Liquid Yeast

Homebrew Talk - Beer, Wine, Mead, & Cider Brewing Discussion Forum

Help Support Homebrew Talk - Beer, Wine, Mead, & Cider Brewing Discussion Forum:

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, and others.

beerjunky828

Well-Known Member
Joined
Nov 24, 2008
Messages
466
Reaction score
2
Location
Raleigh, NC
So I have not had any success using liquid yeast. Every time I have used WhiteLabs liquid yeast, I cannot seem to get fermentation to start. I just recently realized that the problem might lie within the fact that I just poured the yeast straight into the wort from the tube. So I just made a brown ale today and used an White Lab English Ale yeast. I made a starter using a cup of extract and about a quart of H2O. I pitched about 2 hours after making the starter. Should the liquid yeast finally work for me??? I hope it does for I have heard that yeast contribute a significant amount to flavor.

Thanks!
 
I used the White Labs Belgium Wit liquid yeast on Sunday and the beer is fermenting faster and harder than the dry yeast I used last time. I just poured it straight into the wort.
 
The small starter can help wake the yeast up, but you won't get significant propagation unless you make 2-qt starters or larger.

What you may try in the future if you are still experiencing laggy fermentations is to add some yeast nutrient to the starter and/or main wort. Theoretically, the yeast gets all the nutrients it needs from the wort, but I have found that a dose of labile nutrients gets things started quicker.

Also, keep a close eye on your fermentation temperatures. Usually it's recommended to "pitch cold", i.e. at or slightly below fermentation temperature, and then keep it steady until things begin to slow down. But you can try pitching warm and then slowly lowering the temperature to the yeast's optimum. Pitching warm tends to reduce lag times at the cost of somewhat higher production of esters and other flavor compounds that may or may not be desirable in the style of beer you are brewing.

Hope this helps!
 
2 hours probably wasn't enough time for the starter to "start". Starters are usually made a couple days before brewing to allow proper yeast growth.

However, there should be plenty of viable yeast in the tube to start fermentation without a starter. It isn't the most desirable way to pitch but it should still work. Could you be pitching the yeast in wort that is too hot?
 
Yea hot wort seems logical for inhibiting fermentation. Is it necessary to agitate the yeast before cracking open the tube? Also could the liquid yeast not start working due to "under" aerating the wort?
 
I used the White Labs Belgium Wit liquid yeast on Sunday and the beer is fermenting faster and harder than the dry yeast I used last time. I just poured it straight into the wort.

After I bottle some EdWorts apfelwein and this brown ale, I am making 2 white ales, using a belgian wit White Lab for one batch and a Wheat yeast for the other. So thats good news
 
use wyeast. you really dont need a starter with wyeast (if used correctly) and it's far superior to whitelabs IMHO.

EDIT
you really dont need a starter if your OG is < 1.06
 
I've not had any problems pitching White Labs straight from the tube. I've used 4-5 different strains, and all of them have worked great (two of them were even months out of date). Are you pitching them at fridge temps or are you letting them warm up for several hours before hand?
 
Wyeast Propagator packages have about the same number of cells as White Labs.

Just curious, do you have a reason for thinking that Wyeast is superior, or only an opinion?
 
Where are you getting your White Labs yeast from? If they've been stored in improper conditions, or transported in hot climate, they lost quite a bit of viability. I've always pitched WL yeast straight from the vial, no starter, and I've always gotten good results. Then again, my yeast comes from a store I trust, and is shipped thermally wrapped and with an ice pack.
 
I pitched a English pale yeast on Sunday and its been bubbling quite madly since Monday morning. No starter was used, just pitched and mixed it in well.
 
I've not had any problems pitching White Labs straight from the tube. I've used 4-5 different strains, and all of them have worked great (two of them were even months out of date). Are you pitching them at fridge temps or are you letting them warm up for several hours before hand?


No. All yeast have been in date. And they have had at least 3 hours out of the fridge before pitching. Especially today it was at minimum 3 hours out of the fridge before pitching.
 
I've always had good luck with White Labs right from the tube. I've even gotten some freebies that were out of date, and they've led to good fermentations.

In fact...I accidentally put my last tube of California Ale Yeast in the freezer for three hours, finally found it, warmed it up, pitched it, and it's fermenting happily at this moment.

The longest any of mine have taken to begin fermenting is about 36 hours; usually I see the initial signs of fermentation at about 16 and bubbles through the airlock right at 24.
 
