Need lager temp for newbie advice

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homebrewdad

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Complete newbie to the world of lagers, here. A brewing buddy (Stonehands here on HBT) was kind enough to gift me a mini fridge for lagering. I am now excitedly pondering the possibilities.

Setting the fridge on the first setting above defrost gives me a temperature of 38 degrees F, which, to my understanding, should be great for the actual lagering process. Obviously, it will go colder than that - I will check to see how cold. What is the absolute ideal lagering temp?

Setting it to defrost (the warmest setting it has) gives me 44 degrees. I believe that will be a tad too cool for fermentation of the yeast I have in mind (WLP838), which calls for 50-55 degrees. I was hoping to be able to hold around 47 degrees in the fridge, but I'm going to be a bit short of that. Will that simply be too cold?

Also, complete moron question here, but does making a lager starter differ from an ale starter in anything but volume? I understand that lager starters need to be big, but do they need to be temperature controlled? I always do my ale starters at room temp... though come to think of it, perhaps I should be controlling their temps, as well? Never thought about that until now.

Finally, I understand that a diacetyl rest is critical. When is this performed?

Thanks for any input.
 
To do this properly, you'll need a controller like an STC-1000 to regulate that mini fridge and accurately hold the temps you need. Inexpensive ($19 on Amazon) and it'll serve you well for making lagers.

I'm doing a maibock right now using WY2124 Bohemian Lager. It's still at its starting temp of 48*F. When it starts to slow down, I'll let it come up to 50-51*F and hold it there. After about 9 days, I'll check gravity. If it's 80% or better attenuated, I'll let it come up to 61*F and leave it there for 3 days. I'll check gravity again before cold crashing to 35-36*F for 5-7 days and racking to a keg.

I lager at the same temp I cold crash.

You can do lager yeast starters at normal room temp. A stir plate is highly recommended.
 
HBD--

Agreed, build yourself a temperature controller using an STC-1000. I use one for my kegerator, and the other is controlling my freezer that I now use as a fermentation chamber. This will allow you to ferment at temperatures above what the refrigerator will maintain on its own.

I wouldn't worry too much about the actual temperature of your starters, because you are typically adding in the yeast, and not the wort. That being said, once the starter is basically finished, I maintain the temperature of the starter at the same temperature I intend to pitch at the yeast to avoid stressing the yeast.

+1 to raising the temperature of your fermentation for a diacetyl rest before the yeast has fully attenuated. Different yeast strains are more susceptible to producing diacetyl, in addition to other factors such as yeast pitching rate and the ability to maintain fermentation temperatures. Determining whether those factors exist, and some research into your particular yeast, will help to answer whether one is needed. When it doubt, I would take the time to let it rest since it only adds about 1 week to the already length fermentation schedule of a lager.

I'm currently enjoying a Bohemian Pilser on tap - what do you intend to brew as your first lager?

Keep us posted!!

kc
 
Thanks for the advice! What I'm reading confirms what I *thought* I knew, but it's better to be sure than to make a stupid mistake off of something I was wrong about.

My first lager will probably be a Munich Dunkel. I've always been a huge fan of English and Belgian ales, but the guy who gave me the fridge really turned me on to German lagers. He has a Munich Dunkel that's as good as any beer I've ever had, period, so I could see going there.

That being said, I've been bitten by the "how good of an Oktoberfest can I make?" bug. I've been playing in Beersmith tonight with some guidance from Designing Great Beers, and I have to admit, that's a pretty tempting undertaking.
 
Yep, never hurts to ask and solicit advise. The worst they can tell you is to use the search function! Hehehe.....just kidding.

I will be brewing up an Oktoberfest as well in the very near future. I need to source the ingredients, as I don't think I can get everything I need for that here in town. I haven't yet picked up Designing Great Beers, but it's on my list. I am using Jamil's Oktoberfest recipe as my base - I've brewed several from his book, and haven't been disappointed yet!
 
Yep, never hurts to ask and solicit advise. The worst they can tell you is to use the search function! Hehehe.....just kidding.

I will be brewing up an Oktoberfest as well in the very near future. I need to source the ingredients, as I don't think I can get everything I need for that here in town. I haven't yet picked up Designing Great Beers, but it's on my list. I am using Jamil's Oktoberfest recipe as my base - I've brewed several from his book, and haven't been disappointed yet!

Psh, I answer enough "why isn't my beer carbed yet", "is this infected?", and "why don't I have any bubbles in my airlock?" threads to earn the occasional pass on my own redundant questions every now and then. :)

I've brewed Jamil's Belgian golden strong. Delicious beer, no doubt.
 
I know - I've seen you posting regularly answering the threads for quite some time. That's why I decided to stir the pot just a little with the search comment! Hey, it's Friday night and the start of a 4-day weekend for me - I could be doing a lot worse!

This weekend I will be swapping freezers around, making the stand-up freezer I picked up our household freezer, and using my 5 foot freezer as a fermentation chamber. So many projects, so few hours........

Cheers!

homebrewdad said:
Psh, I answer enough "why isn't my beer carbed yet", "is this infected?", and "why don't I have any bubbles in my airlock?" threads to earn the occasional pass on my own redundant questions every now and then. :)
 
I know - I've seen you posting regularly answering the threads for quite some time. That's why I decided to stir the pot just a little with the search comment! Hey, it's Friday night and the start of a 4-day weekend for me - I could be doing a lot worse!

This weekend I will be swapping freezers around, making the stand-up freezer I picked up our household freezer, and using my 5 foot freezer as a fermentation chamber. So many projects, so few hours........

