Quantcast

Lets talk stouts!

HomeBrewTalk.com - Beer, Wine, Mead, & Cider Brewing Discussion Community.

Help Support Homebrew Talk:

HomeBrewMatt

Member
Joined
Apr 2, 2005
Messages
8
Reaction score
0
Whats your favorite stout? Id have to say Young's Oatmeal Stout has to be my favorite. My runners up are Beamish Irish Stout and Imperial Stout from my local brewhaus(Blackforest). It has too be in the pub cans too sooooooo good :D
 

SwAMi75

Banned
Joined
Mar 6, 2005
Messages
2,458
Reaction score
10
Location
Midwest City, OK
To me, a well tended pint of Guinness is like drinking a cold glass of milk. It's just good.

I haven't had many good ones out of a bottle. The only one that comes to mind is Sammy Smith's oatmeal stout.
 
OP
H

HomeBrewMatt

Member
Joined
Apr 2, 2005
Messages
8
Reaction score
0
I can agree Guiness is good if served properly. To many bartenders really dont know how to properly serve Guiness. But even so its good to know that most places you go to will have it available so you not stuck drink watered down crap like Bud or Coors.
 
OP
H

HomeBrewMatt

Member
Joined
Apr 2, 2005
Messages
8
Reaction score
0
Sammy Smith is good I had it in the city at an ale house one night. I cant say I enjoy stouts as much from the bottle. For some reason the pub can always tastes better. Definately try a Young's Oatmeal or if you like chocolate flavored beers the Double chocolate is really good too.
 

kenmc

Well-Known Member
Joined
Apr 1, 2005
Messages
329
Reaction score
1
Location
Dublin, Ireland
Beamish is a very poor relative of stout. I am convinced that Guinness sell off any bad brews down to Beamish, and they rebadge it. Seriously though - it's far too bitter/sour. Guinness is delicious, but you really have to come over to Ireland to drink a proper one. i don't bother drinking Guinness when I'm abroad any more - put it like this - there's pubs here that I don't trust their Guinness, so I'm sure as hell not gonna chance it on a random pub abroad....
Other stouts worthy of mention are Plain and Oyster, brewed in the Porterhouse here in Dublin.
 

Dude

Well-Known Member
Lifetime Supporter
Joined
Jan 15, 2005
Messages
8,768
Reaction score
116
Location
Ramstein-Miesenbach
HomeBrewMatt said:
I can agree Guiness is good if served properly. To many bartenders really dont know how to properly serve Guiness. But even so its good to know that most places you go to will have it available so you not stuck drink watered down crap like Bud or Coors.

I'm curious what you mean by pouring it properly?

My favorite is Guinness by far. I've had it overseas and I've had it in the states many times. I agree it doesn't compare here but sometimes that rare place you find over here has good stuff. This past weekend (in Florida) I tried it at two different places and the Irish pub I went to it was great. The sports bar I went to it was terrible, watered down and not so good.
 

kenmc

Well-Known Member
Joined
Apr 1, 2005
Messages
329
Reaction score
1
Location
Dublin, Ireland
orrelse said:
I'm curious what you mean by pouring it properly?
Well first off the lines have to be clean and the kegs kept at the right temperature - otherwise you can have the bestest Guinness barman inthe world pour it and it will still taste crap. The best pubs in Ireland for Guinness are the old ones with stone cellars and a high turnover of Guinness, and a short distance between taps and kegs.
As regards the pour, it's a 2 stage pour. Should be poured (glass at an angle of course) to about 75-80% of the glass first and let settle for a minute or 2, and then topped up. The head should stay on the pint even if you tilt the glass so that the head overlaps the edge - i.e. the head should not be so watery that it spills. You should not start drinking the pint till it has all gone black - i.e. has totally settled. Oh and the barman should NEVER be let draw shamrocks or christmas trees or anything like that in the head.
Hate to break it to you though, but the guinness you get over there is reconstituted from whats brewed here in Ireland - they export "essence of guinness" which is non alcoholic (no duty to pay that way) and add it to some locally brewed something. Apparently - else they brew it up ising the esscence. Either way you're getting a poor impression of it. I've had a guest come over from the states to Ireland and when he tasted Guinness here he nearly cried when he realised what he'd been missing out on.
edit : oh and the shape of the glass is also important - should be a tulip glass, and not a straight sided glass.
i.e. http://www.pubglasses.com/Merchant2/graphics/00000001/cb3wl.jpg
not http://www.pubglasses.com/Merchant2/graphics/00000001/2170_L.jpg and not http://www.pubglasses.com/Merchant2/graphics/00000001/GIANTPINT_L.jpg and CERTAINLY not http://www.pubglasses.com/Merchant2/graphics/00000001/1242_L.jpg
 

