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bembel

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I entered my last batch in the Ocean State Home Brew competition last weekend as 'New England Cider' and won 2nd place using Costco apple juice!!!

Start to finish was no more than a month, I stopped fermentation with a cold crash at 1010 to keep a little residual sweetness and kegged it with a touch of sorbate and some campden tabs. Held in the bottles just fine with no further fermentation.

The KEY is to improve the juice to make it more 'cider-apple' like.

Cider apples have a lot more acid and tannin than the apples they make Motts or Tree Top with, so I test the acid of all store bought juices to see how much Malic acid and tannin I need to add back to them to make them taste better, I will publish a chart soon with results.

Recipe was simple


5 gallons Costco Apple juice, plus 5 teaspoons Malic Acid and 1.25 teaspoons tannin

1 cup of organic raisins,
2 pounds of Sugar in the Raw

I fermented it in a 6 gallon Better Bottle for extra headspace and used a Hefeweizen yeast with starter ( WY-3056) at 66F to bring out the banana, which worked :ban: You get a crazy brown foam which covers the surface of the juice after 2-3 days and stays there until fermentation is done, so you can also monitor the progress visually, when the foam starts to dissipate, the fermentation is nearly complete. Take a sample, and cold crash at 1015 or 1010 depending on how sweet you like it.

Photo of foam, USE a blow off tube for the first week of fermentation!!!!!

FullSizeRender-1.jpg


FullSizeRender.jpg
 

andrewmaixner

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I entered my last batch in the Ocean State Home Brew competition last weekend as 'New England Cider' and won 2nd place using Costco apple juice!!!
....
Photo of foam, USE a blow off tube for the first week of fermentation!!!!!
How is your blowoff tube attached to the bung?
 

bembel

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How is your blowoff tube attached to the bung?
I used a stainless steel hose barb mender that I picked up at my LHBS, I think 3/8 diameter, whatever fits, Home Depot has these in many sizes

Here is one in brass, ill measure the size and repost but until then.

http://www.grainger.com/product/GRAINGER-APPROVED-Hose-Mender-6AFH5?s_pp=false&picUrl=//static.grainger.com/rp/s/is/image/Grainger/6AFH1_AS01?$smthumb$

Screen Shot 2015-05-21 at 11.22.03 AM.png
 

andrewmaixner

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I used a stainless steel hose barb mender that I picked up at my LHBS, I think 3/8 diameter, whatever fits, Home Depot has these in many sizes

Here is one in brass, ill measure the size and repost but until then.

http://www.grainger.com/product/GRAINGER-APPROVED-Hose-Mender-6AFH5?s_pp=false&picUrl=//static.grainger.com/rp/s/is/image/Grainger/6AFH1_AS01?$smthumb$
Thanks! looks like the best search term for finding it is "hose mender"
 

bembel

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indolent

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The KEY is to improve the juice to make it more 'cider-apple' like.

Cider apples have a lot more acid and tannin than the apples they make Motts or Tree Top with, so I test the acid of all store bought juices to see how much Malic acid and tannin I need to add back to them to make them taste better, I will publish a chart soon with results.
I'd be interested in this when you get around to posting it.
 

Gonefishing2

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I made a batch of this stuff using EdWort's original recipe last night. It's the third batch of it I've ever made, but the first 5 gallon one. One of my sons-in-law turns 30 late in August and he loves the stuff, so it's for his b-day party.
I did make one deviation from the recipe...I used EC1118 yeast.
After less than a day the airlock is bubbling along nicely.
 
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I made a batch of this stuff using EdWort's original recipe last night. It's the third batch of it I've ever made, but the first 5 gallon one. One of my sons-in-law turns 30 late in August and he loves the stuff, so it's for his b-day party.
I did make one deviation from the recipe...I used EC1118 yeast.
After less than a day the airlock is bubbling along nicely.
I am not a fan of hard cider. Is this different enough that I should even consider making it?
 

