Mychorrhzae and New Rhizomes

[Pumpkinman906]

Greetings and a question for the group. I am wondering if anyone has
tried inoculating their soil with mychorrhizal fungi in a new hop
establishment to increase size and establishment of the root system.
It has been my experience in growing giant pumpkins (1266Lbs. is my
personal best) that the use of mychorrhizal fungi in the soil benefits
the plant not only by establishing the fungal colony on the root
system for better nutrient uptake, but also increases the health and
size of the root system. This may aid in establishing the root system
quicker in new rhizomes, thereby increasing yield in the first year.
There are 2 types of mychorrhzae, Endo and Ecto. I believe with hops,
being a woody vine that the type of mychorrhzae used to inoculate
trees, which I believe is Ecto, would be the proper choice for hop
growing.
Thoughts or experiences?

Also some selected reading if anyone is interested..

http://www.reforest.com/pdf/rti_plant_list.pdf

Ectomycorrhizae

Plant Revolution

Mycorrhiza - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[SenorWanderer]

looks like you're way out in front on this one! thanks for the info.

 

[Birchgrove77]

Wow, this question takes me back to my Mycology class at WIU! I think you pose an interesting question, and I think there is no question that the host plant definitely benefits from the relationship, but is there a cost to the hop plant? Smaller cone size? Lower alpha acid content? I wonder if this might be one factor in why different hop varietals fair better in different climates, or even why certain hops are associated with different regions?

Also, welcome to HBT!

 

[JayC]

It's my understanding that the first year yield is usually low or nonexistent because the rhizome is putting down so many roots. Encouraging additional root formation may just divert more nutrients away from cone formation... or not. Sounds like an experiment is in order this spring.

 

[zoebisch01]

I believe in minimal soil disturbance to create strong mycorrhiza growth and beneficial soil function. I think the pictures of my Garlic kind of speak for themselves. I have had cloves weigh in at over 1 oz. A single clove. Granted that is in part genetics, part care and part conditions, but the soil must be healthy. Since Hops are generally undisturbed in the soil, this provides a healthy environment for this to take place. Indeed it does sound like experimentation is in order.

 

[Reddog68]

Welcome to the site pumpkinman. Let me start off by saying my experience with michorrizae(?) is very limited. I do think that having them available in the root zone is a benefit, but it is my understanding that they help assimilate nitrogen only. One problem is see with these little critters is that it is very difficult to evaluate their effectiveness.IMO, i think you would benefit more by inoculating the root zone AFTER your hops are established. In order to maximize plant develpment, i would make sure that you have adequate nutrients available (N,P,K, micros). Pull a soil sample and add your needed nutrients before you plant, pay particular attention to Phosphorous, which is critical to root development. Also, compost, compost, compost. I hope this helps! Yes, I am a fertilizer salesman!

 

[david_42]

No, they are not used in hop growing. At least, not commercially and if it helped, it would get used.

 

[Pumpkinman906]

I can believe that it may not be used commercially due to cost, however I'm inclined to believe it is not because it is not beneficial. Only in the last few years has myco and the relationship with the plant root zone been examined in depth. It's existed forever, just not fully understood. Same goes for the use of Humic and Fulvic acid as a foliar and a drench application. I'm a firm believer in feeding the soil biology and replenishing with soil ammendments vs. soley fertilizer ammending. Naturally recharging the soil has vast more benefits than only broadcast ferts. Obvisously this is not practical or feasible commercially in many cases, again due to cost. However the backyard hop grower can do alot with little budget toward natually ammending their plot. We usually put down 30 yds of manure and 40 yds of leaves in 3000 sq ft every fall as well as meal type fertilizers as opposed to granulars which contain huge excesses of salts. As I said in my first post, I'm just learning about hops and wanted to throw out some of the methods we use in growing 1000 Lbs fruit and discuss what may work, what may not and maybe some things that the backyard grower hasn't tried. One other example is the Agro-K fertilizing program which is used widely in the grape growing industry. It's a foliar feeding program that has some extremely useful products. Since we have been using it in the pumpkin patch, we've gone over 1000# every year. And no, we don't sell the stuff, just find it very beneficial..hehe. Here's a link if anyone wants to read more about it.

Welcome to C & J Products!

Giant Pumpkin fertility Program

Thanks for the welcome. Look forward to many discussions in the future.

 

[Duster72]

The C&J website is very interesting. I wonder if we couldn't send them some information on Hops (possibly from the Colorado State site) and have them try to design a basic program for hops. I would think that hops would be much easier to do than pumpkins, because you don't have all the concerns related to the fruit, but it does seem like they would have similar root requirements.