Dude

Well-Known Member
Lifetime Supporter
Joined
Jan 15, 2005
Messages
8,768
Reaction score
116
Location
Ramstein-Miesenbach
kenmc said:
Hate to break it to you though, but the guinness you get over there is reconstituted from whats brewed here in Ireland - they export "essence of guinness" which is non alcoholic (no duty to pay that way) and add it to some locally brewed something. Apparently - else they brew it up ising the esscence. Either way you're getting a poor impression of it. I've had a guest come over from the states to Ireland and when he tasted Guinness here he nearly cried when he realised what he'd been missing out on.

Please post your sources on that--I'm not agreeing with that statement completely. I can believe the Guinness is somewhat different over here in the states, but I don't buy that its different in all parts of Europe.
 

ryser2k

Well-Known Member
Joined
Mar 10, 2005
Messages
466
Reaction score
4
Location
Schuylkill Haven, PA
I heard that Guinness in North America is brewed in Canada. I believe they brew it from scratch there using the same ingredients. I'm not sure what could be so drastically different between that and the original brewed in Ireland, but I too have heard that the US version is not as good.

Perhaps it is just the glory of the moment, sitting in a pub in Dublin sipping on a Guinness, that makes people think it tastes better ;)
 

ryser2k

Well-Known Member
Joined
Mar 10, 2005
Messages
466
Reaction score
4
Location
Schuylkill Haven, PA
It’s also been noted that the Guinness brewery at St. James Gate in Dublin, Ireland creates what they call a Guinness “essence,” which is shipped to contract brewers throughout the world. Sources claim this essence is then blended with a clear beer base (like the Smirnoff Ice base perhaps?) and packaged. And though Guinness is adamant that the Guinness Draught kegs coming into the US are from Ireland, the thought of shipping hundreds of thousands of kegs to the US each year is ridiculous. To boot, keg labels merely state “product of Ireland” vs. “brewed in Ireland” – a result of the essence being manufactured in Ireland, and the rest put together elsewhere?
This story backs up what kenmc said. You can read it all here: http://www.beeradvocate.com/news/stories_read/f-449075/
 

kenmc

Well-Known Member
Joined
Apr 1, 2005
Messages
329
Reaction score
1
Location
Dublin, Ireland
ryser2k said:
This story backs up what kenmc said. You can read it all here: http://www.beeradvocate.com/news/stories_read/f-449075/
Thanks Ryser2k - that'll save me looking - I dunno where i saw/read/heard the info in the first place - may even have been a TV program they did on the Guinness legacy and family over here.
I've also heard that "regular" Guinness in places like Kenya is circa 8%.... Have to get me some of that for a try....
But Guinness have been trying to gain some of the "younger" market recently - hence the "extra cold" line, the draught bottle that failed and the successful draught can....
 

Dude

Well-Known Member
Lifetime Supporter
Joined
Jan 15, 2005
Messages
8,768
Reaction score
116
Location
Ramstein-Miesenbach
ryser2k said:
This story backs up what kenmc said. You can read it all here: http://www.beeradvocate.com/news/stories_read/f-449075/

Sorry, that still doesn't "prove" anything to me. I never doubted Guinness is different in the U.S., but when I had it in Germany, Luxembourg and Holland(many different times and places), I'd be willing to bet it was the same Guinness that is brewed and served in Ireland. Its cheap to import it to most Europe states. To say Guinees is different everywhere but Ireland is just plain wrong. The U.S. I can understand its expensive to import it and it would make sense to brew it closer, and I'm not denying it is probably not the same.
An article with 3 guys claiming to be beer experts doesn't prove much to me.
Also, I don't blame Guinness for not answering them. Its just like Coca-Cola not giving out the "secret" recipe. I wouldn't either.