Cheers!

Sounds like a nice weekend!

I'm bottling my big Irish red now.
 
Nice - sounds delicious! My Irish Red has been fermenting since Sunday. I'm actually waiting for the krausen to start to fall so I can pull it out of the freezer and begin my appliance swap. I was overly efficient at 88% and ended up hitting 1.065 on my OG. I'm sure I will be able to choke it down......

homebrewdad said:
Sounds like a nice weekend!

I'm bottling my big Irish red now.
 
Nice - sounds delicious! My Irish Red has been fermenting since Sunday. I'm actually waiting for the krausen to start to fall so I can pull it out of the freezer and begin my appliance swap. I was overly efficient at 88% and ended up hitting 1.065 on my OG. I'm sure I will be able to choke it down......

Heh... that's why I call mine a "big" Irish red - my target gravity is 1.065, with just under 28 IBUs. Everything you like about an Irish red, just a bit more. ;)
 
My now-legal Alabama brewing comrade, if you brew up a good Munich Dunkel (I've got one on tap right now - delicious), you be able to brew an equally good Oktoberfest. You can harvest and rinse the Dunkel yeast and use the same strain later on that Oktoberfest.

Do you have a stir plate yet? For lagers, I try to err on the side of a slight over-pitch.
 
My now-legal Alabama brewing comrade, if you brew up a good Munich Dunkel (I've got one on tap right now - delicious), you be able to brew an equally good Oktoberfest. You can harvest and rinse the Dunkel yeast and use the same strain later on that Oktoberfest.

Do you have a stir plate yet? For lagers, I try to err on the side of a slight over-pitch.

Yeah, yeast is something that is stumping me a bit. I see one school of thought that says to use the same lager yeast for pretty much anything, but as an ale guy, I thought it's a good idea to match the yeast with the beer?

No stir plate yet, but it's on the to do list for sure. I personally prefer err on the side of overpitch for pretty much anything.
 
Yeah, yeast is something that is stumping me a bit. I see one school of thought that says to use the same lager yeast for pretty much anything, but as an ale guy, I thought it's a good idea to match the yeast with the beer?

No stir plate yet, but it's on the to do list for sure. I personally prefer err on the side of overpitch for pretty much anything.

Lager yeasts are pretty versatile. My last few lager batches (both helles and dunkel), I've been using some Wyeast 2124 Bohemian Lager that a buddy of mine harvested from a Gen 1 batch and gave me a jar. It has produced some great lagers. Currently on Gen 4, I'll harvest/use it for a few more generations before starting over with a new vial of probably WLP940 Mexican Lager Yeast.

The reason I mention the stirplate is that, if you don't use one, you'll have to make some mighty big starters for medium gravity and up lagers. I found it very easy to build one out of a computer fan, a 12V AC adapter and some scrap parts. I adjust the speed using one of these - http://www.ebay.com/itm/DC-DC-Converter-5-30v-Step-down-Power-Supply-Module-Adjustable-3-27v-3A-/360694211078?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item53fb0ce206
 
Lager yeasts are pretty versatile. My last few lager batches (both helles and dunkel), I've been using some Wyeast 2124 Bohemian Lager that a buddy of mine harvested from a Gen 1 batch and gave me a jar. It has produced some great lagers. Currently on Gen 4, I'll harvest/use it for a few more generations before starting over with a new vial of probably WLP940 Mexican Lager Yeast.

The reason I mention the stirplate is that, if you don't use one, you'll have to make some mighty big starters for medium gravity and up lagers. I found it very easy to build one out of a computer fan, a 12V AC adapter and some scrap parts. I adjust the speed using one of these - http://www.ebay.com/itm/DC-DC-Converter-5-30v-Step-down-Power-Supply-Module-Adjustable-3-27v-3A-/360694211078?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item53fb0ce206

Stirplate is definitely on my list, and a DIY is just the kind of thing I like to do.

I do not presently harvest/wash yeast. I only brew once every couple of months as is, so the time/effort doesn't seem to make much sense for me. I'll just spend the $7 for new yeast each time.

So, then, why stick with one yeast?
 
Stirplate is definitely on my list, and a DIY is just the kind of thing I like to do.

I do not presently harvest/wash yeast. I only brew once every couple of months as is, so the time/effort doesn't seem to make much sense for me. I'll just spend the $7 for new yeast each time.

So, then, why stick with one yeast?

If you're not harvesting, there's no reason to stick with just one.

For me, one vial or smack pack lasts through several batches.:mug:
 
And.......updates? Have you brewed your first lager yet? What was it? How did it turn out? Inquiring minds want to know!!!!!!
 
I built my STC-1000 controller, and it works great. I'm still working on my stirplate; Monday night, I managed to burn up a fan by being a total moron, and last night, I realized that my bolts were too short. I should complete it tonight, however.

Sunday, I'm brewing my Oktoberfest recipe, so I'll let you know how it goes!

Thanks again for the help.
 
Awesome, sounds like you're making steady progress! I had to spend some time adjusting my stirplate too, and now it runs like a champ.

My second lager was an Oktoberfest. Just pulled it out of the fermentation freezer for a week of a diacetyl rest before lagering.

Definitely keep us posted!

homebrewdad said:
I built my STC-1000 controller, and it works great. I'm still working on my stirplate; Monday night, I managed to burn up a fan by being a total moron, and last night, I realized that my bolts were too short. I should complete it tonight, however.

Sunday, I'm brewing my Oktoberfest recipe, so I'll let you know how it goes!

Thanks again for the help.
 
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