Where are you getting your White Labs yeast from? If they've been stored in improper conditions, or transported in hot climate, they lost quite a bit of viability. I've always pitched WL yeast straight from the vial, no starter, and I've always gotten good results. Then again, my yeast comes from a store I trust, and is shipped thermally wrapped and with an ice pack.

No viability might have been an issue for my first 3 liquid yeast used. I live an hour from a LHBS. And I have always transported the yeast without keeping it cold. And then I arrive to the house and would immediately put it in the fridge. I went to a different beer store this time and they insisted on putting my liquid yeast in an ice pack. That never crossed my mind about transportation.
 
It just blows my mind that I can get dry yeast to start fermenting within 8 hours but I cannot get fermentation with liquid yeast. I took every precaution in not losing viability and pitching RT yeast. If fermentation has not started in 24 hours then the only logical explanation for this batch would be pitching the yeast into wort that is too hot. All I can do is RDWAHAHB. But this information is useful because I am going to start using liquid yeast for future batches. (if this english ale will do its job)
 
i bought some WL yeast from Austin Homebrew Supply and added the ice pack. The yeast arrived and the ice pack was essentially at room temperature. Anyway, I placed it in the fridge and took the yeast out the morning that I planned to brew. I let it sit out at room temperature for probably close to 10 hours and then followed the directions on the bottle to pitch and saw evidence of activity the next morning...so I would say I'm pleased so far with the results.

On my next batch I'm gonna try the dry stuff just to mix it up.
 
Just curious, do you have a reason for thinking that Wyeast is superior, or only an opinion?

just an opinion. I've used both and had better success and less lag time with wyeast. just another one of those things that everyone has a different idea about =)
 
No viability might have been an issue for my first 3 liquid yeast used. I live an hour from a LHBS. And I have always transported the yeast without keeping it cold. And then I arrive to the house and would immediately put it in the fridge. I went to a different beer store this time and they insisted on putting my liquid yeast in an ice pack. That never crossed my mind about transportation.

3 hours probably wouldn't be a huge deal. That's no worse for the yeast than your warm-up time out of the fridge before you pitch. I meant more along the lines of how it's transported from the manufacturer to the LHBS, and how the LHBS stores it once they recieve the yeast. Also, I generally leave my yeast out of the fridge for 12-24 hours (based on when I make the decision that I want to brew tomorrow) before pitching.

+1 to jacefive on his "You don't really need a starter if your OG is < 1.060. -1 on his "just use Wyeast," comment. White Labs has a few strains that Wyeast doesn't, and vice versa. Both are good, as is dry yeast. It comes down to personal preference and the style of beer you're making.

Before you give up on White Labs altogether, try ordering a vial from Austin Homebrew or Midwest Supplies. If that vial works for you, you'll know your LHBS is storing their yeast in crappy conditions or more likely their distributor is. As I said earlier, I use White Labs yeast on most of my batches, without a starter. I just let it warm up for 12-24 hours out of the fridge, shake it up a few times, and pitch directly. Never had a problem to date.

Edited: Oh, and it would be a good idea to keep a few packs of Nottingham or Safale S-04 yeast in the fridge just in case. If you pitch and nothing happens after 4 days, just toss in the Notty or S-04 and save your beer.
 
+1 to jacefive on his "You don't really need a starter if your OG is < 1.060. -1 on his "just use Wyeast," comment. White Labs has a few strains that Wyeast doesn't, and vice versa. Both are good, as is dry yeast. It comes down to personal preference and the style of beer you're making.

A good point. I guess I should be more clear in that with Wyeast under 1.060 i feel comfortable. I would still use whitelabs if i needed to but would always make a starter (just because if i didnt i think i'd sit up at night)

Bah. Have a homebrew =)
 
:off:

mmm im having a homebrew now. Llama are you jealous. lol actually im drinking that Honey Brown that I was so worried about last week and let me tell you, its still green and its at room temp but its damn good now!
 
For what it is worth, on my AHS Blue Moon Clone and AHS Holiday Chocolate Stout I used White Labs and pitched without doing a starter. They turned out fine and had no more than a 24 lag time. In fact, the holiday chocolate stout is absolutely amazing and I keep grabbing bottles out of the fridge every night.

For my more recent batches, I used the Wyeast activator packs and had about the same lag time (~24 hours.) For the Belgian Tripple I double pitched. (I really should have taken the opportunity to make a starter.)

Short version: I didn't see much of a difference between the Wyeast smack packs and the White Labs tubes.
 
