is OK to have a little acid wash in there, but I prefer to keep to absolute minimum.

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/forum/threads/keg-purging-with-active-fermentation.628658/#post-8004741

 

[bionicbelly]

O2 elimination in packaging and keeping beer cold are the two most important things you can do to preserve fresh flavor.

Do you purge your bottles with CO2 prior to counter pressure filling? If not, I recommend it.

Likewise, I recommend filling your keg completely with no foam sanitizer and pushing it out with CO2 prior to closed transferring beer from the fermenter to the keg.

Then keep the beer cold.

I do not purge bottles and I just fill them straight off the fermenter with a wand. I have never taken any steps to reduce oxidation really. When I bottle, I fill all the bottles, then cap. And like I said, I am drinking some plain old ales that are 8-10 months old that are way better than they were when I bottled them. I know bottle caps absorb some oxygen, and certainly the yeasties eat some up. But the way these beers are aging, and considering how little I do (did) to prevent exposure to oxygen is the reason I'm asking. I have not filled a single keg yet (I've got two ready to go in next week) and so I'm trying to decide what my process will be.

 

[bionicbelly]

The sanitizer purge does work well. Another option is to use CO2 from fermentation to purge kegs, though they still should be sanitized first.

This is what I do, the CO2 is free and being produced by ones fermentor, if the keg is clean and sanitized, one can purge kegs w gas coming from your fermentor. Also end up w less starsan or whatever in beer. Yeah is OK to have a little acid wash in there, but I prefer to keep to absolute minimum.

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/forum/threads/keg-purging-with-active-fermentation.628658/#post-8004741

I like this. I was kind of kicking this idea around a bit, because it is free and pretty easy. It will be too late for my current batches, but I think I'll try this in the future. Like I said earlier, I just have never put any effort into reducing oxygen, and my beers seem to age really well. This method seems to be easy enough that it would be worth the time to set the equipment up to do this.

 

[pvpeacock]

I regularly naturally carbonate in the keg. (1) Add 1/2 cup of sugar dissolved in hot water into the keg. (2) Transfer the beer from the fermenter to the keg and seal. If you want, you can purge the keg first as described above or not. I don't. (3) Purge the headspace with CO2 a number of times. (4) let sit for 2 weeks to naturally carbonate. If you want to use a spunding valve, fine. I don't. By using only 1/2 cup of sugar, you will not get excessive carbonation with or without a spunding valve. (5) put keg in keezer or kegerator; release pressure in keg; and connect to CO2 tank at serving pressure. Let it sit a a day or two to cool and to finish carbonating (if necessary). (6) drink.

I, for one, think many people overcomplicate the process for little or no real benefit. To each his/her own. I have not noticed any oxidation doing the above. Good luck.

 

[bionicbelly]

I have not noticed any oxidation doing the above. Good luck.

Perfect. Exactly what I was hoping! Thanks!

 

[bionicbelly]

Just wanted to follow up on this, I still don't have the fittings to be able to purge the keg with fermentation gas. (my fault, I ordered the wrong stuff) But conditioning in the keg seems to work great. I made a light cream ale, and did an open transfer to the keg. I added 4 oz table sugar, and set the spunding valve to 20 PSI. (this is at ~65F) Let it sit for a couple of weeks to carbonate and condition, and all is good. Not sure if this will work for all styles or not, and I definitely will be capturing CO2 from the fermentation in the future, but it's good not know that if that can't be done, that it isn't a disaster.