And what's wrong with drawing a clover in the head? :confused:
 

kenmc

Well-Known Member
Joined
Apr 1, 2005
Messages
329
Reaction score
1
Location
Dublin, Ireland
orrelse said:
Sorry, that still doesn't "prove" anything to me. I never doubted Guinness is different in the U.S., but when I had it in Germany, Luxembourg and Holland(many different times and places), I'd be willing to bet it was the same Guinness that is brewed and served in Ireland.
Nope believe me it's not the same at all, I've travelled a fair bit in Europe and even in England, just across the pond from us it tastes different. Actually there's a brewery in the UK that supplies the UK market.
Its cheap to import it to most Europe states. To say Guinees is different everywhere but Ireland is just plain wrong.
Nope, as far as I know duty has to be paid each time it's shipped if it's not for personal use, which it's not. Hence the creation of the non-alcoholic essence, which doesn't acrue duty, and is much less volumunous to ship.
The U.S. I can understand its expensive to import it and it would make sense to brew it closer, and I'm not denying it is probably not the same.
An article with 3 guys claiming to be beer experts doesn't prove much to me.
Also, I don't blame Guinness for not answering them. Its just like Coca-Cola not giving out the "secret" recipe. I wouldn't either.
Coke also do the same thing. The Coke for Ireland is made and bottled in Dundalk. There's the whole "brewed under licence by" thing we get all the time. In Ireland Heineken is brewed under licence by Murphys in Cork. So all our Heineken comes from Cork, unless it says "export" on it, and thats just bottles. The draught stuff all comes from Cork, not Holland. Carlsberg is brewed under licence by Guinness. In Dublin. Doesn't come from Denmark.

And what's wrong with drawing a clover in the head? :confused:
A) It's incredibly tacky.
B) It's a shamrock, for Ireland :)

edit : here's a website I found with some FAQs and Facts...
http://www.ivo.se/guinness/
 

kenmc

Well-Known Member
Joined
Apr 1, 2005
Messages
329
Reaction score
1
Location
Dublin, Ireland
ryser2k said:
Perhaps it is just the glory of the moment, sitting in a pub in Dublin sipping on a Guinness, that makes people think it tastes better ;)
Nothing to do with Dublin at all I'm afraid. The best pints I've ever had are always outside Dublin, in a little small pub in the country where there's no rushin around and the barmen/women have the time to do it all properly... You'll often find a small pub somewhere that *all* they sell is Guinness...
 

Dude

Well-Known Member
Lifetime Supporter
Joined
Jan 15, 2005
Messages
8,768
Reaction score
116
Location
Ramstein-Miesenbach
kenmc said:
Nothing to do with Dublin at all I'm afraid. The best pints I've ever had are always outside Dublin, in a little small pub in the country where there's no rushin around and the barmen/women have the time to do it all properly... You'll often find a small pub somewhere that *all* they sell is Guinness...

LOL....ridiculous.
 

Dude

Well-Known Member
Lifetime Supporter
Joined
Jan 15, 2005
Messages
8,768
Reaction score
116
Location
Ramstein-Miesenbach
kenmc said:
whats rediculous?

What's ridiculous is you coming on to this forum as a self-proclaimed Guinness expert and stating your opinions as FACT, when you haven't cited a credible source on the topic yet. When you post some facts on Guinness distribution or barrels produced from the Guinness breweries, then I might be impressed.
What took me over the top was your latest comment. Come on. Ryser2k posts a legitimate idea about drinking a pint in Dublin and you come back with your own opinion dissing him. What, the Guinness tastes different in the smaller pubs too? Give me a break.
You are trolling if I've ever seen it.
I'll be avoiding your posts on this forum from here on out out. I hate trolling. If you want to continue the Guinness battle, PM me from here on out and we will settle it so others don't have to see. PM me facts though, not your opinions.
 

