Maris otter substitute?

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Chefjp

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Im planning on brewing a dry stout. Here in mexico Im not able to get maris otter, can I add 2row base malt instead? Or is it really necesary to use maris otter?

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mdgagne

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I think subbing a couple lbs of biscuit malt will help match the bready quality of Marris otter malt.
 

LabRatBrewer

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You can use two-row, and maybe try toasting a couple of pounds of it, to sort of emulate maris otter. It won't be the same, but it would still be very good in a stout!
+1

I am drinking an English Bitter made with home roasted 2 row right now. I love Maris Otter, but was out and my wallet said it was a bad idea to go to the LHBS. There are some good threads on here regarding roasting 2 row. It is very easy.

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f36/home-roasting-expert-needed-138483/
 

jonmohno

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Toast some two row, or if you can get buiscuit,victory.Golden Promise is your best bet if you can get that. Im a fan of brown malt especially in dark beers.There is amber malt too which is basically toasted malt i think. I think they are all different though really so there is no real sub just some similarites that create a different subtle character. If you compared them side by side you probably would see the difference.It may be harder to notice a difference anyway in a stout though maybe. Its the same way as different crystal malts-they have differences. Like carahell compared to crystal 15-20 or something. I think i preferr the belgian crystal malts going by the beers ive tried that have used them.
 

TrickyDick

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Planning a brew marathon with some days off. Didn't plan ahead, and don't have enough Maris otter malt to brew the three beers I want to make.

One is the bass ale clone recipe, the other is a nut brown ale, and the last is an Irish red ale.

I need 33 pounds of Maris otter for all three, but only have ten pounds on hand. I have probably 5 pounds of golden promise, a ton of TF pearl malt, and a couple pounds of biscuit, and victory malt. I also have plenty of us 2 row, Vienna, munich, floor malted pils, and a large selection of specialty malts (including caramunich, melanoiden, some belgian cara 8, etc)

I know it's not going to be exactly like Maris otter. I think that I should take the MO and GP and weigh that, and divide among all three recipes, so there will be real MO in each beer. I'm probably a good 15-18 pounds shy still. Thinking make up the balance with pearl malt and a touch of biscuit malt or victory malt might be a good sub.

Any ideas on how much biscuit or victory is should add per pound of pearl?? Would Vienna be a better choice?

Maybe I nibble on some malt to compare flavors...


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progmac

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i'd say don't over complicate it - just use the two row. in something like a dry stout, i think it would be difficult to distinguish one base malt from another.
 

Bobcatbrewing42

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The owner of my LHBS uses Maris Otter routinely in place of two row. It gives a bit more body and some pizazz to light beers. She does admit that it helps to own a brew store. The cost is significantly higher. I like the toasted malt idea that others have suggested. I've been using about 1/4 Munich malt in my pales with good results.
 

TrickyDick

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i'd say don't over complicate it - just use the two row. in something like a dry stout, i think it would be difficult to distinguish one base malt from another.

Yeah the OP was making a dry stout. I tagged along on this necro thread from 2012...


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azscoob

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Wow, zombie thread!

To use 2-row for M.O. I sub a couple pounds of victory, about 20 percent of the base malt is what I shoot for, and as others have suggested, I am a huge fan of home toasting some 2-row, letting it rest a few days in a paper sack and then using the same proportion as above to amend the base malt. I tend to get a more vibrant beer when I use home toasted malt.
 

azscoob

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I find it smoothes the flavors I get by letting it breathe a bit while the chemical magic works inside the grain, I'm not *really* sure what is going on in there but my personal experience has been that the paper sack for a week or so does wonders.
 

LabRatBrewer

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Paraphrasing Randy Mosher (Radical Brewing),"If you brew with them [home roasted grains] right away you'll get harsh, burnt aromas along with the good stuff..." -actually I guess it's more like quoting.
 

thaymond

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I also read that it's okay to use a lightly toasted malt in your mash right away, but let the heavier or darker toasted malts sit and breathe for a while. What's the opinion or findings on this from of more experienced brewers?

I just toasted 1lb of MO @ 300 degrees for 25 minutes. The color of the grain came out a little darker than the original MO. I tossed it right in, ground it up and mashed in 10 minutes later. I'll report back if I get some of the harsh flavors from that light toast.
 

thaymond

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That makes sense. I'll check back for your result. I have 2 lbs of 2 row in oven at 250 right now. Letting it go 25 min.
I will say that I am seriously considering roasting base malts exclusively as it gives the house a wonderful smell.

Out of the airlock, I have the overwhelming aroma of Homegrown Zeus. No harsh or astringent malt aromas noted. I kinda want to dunk my head in it...
 

TrickyDick

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I don't have time to toast and rest unfortunately.

I think my plan is to blend the three varieties of British base malt with Maris otter, golden promise, and pearl. It'll probably be in a rough 2:1:3 ratio. I might consider adding a pound of biscuit malt to it, or maybe some dingemans cara 8 to improve the toasty caramel profile of this blend in comparison with the straight MO.

FWIW, there was an article here from last winter about base British malt flavors and a comparison with tasting notes comparing US 2 row, MO, GP, Pearl, Optic, Halcyon and maybe there was one other malt.

TD


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