 

[quickerNu]

Mycorrhizal associations are very important to plant development. However, I believe it is better in the long run to let that relationship develop naturally by providing a healthy environment for local microbes to naturally form. If plenty of organic matter is available in the soil, the rhizosphere will have everything needed for these associations to form naturally. Just innoculating the root zone may prove to be benificial in the short term for plant establishment, but I doubt lab-selected microbes would do a better job than what is already in a live, nutrient-rich soil.

 

[giligson]

Pumpkinman, are you involved in the selling of any of the products that you mentioned?

I know that in grape growing the use of mychorizae is considered a "fringe" practice - i.e. most people don't feel that it does much to benefit fruit production, but on the other hand when growing grapes one usually tries to keep tight control on available nitrogen.

 

[Pumpkinman906]

I'm not in any way associated with the sale of any of the things I have mentioned. I just know what works in growing giant pumpkins and wanted to see if any of the same methods were used in Hop growing as I am getting into growing them this spring for our own little brewing operation.
I do know the guy who owns candjfert, who also is a retailer of Agro-K. I could ask about any kind of hops program they have if there is interest.

I understand the natural approach, however, in a small operation or backyard plot, a helping hand to mother nature in the proper application can produce impressive dividends.

 

[Duster72]

I do know the guy who owns candjfert, who also is a retailer of Agro-K. I could ask about any kind of hops program they have if there is interest.

I would be interested, and I think others would be as well.

 

[Pumpkinman906]

I have emailed my contact at Agro-K about developing a Hops feeding schedule using the product. I'll let everyone know when he has something.

In the meantime, here is a bit more info on Mycorrhizae and it's benefits.


"WHAT ARE THE BENEFITS OF MYCORRHIZAL FUNGI?
By Doctor Michael Amaranthus

Mycorrhizal fungi function through a network of threads. At one end the threads attach to and enter the root tissue. It is here that the plant and fungus exchange essential materials. The plants receive mineral nutrients, water, and a variety of other growth promoting substances. In exchange, the fungus receives essential sugars and compounds to fuel its own growth. On the other end, fungal threads as individuals (hyphae) or in clusters (mycelium) fan out into the soil and exponentially expand the amount of soil which the roots may explore for raw materials. Estimates of amounts of mycorrhizal filaments present in soil associated with plants are astonishing. Several miles of filaments can be present in less than a thimbleful of soil. Mycorrhizal fungal filaments in the soil are truly extensions of root systems and more effective in nutrient and water absorption that the roots themselves.

Many other exchanges occur between plants and their mycorrhizal symbionts. Mycorrhizal fungi produce soil compounds which stimulate the plant to produce additional roots on which the fungus can grow. Conversely, roots in turn secrete substance upon which stimulate the growth of the fungus. Mycorrhizal fungi release powerful chemicals into the soil that dissolve hard to capture elements such as phosphorous, iron and other “tightly bound” soil nutrients. Other chemicals produced by mycorrhizal fungi include enzymes to degrade organic carbon and nitrogen sources. These extraction processes are particularly important in plant nutrition and explains why non mycorrhizal plants require high levels of fertility to maintain their health.
Mycorrhizal fungi form an intricate web that captures and assimilates nutrients and water, conserving the ability of soils to remain productive during periods of stress. In non irrigated conditions, mycorrhizal plants are under far less drought stress compared to non mycorrhizal plants. Results from numerous studies strongly indicate that mycorrhizal fungi can help plants to tolerate and recover from soil water deficits. The mycelial network produced by mycorrhizal fungi play an important role in water uptake storage, and movement back into plants demonstrated the enhanced tolerance to drought stress.

Disease and pathogen suppression is another benefit for a mycorrhizal plant. Mycorrhizal fungi attack pathogens or disease organisms entering the root zone. Excretions of specific antibiotics produced by mycorrhizal fungi immobilize and kill disease organisms. Numerous studies have shown that many mycorrhizal fungi exhibits strong antibiotic activity and these antibiotics form a chemical barrier protecting plant roots from disease. In addition some mycorrhizal roots have a mantle (a tight, interwoven covering of dense filaments) that acts as a physical barrier against the invasion of root diseases.

Mycorrhizal fungi also improves soil structure. Mycorrhizal filaments produce humic compounds and organic “glues” (extra cellular polysaccharides) that bind solids into aggregates and improves soil porosity. Soil porosity and soil structure positively influence the growth of plants by promoting aeration, water movement into soil, root growth, and distribution. In sandy or compacted soils the ability of mycorrhizal fungi to promote soil structure may be the most important factor improving plant performance."