Goofynewfie

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As cheap and easy as this is, go ahead and make it. If you don't like it, you have something to serve guests. Its also good to cook with
 

Gonefishing

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I have a son inlaw who really likes it but I've never had a glass of it so I can't answer the question. I drink my beer and let the others have this one.
 

fathertorque

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I made a batch of this stuff using EdWort's original recipe last night. It's the third batch of it I've ever made, but the first 5 gallon one. One of my sons-in-law turns 30 late in August and he loves the stuff, so it's for his b-day party.
I did make one deviation from the recipe...I used EC1118 yeast.
After less than a day the airlock is bubbling along nicely.
I'm just stumbling across EdWort's recipe, but my very first homebrew was 3 quarts of Great Value 100% Apple juice blended with 1 quart of water and mixed with a half pound of brown sugar and 2 grams(a tad excessive) of 1118. After a month I racked into a pot with frozen juice concentrate, mixed and bottled in swing top(grolsch style) bottles. Let it sit for a few weeks at 70* then refrigerated. It was a huge hit with friends and family. Now that I've got a 5 gallon carboy, I'm going to try the full EdWort recipe, though I may deviate and try an ale yeast.
 

Gonefishing

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His original recipe has been made many, many, many times now... my son-in-law must not be the only one who loves the stuff. I'll be drinking at least one glass out of this batch too.
 

BowAholic

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started my 5.5g batch today...followed the recipe to the letter...I learned a long time ago to always follow the original recipe the first time...you can play with it after you know what to expect. :)
thanks Ed.
 

Dominic1920

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There seems to be no consistency between batches for me. My first batch was sweet, the second was dry. This last one was in between. I'm following the recipe, but don't have dextrose available here, just regular cane sugar. Maybe that is why?
 

andrewmaixner

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There seems to be no consistency between batches for me. My first batch was sweet, the second was dry. This last one was in between. I'm following the recipe, but don't have dextrose available here, just regular cane sugar. Maybe that is why?
Or you aren't waiting long enough? I've had batches hit 1.000 in 2 weeks, or be at 1.008 at 3+ weeks. I'd guess that the amount of yeast used (viability of the packet), and the oxygen and nutrient levels if you are adding that, could have an impact.
Remember that this is a biological process, so there are some variables that are not very measurable, only estimates.
 

mng8r

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Question about how long this can stay in the primary. I started mine in the Middle of December and thought about bottling it in April, but remembered how much I disliked bottling and have been waiting for a corny to open up. Anyi idea how long it can sit in the carboy before, or if, it'll go bad/vinegar?

Thanks
 

bembel

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As long as you're diligent about keeping the airlock full and no oxygen gets it will not turn to vinegar. There is a lot of debate about leaving it on the yeast cake for so long but for 5 gallons it's argued that it doesn't make a difference since there's so little pressure.
 

bembel

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That being said I usually let things condition in the secondary for 4 to 5 months but I switch to a one piece airlock and use a little potassium sorbate every time I rack. Even a little bit of oxygen if left for a long enough time increases your chance of aceto-bacteria starting to metabolize the alcohol and turned it into vinegar. Potassium sorbate can help retard that process. I bottled a 1 gallon carboy last night which had been sitting since October of last year and it was perfectly fine
 

Xenemorph

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Hey guys. It's been about 6 weeks and it looks like it's almost done but I want to double check here.

https://i.imgur.com/NGjSyq7.jpg

Is it almost done? The bottom's a very different color and looks super cloudy and it's still bubbling very slowly.

https://i.imgur.com/udB7Xei.jpg

As for the top, it doesn't look very clean from when it was really foaming the first few days. Is this normal or did I get bacteria in there?


Thanks
 

andrewmaixner

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Hey guys. It's been about 6 weeks and it looks like it's almost done but I want to double check here.
https://i.imgur.com/NGjSyq7.jpg
Is it almost done? The bottom's a very different color and looks super cloudy and it's still bubbling very slowly.
https://i.imgur.com/udB7Xei.jpg
As for the top, it doesn't look very clean from when it was really foaming the first few days. Is this normal or did I get bacteria in there?
Thanks
1) check gravity. wait 3 days. check gravity again. Offgassing can be caused by temperature change, pressure change, dissolved gas coming out of solution, agitation, etc.

2) that looks like normal yeast on the carboy.
 

NateX

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1) check gravity. wait 3 days. check gravity again. Offgassing can be caused by temperature change, pressure change, dissolved gas coming out of solution, agitation, etc.