:off:

mmm im having a homebrew now. Llama are you jealous. lol actually im drinking that Honey Brown that I was so worried about last week and let me tell you, its still green and its at room temp but its damn good now!

Not jealous at all. I hate Honey Browns. Hell, I hate homebrew beer. Now I just have to try to convince myself that's true for the next 10 hours until I can get home and drink some friggin homebrew. :(
 
A good point. I guess I should be more clear in that with Wyeast under 1.060 i feel comfortable. I would still use whitelabs if i needed to but would always make a starter (just because if i didnt i think i'd sit up at night)

Bah. Have a homebrew =)

Just recognize this is some idiosyncracy of your brain, not anything related to how the yeast will work.

Both Wyeast and Whitelabs have the same yeast count, so starters are needed in exactly the same situations for both.
 
Not jealous at all. I hate Honey Browns. Hell, I hate homebrew beer. Now I just have to try to convince myself that's true for the next 10 hours until I can get home and drink some friggin homebrew. :(

Oh Llama you are so silly...its ok you will be back to the HB soon enough!!
 
Just recognize this is some idiosyncracy of your brain, not anything related to how the yeast will work.

isnt this the story of homebrew? I'm starting to think (after this thread) that there has been some problem with the whitelabs that I've used as opposed to what I thought.
 
Thanks for the input. I will just have to wait it out and see. And yes I will order some yeast from AHS since it seems to work. I will keep you updated within the next 2 days. Again thanks! This site has some truly helpful people:mug: and the truly insane. :eek: But the line between the two is transparent!!:D
 
Thanks for the input. I will just have to wait it out and see. And yes I will order some yeast from AHS since it seems to work. I will keep you updated within the next 2 days. Again thanks! This site has some truly helpful people:mug: and the truly insane. :eek: But the line between the two is transparent!!:D

Ha glad you can see that. Those with the wisdom have the wit.

Welcome to homebrewing and the crazy world that is this Forum. There is alot to keep you occupied and dont be afraid to ask questions. This is a happy place where good things are cooked up with good people!!!

Cheers:mug:
 
SOOOO I am happy to report that there is some SERIOUS movement going on with the beer. I got a text from my little elf at around 9:30 this morning. It was pitched at 5:00 p.m. yesterday. So it probably started fermenting early in the a.m. I am excited to see how liquid yeast will contribute to the beer. WOOHOO:rockin:

Thanks for all the replies!!!!
 
SOOOO I am happy to report that there is some SERIOUS movement going on with the beer. I got a text from my little elf at around 9:30 this morning. It was pitched at 5:00 p.m. yesterday. So it probably started fermenting early in the a.m. I am excited to see how liquid yeast will contribute to the beer. WOOHOO:rockin:

Thanks for all the replies!!!!

Rock on, brother! Glad to hear that WL yeast finally worked out for you. Personally, I love the stuff and use it every chance I get. Sounds like you need to switch over to this new LHBS, at least for yeast. :ban:

Orange, I'm home from work now! It's 10 AM, and I've already had 3 liters of homebrew. YUMMMY! I lied about the Honey Brown, and it hurt me all night! I feel so much better now that I can drop the deception. After a good stout and a porter, brown ale is my 3rd favorite style. :mug:
 
Any supporting evidence of this?

Yes - Wyeast and/or White Labs statements in various interviews. To summarize, there are sufficient yeast cells in the vial/smack pack to process that small amount of sugar, so there is no need for them to replicate in significant numbers. It's basically an extreme overpitch.

You can also verify this by yourself by simply measuring the thickness of the yeast bed before and after fermentation. It only thickens slightly, and much of the increase is trub from hotbreak/coldbreak.
 
I'm glad I read this thread. I made the 20 min drive to AHS today specifically to pick up a WL british ale yeast for a Nut Brown I'm brewing tomorrow morning. I have never used liquid yeast before, but between the advice I got at AHS, and all the tips I found in this thread, I'm feeling much more confident in pulling it off. Thanks for all the helpful tips, even though they weren't specifically for me.
 
Yea hot wort seems logical for inhibiting fermentation. Is it necessary to agitate the yeast before cracking open the tube? Also could the liquid yeast not start working due to "under" aerating the wort?

I hope you are cooling the wort below 85F before you pitch the yeast, otherwise it will die, (Or become severely crippled or retarded). Yes you should shake the vial, yes you should aerate the wort. I've never had a problem with white labs and I pitch straight to the fermentor.
 
Back
Top