 

[7Enigma]

Pumpkinman, thanks for the interesting thread. While I do not have experience with the topic at hand I can try to offer some advice after my first growing season.

I think the biggest thing that needs to be decided for a first time grower is what are their expectations. Many people want the instant gratification of having a sizable yield for the first year. Methods such as limiting the bines to 2-4 on a new plant likely will increase cone yield in the first season but IMO stunts the overall root establishment. I prefer (and did for my new cascade rhizomes) to let them grow virtually unchecked for the first season. I ended up training probably 5-8 bines per plant (all they shot up) and feel this added mass above ground should directly relate to the root growth below ground.

Plant nutrition (and water) is vitally important being such a fast grower. I have always followed the kitchen sink approach to plant growing and so frown on products that supply a small number of nutrients (ie chemical fertilizers). I organically feed my soil with grains for my lawn (ie feed the soil NOT the grass) and have had good results. On the same page I compost all food/paper items in our house and feel that there is nothing a bag of ferts could offer that rich compost can't easily surpass.

I've also read about soil amendments that try to inoculate some type of organism be it bacteria/fungi and have come to the conclusion that in all but sterile soil (say new development where the "soil" is basically clay or sand or only a very small layer of topsoil has been put down) then yes, amendments of the microbe variety may be helpful. But I think in most systems there are already large amounts of the desired microbes in the soil, to the point where adding more would at best have a negligible benefit and at worst just be a waste of money.

But I'll keep an eye on this thread and your next growing season!

 

[Nerro]

I have no experience with hops but other plants benefit hugely from compost and mycorrizae. The compost provides a nutrient rich soil to promote the first growth of roots and the mycorrizae help the roots on once they have penetrated past the compost. I got 2 enormous plants on slightly acidic soil.

As I understand it the plants roots react to chemicals from the fungus by growing at an almost cancerous rate and the fungus benefits by stealing some of the sugars that the plant provides for the purpose of growing more roots. The excessive growth of roots leads to a large amount of additional nutrients for the plant which in turn allows for much more growth above ground.

 

[7Enigma]

Very interesting Nerro. That's kind of the principal I was using for the first year growth (not clipping any of the bines to promote as much sugar production as possible). In your experience was the fungus spiked in additionally or just that which was found in the compost? Compost in its own right is fantastic, but I'm wondering if inoculating additional fungus was what your "experience" showed.

 

[Nerro]

Compost contains a lot of fungus in its own right and those fungi aren't necessarily conductive to plant health. I figured that to introduce a fungus that was and to help it by giving it a plant to feed of would be a nice way to kill 2 birds in 1 stone. The fungus would consume and out-compete other fungi and it would help the plant grow. The roots of the plant were an enormous mass of tangled little underground vines when I dug them up. The plants I grew have a lot of roots anyway but these were awesome The plants grew like no tomorrow even during a hot summer when I failed to water them because I couldn't really be arsed. Normally such plants wither quickly if left in dry soil. I guess that indicates it had abnormally good water uptake.

 

[pjj2ba]

Keep in mind that many of the mycorrhizae are highly specialized and often each species has a single specific host plant. A mycorrhizae that works with one plant might not work with another. There are some generalists out there, but the ones specific to the plant of interest are always the best. In the case of the legume/bacteria symbiosis for nitrogen fixation, here is it is, one species of legume/one species of bacteria.

I'm not sure if the same is true for mycorrhizae, but for nitrogen fixing bacteria, if the legume has plenty of nitrogen available, it won't let the bacteria in, won't make nodules and won't fix Nitrogen from the air no matter how much bacteria is present in the soil. Sort of the, why buy the cow when you can get milk for free, scenario. The plus of growing legumes in a crop rotation is that if you don't give them any nitrogen fertilizer (saving $$), then they will set up shop with the bacteria and fix the Nitrogen they need from the air. Certainly in a poor soil, mycorrhizae will help, but I'm not sure if it will make a big difference in an already healthy, nutrient rich soil.

 

[Kriznac]

There are many companies that cater to the indoor and/or hydroponic gardener and they sell myco's and all kinds of other good fungi for root zone inoculation. We all know what kind of plants these people are producing these products for and hops, again as we all know, is very closely related. I would think these products would be very good for hops as well. BTW, I have used them and they DO make a difference.

 

[Essex]

Pro-Mix BX has Mycorrhizal fungi in it. I use it for seed starting and have dumped many cubic feet of it in the garden. The fungi is already in most soil too from what I've read. But if it has an effect, I don't know as I have no control area to compare. Pro-Mix, which sells to large operations, thinks it is beneficial.