2) that looks like normal yeast on the carboy.
Ditto. All of my batches look like this at the top if I don't agitate after initial fermentation start (that's when the yeast really bubble up to the top). The offgassing is normal, especially on a big batch. Lots of CO2 in suspension. As suggested above, check your gravity to determine when it is "done". Given the time, and provided your temps were around 68 to 70 F during fermentation, it should be well done by now.

Bottle. Age. Enjoy. :mug:
 

Xenemorph

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Ditto. All of my batches look like this at the top if I don't agitate after initial fermentation start (that's when the yeast really bubble up to the top). The offgassing is normal, especially on a big batch. Lots of CO2 in suspension. As suggested above, check your gravity to determine when it is "done". Given the time, and provided your temps were around 68 to 70 F during fermentation, it should be well done by now.

Bottle. Age. Enjoy. :mug:
1) check gravity. wait 3 days. check gravity again. Offgassing can be caused by temperature change, pressure change, dissolved gas coming out of solution, agitation, etc.

2) that looks like normal yeast on the carboy.
Thanks for the help. What should the gravity be at, or should I check it twice and see if it stabilizes?

After it's done, should I move it to a secondary? I know it's not necessary but some people throughout the thread suggested moving it to a secondary after a few months. Should I get any sulfites or pasteurize it? And finally, if I move it to a secondary or leave it in the primary, how much air is okay or how should I top it off?

Thanks again!
 

andrewmaixner

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Thanks for the help. What should the gravity be at, or should I check it twice and see if it stabilizes?

After it's done, should I move it to a secondary? I know it's not necessary but some people throughout the thread suggested moving it to a secondary after a few months. Should I get any sulfites or pasteurize it? And finally, if I move it to a secondary or leave it in the primary, how much air is okay or how should I top it off?

Thanks again!
Watch for stabilization. It will probably stop around 0.99x-1.003. a finishing hydrometer makes it a lot easier to measure this value than a regular hydrometer. You may use sorbate/sulfite if you want to. if storing in glass, it's probably a good idea. If adding sugars for sweetness, it's an absolute requirement.
You want to minimize air, period. I move it to a CO2 purged keg and then to the keggerator when mine is ready.
 

fathertorque

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Started my first 5 gallon batch tonite. I was inadvertently doing a one gallon version of this recipe before I ever joined this forum. Unfortunately I don't have local access to dextrose so I used two pounds of brown sugar. For my yeast I'm using ec-1118.

View attachment 1434684345848.jpg
 

andrewmaixner

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Started my first 5 gallon batch tonite. I was inadvertently doing a one gallon version of this recipe before I ever joined this forum. Unfortunately I don't have local access to dextrose so I used two pounds of brown sugar. For my yeast I'm using ec-1118.
Brown sugar will turn out great. That's what I've used also.
And when I want a lighter cider, I just use juice and a little molasses (the brown part of brown sugar).
 

Xenemorph

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Watch for stabilization. It will probably stop around 0.99x-1.003. a finishing hydrometer makes it a lot easier to measure this value than a regular hydrometer. You may use sorbate/sulfite if you want to. if storing in glass, it's probably a good idea. If adding sugars for sweetness, it's an absolute requirement.
You want to minimize air, period. I move it to a CO2 purged keg and then to the keggerator when mine is ready.
Reading is about 0.994 calibrated for temperature. I went ahead and moved it to another clean carboy to minimize air.

I went ahead and tasted it; resembles chardonnay with a very small hint of apple and it's pretty much carbonated: is it supposed to be? Unfortunately I missed the original gravity reading because I broke the hydrometer.
 

NateX

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Reading is about 0.994 calibrated for temperature. I went ahead and moved it to another clean carboy to minimize air.

I went ahead and tasted it; resembles chardonnay with a very small hint of apple and it's pretty much carbonated: is it supposed to be? Unfortunately I missed the original gravity reading because I broke the hydrometer.
You'll need to degas it if you want it still like wine. I have bottle carbonated it, and recently I kegged it and force carbonated it, and I find it better carbonated than still.
 

zamo27

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Can the dextrose be substituted with a little elderflower cordial
I like the flavour or elderflower in cider or apple wine
 

tg123

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I failed the first 1gal batch when I bottled it last year. Kept for for a year and it still didn't taste that great using the Kirkland apple juice.
About a month ago I decided to try again but this time with Tree Top apple juice. I kegged a 2gal batch yesterday and carbed it at 25psi. Smelled and tasted pretty good when I racked it over. Has anyone started drinking it right away afterwards or let it age in the keg first? I hear it gets better with age but it's pretty tasty already so I might start a new batch soon and drink the one I have in the keg. :)
 

Xenemorph

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You'll need to degas it if you want it still like wine. I have bottle carbonated it, and recently I kegged it and force carbonated it, and I find it better carbonated than still.
Oh I prefer it carbonated, but I was just wondering if that's normal as it's my first batch. Thanks for the help.