kenmc

Well-Known Member
Joined
Apr 1, 2005
Messages
329
Reaction score
1
Location
Dublin, Ireland
orrelse said:
What's ridiculous is you coming on to this forum as a self-proclaimed Guinness expert and stating your opinions as FACT, when you haven't cited a credible source on the topic yet. When you post some facts on Guinness distribution or barrels produced from the Guinness breweries, then I might be impressed.
Well to be fair then you *did* ask
"I'm curious what you mean by pouring it properly?" and then I took the time to explain the different factors which go into pouring a pint of guinness properly. For what it's worth my grandfather used own a pub until he passed away, so with all due respect I do know more about what I'm talking about than you realise.
Also, living in Ireland I think that it's a safe bet that I have access to a hell of a lot more pubs in which to drink Guinness than you do in Virginia, and I've also made a point of trying Guinness anytime I've been abroad, to see how it compares, so again I think I'm in a better position to critique on it than you are.
What took me over the top was your latest comment. Come on. Ryser2k posts a legitimate idea about drinking a pint in Dublin and you come back with your own opinion dissing him.
As for dissing Ryser, no, I was simply trying to say that being in Dublin, the home of Guinness, does not make it taste better. Apologies to him if he felt it was a diss.
What, the Guinness tastes different in the smaller pubs too? Give me a break.
Actually yes. The guinness tastes different in *every* pub. There are plenty of pubs where I will not drink the Guinness cos I don't like the taste of it. It's not like a bottle or a can where what goes into it comes out of it. There are so many different factors which affect the outcome from a keg - i've explained some of them already, also other things like the length of time the keg is there, how long the beer is sitting in the lines at the start of the day (some pubs run off several pints each morning before they serve the first one).
You are trolling if I've ever seen it.
I'll be avoiding your posts on this forum from here on out out. I hate trolling. If you want to continue the Guinness battle, PM me from here on out and we will settle it so others don't have to see. PM me facts though, not your opinions.
you want facts - ok. to prove that the Guinness in the UK was not brewed in Ireland look at these. Are they all lying??
http://www.washtimes.com/upi-breaking/20040415-010703-4695r.htm
http://www.rte.ie/news/2004/0415/guinness.html
http://www.camraheartofwessex.org.uk/beer_bytes_18/Scottish_&_Newcastle.htm
http://newswww.bbc.net.uk/1/low/business/3628941.stm


If you look through those links you will see that after this summer, the London brewery will close, and production for the UK market will be returned to Dublin. Ergo the UK Guinness was not produced in Dublin, like I've already stated. You want your facts, there you go.
Actually here's another one:
"Giving something back to the community has always been part of our way of doing business. Our first philanthropic initiative in Africa, the first Guinness Eye Hospital in Kaduna, was set up in 1963 - at the same time as the first Guinness brewery in Nigeria." - and here's the source : http://www.diageo.com/citizenshipreport2004/africa.asp (in case you're wondering who Diageo are, they own Guinness)

So now that I have provided some facts, do you still think I'm trolling??? Apologies if I came across as arrogant/trolling whatever, 'twas not my intention - I just thought that I was providing useful info. If you ever find yourself over in Ireland I'll take you on a personal tour and give you solid (sorry - liquid ;) ) facts. But it's your round though :)
All the best
Ken
 

Dude

Well-Known Member
Lifetime Supporter
Joined
Jan 15, 2005
Messages
8,768
Reaction score
116
Location
Ramstein-Miesenbach
kenmc said:
Also, living in Ireland I think that it's a safe bet that I have access to a hell of a lot more pubs in which to drink Guinness than you do in Virginia, and I've also made a point of trying Guinness anytime I've been abroad, to see how it compares, so again I think I'm in a better position to critique on it than you are.

As for dissing Ryser, no, I was simply trying to say that being in Dublin, the home of Guinness, does not make it taste better. Apologies to him if he felt it was a diss.

If you look through those links you will see that after this summer, the London brewery will close, and production for the UK market will be returned to Dublin. Ergo the UK Guinness was not produced in Dublin, like I've already stated. You want your facts, there you go.

Let's get some things straightened out:

1. I never said Guinness wasn't brewed outside of Dublin.
2. I never said the Guinness overseas isn't different (in taste or otherwise)than the Guinness in Dublin.
3. When I asked how to pour it properly, I was familiar with the "pour 3/4 and wait, then fill to the top" method as you described, however, it is of your opinion that it is the proper pour. There are at least 2 other methods that work, IMHO. I had one in Holland that served Guinness, where the bartender poured the beer with no head whatsoever and a contraption was used to shoot nitrogen into the glass, which instantly produced a thick white head, exactly like a regular pour. I did not notice a difference in taste. Also, adding a clover to the head is merely a marketing gimmick. It works. For you to say its corny or whatever, is simply blind. It does not affect the flavor, and probably enhances the experience for some unfamiliar with the magic of Guinness. You are used to the tastes of good beers, whereas here in the U.S., we are Bud/Miller/Coors dominated. Most people won't even try a darker beer for the fact that it only looks different from what they are used to. Dummies. :D Anyway, if adding a clover to the head of a Guinness will get one more new person to try it, I'm all for it. Try that with a Budweiser, huh?
4. Again, your facts are wrong. The UK brewery brewed Guinness for the UK market. One of the articles you (link) posted even says so. I've found further articles mentioning the same point. I knew that already and that's been the sole point of my argument. You failed to prove anything and even your proof still doesn't tell me anything different than what I already knew.
The Guinness brewery in Dublin exports beer. I don't have definitive "proof" for that yet, but I've e-mailed a source that will probably be able to clear it up for me. I'll share that when it comes in. However, I know that the Dublin brewery exports kegs to some parts of Europe. I'm only assuming that the Dublin brewery is the distribution point from where you are quaffing your fine Guinness.
5. I don't know if Ryser was offended or not, but I've noticed you seem to like to disagree for the sake of disagreement. I highly doubt you can prove that a small pub outside of Dublin has better beer than a pub in Dublin. That was a broad statement that should have been taken that way--which everyone following this thread did, except for you. Blame it on internet, but most of us North Americans would probably give our left nut to drink a pint in Dublin. I'm sure it would taste better just for the fact you are there. That's what Ryser meant, IMHO.
6. Last, don't go assuming you are talking to some hick who has never left my hometown. I've been outside of the United States. I've been active military for almost 15 years, and its afforded me the opportunity to see my share of countries (Germany, Luxembourg, France, Switzerland, Honduras, Panama, Korea, to name a few). My point though, without going into extensive details, is that I frequented an Irish pub in Germany that served Guinness from Ireland. I became good friends with the Irish bartenders, the owners, and many Irishfolk who frequented the place. The owner got his Guinness from Ireland, as the Guinness brewery still distributes beer to foreign countries. I'm not sure on the exact standards of where and how much goes out, but I know I've had authentic Guinness OUTSIDE of Ireland. You can believe your theory that Ireland has the "good" Guinness monopolized, but its just not true.
 

patto1ro

Well-Known Member
Joined
Apr 7, 2005
Messages
274
Reaction score
49
Well, Heineken ship millions of bottles to the USA each year.

The Guinness essence is brewed at the Waterford Brewery, which was closed in 2003 and converted for this purpose.

Officially, the essence is used in Guinness's tropical breweries (i.e in Africa) in the production of Guinness Foreign Extra Stout.

If Guinness isn't shipping beer to the USA, exactly where are the 2.5 million hectolitres of exports going? Not to the UK, because (for the time being) Guinness still has a brewery in London.

Guinness brews around 4 million hectolitres a year at St James's Gate and total Irish beer consumption is only 5.6 million hectolitres. Guinness may have a lot of the Irish market, but not that much. If you want to see some real figures, look here:

http://www.xs4all.nl/~patto1ro/irlbrew.htm

Of course, the classic and delicious Guinness is the bottle-conditioned Extra Stout, only available in Ireland. Nitro draught Guinness, where the gas destroys the beautiful roast aroma, is a charicature of this wonderful beer.

The Guinness sold in Continental Europe is NOT the same as the Guinness sold in Britain or Ireland. It's a stronger (5%) beer. Still served the same horrible nitro way, though, so it looks the same.


Ron.
 

Janx

Well-Known Member
Joined
Dec 29, 2004
Messages
1,677
Reaction score
24
Location
San Francisco Bay Area
My understanding was that the best Guiness was to be had in Belgium (seriously).

There are definitely like 16 different recipes for the stuff. My stout on a nitrogen tap (what exactly is horrible about nitro beers, Ron??? I absolutely love them.) is better than any of them, though, and that's a FACT!

Always starting something... ;)
 

Dude

Well-Known Member
Lifetime Supporter
Joined
Jan 15, 2005
Messages
8,768
Reaction score
116
Location
Ramstein-Miesenbach
Janx said:
There are definitely like 16 different recipes for the stuff. My stout on a nitrogen tap (what exactly is horrible about nitro beers, Ron??? I absolutely love them.) is better than any of them, though, and that's a FACT!

Always starting something... ;)

I'm guessing Ron meant the little nitro widget that is included in the bottles (and cans) of Guinness draught that we get here in the states. I agree with him somewhat--the roasted aroma is noticeably more faint than getting one fresh from the tap.
However--serving Guinness with nitro is mandatory, IMHO.
 

patto1ro

Well-Known Member
Joined
Apr 7, 2005
Messages
274
Reaction score
49
The combination of:

1. mixed gas (notrogen and CO2) top pressure
2. far too low a serving temperature

completly masks the glorious roast barley aroma of Guinness. It seems a deliberate attempt to remove as much flavour as possible from the beer.