Since I didn't get my starting gravity I looked around the thread and it seems like for Mott's apple juice it's somewhere around 1.066 and 1.06 or so in general, 1.07 on the higher-end. My ending gravity was 0.994; is it normal for the ABV to be around 9-10% instead of the 6%? I did add slightly more yeast I believe because I didn't properly measure it out. Sugar was pretty on-point. It definitely does taste like a very dry wine and it's working like one so I highly doubt it's only 6%
 

andrewmaixner

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Oh I prefer it carbonated, but I was just wondering if that's normal as it's my first batch. Thanks for the help.

Since I didn't get my starting gravity I looked around the thread and it seems like for Mott's apple juice it's somewhere around 1.066 and 1.06 or so in general, 1.07 on the higher-end. My ending gravity was 0.994; is it normal for the ABV to be around 9-10% instead of the 6%? I did add slightly more yeast I believe because I didn't properly measure it out. Sugar was pretty on-point. It definitely does taste like a very dry wine and it's working like one so I highly doubt it's only 6%
Because the sugars in real apple juice are all ferment-able, you can easily calculate the SG from the nutrition information.
Most juice is 120 Calories (28 grams sugar) per cup (8oz)

28 g * (0.00220462g/lb) = 0.0617294 lb

0.0617294 lb * (128oz/ga)/(8oz/cup) = 0.98767 lb/gal of sugar in the juice

0.98767 lb/gal * 5gal batch = 4.938 lb sugar in a 5 gallon batch

(4.938 lb * 46ppg) / 5gal = 45.43 gravity units, = 1.045 SG for regular 120cal/cup apple juice.

If you want to add sugar, just add it to the sugar weight number in pink. If you juics has over 28g sugar per cup, adjust that value in light blue



see: http://homebrew.stackexchange.com/q...e-to-estimate-og-from-nutritional-information
 

Xenemorph

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Because the sugars in real apple juice are all ferment-able, you can easily calculate the SG from the nutrition information.
Most juice is 120 Calories (28 grams sugar) per cup (8oz)

28 g * (0.00220462g/lb) = 0.0617294 lb

0.0617294 lb * (128oz/ga)/(8oz/cup) = 0.98767 lb/gal of sugar in the juice

0.98767 lb/gal * 5gal batch = 4.938 lb sugar in a 5 gallon batch

(4.938 lb * 46ppg) / 5gal = 45.43 gravity units, = 1.045 SG for regular 120cal/cup apple juice.

If you want to add sugar, just add it to the sugar weight number in pink. If you juics has over 28g sugar per cup, adjust that value in light blue



see: http://homebrew.stackexchange.com/q...e-to-estimate-og-from-nutritional-information

Just read EdWort's post again and looks like the 2 pounds of dextrose is supposed to boost is past 6% that I originally thought it would be with the sugar!

You're right about the 28 grams per cup. So it'd be...

4.938+2 = 7.938
7.938 * 46 / 5 = 73.0296 gravity units

Here's where I get stuck just substituting numbers in as I don't believe gravity units to SG would be linear or else it'd mean I have an SG of 1.68 and here's where I'm stuck with the math.
 

todd_k

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I'm sure it's been asked before but how long is this good after it is bottled? I found a stash in my closet that has been there for at least 3-4 years.
 

andrewmaixner

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... I don't believe gravity units to SG would be linear or else it'd mean I have an SG of 1.68 and here's where I'm stuck with the math.
specific gravity is just (mass of 1 volume of solution) / (mass of 1 volume of water). You might be over-thinking this. You can ignore the minimal liquid volume change from adding sugar, or you can just fill with juice to the desired volume, and use that "volume added" measurement of juice if you want to exactly calculate the expected OG.

Technically is it supposed to be the Density measured, but using Weight is completely acceptable for what we are doing.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Specific_gravity
 
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