Draught Guinness is better than caned or bottled "draught" (with a widget) but still not a patch on genuine bottle-conditioned Extra Stout. I realise that to have tried this you either have to be old enough to remember when it was still available in Britain, or to have visited Ireland. It's a mystery to me why Guinness don't make this version more widely available.

Belgian Guinnees is a slightly tweaked version of Foreign Extra Stout and has 8% alcohol. It's the closest match you'll find today for 19th century Guinness Extra Stout. You can see the details here:

http://www.xs4all.nl/~patto1ro/irlbrew.htm#styles

Some of the bottled Guinness sold in Britain has always been brewed in Ireland. It's easy to tell which, because it says "Brewed in Dublin" or "brewed in London" on the label. It was usually ones bottled by brewers in the North West of England that had Dublin Guinness. British draught Guinness was/is all brewed in London.

Guinness established their London brewery as reaction to suddenly finding their largest market in a foreign country. After Irish independence they had to start paying import duty on beer sent to Britain. It's easy to see how much beer we're talking about by looking at beer imports to Britain. They jumped from 50,000 barrels (82,000 hl) a year in 1910 to 1,500,000 barrels (2,455,000 hl) in 1924. The vast majority of that beer was Guinness.

The traditional way to serve draught Guinness isn't on nitro, but from two casks behind the bar. Each glass was first filled about two-thirds with old, relatively flat beer from the lower cask ("low stout"). It was topped up with lively, young beer from a smaller cask on a high shelf ("high stout"). This method of serving died out in the early 1970's.

Ron.
 

80/-

Well-Known Member
Joined
Feb 28, 2005
Messages
96
Reaction score
1
patto1ro said:
Some of the bottled Guinness sold in Britain has always been brewed in Ireland. It's easy to tell which, because it says "Brewed in Dublin" or "brewed in London" on the label. It was usually ones bottled by brewers in the North West of England that had Dublin Guinness. British draught Guinness was/is all brewed in London.
From what I recall of my last visit to Dublin in the late 1980's the brewery at St James' Gate was still exporting Guiness to the UK. There was a small fleet of tankers which used to be filled on the Liffey with product tanked straight from the brewery and which sailed across to Liverpool to deliver the beer. IIRC correctly it was casked in Liverpool.

The ships had black hulls with a cream superstructure - a nice touch I thought :D - it was also said at the time that the best pint of Guinness to be had outside of Ireland was in Liverpool as that was the area that received "the real deal" from the Dublin Brewery.
 

kenmc

Well-Known Member
Joined
Apr 1, 2005
Messages
329
Reaction score
1
Location
Dublin, Ireland
Unfortunately those ships have long since gone. There were 3 of them in all - can't remember the names of them though. Were class all the same. Dunno if they sank or what happened to them.
 

Dude

Well-Known Member
Lifetime Supporter
Joined
Jan 15, 2005
Messages
8,768
Reaction score
116
Location
Ramstein-Miesenbach
kenmc said:
Unfortunately those ships have long since gone. There were 3 of them in all - can't remember the names of them though. Were class all the same. Dunno if they sank or what happened to them.

Wonder how we could find out? I'd like to name my kids after them! (okay, maybe future pets at least...) :)

I haven't seen that in any of the FAQs I've read....
 

ryser2k

Well-Known Member
Joined
Mar 10, 2005
Messages
466
Reaction score
4
Location
Schuylkill Haven, PA
The plot thickens.... I bought a case of Guinness Draught bottles (with the widget in them) from a small time distributor here in PA. On the side of the bottle it says brewed at St. James Gate, imported by Diageo. So are they just lying to me, or was this beer really brewed in Ireland?
 

kenmc

Well-Known Member
Joined
Apr 1, 2005
Messages
329
Reaction score
1
Location
Dublin, Ireland
ryser2k said:
The plot thickens.... I bought a case of Guinness Draught bottles (with the widget in them) from a small time distributor here in PA. On the side of the bottle it says brewed at St. James Gate, imported by Diageo. So are they just lying to me, or was this beer really brewed in Ireland?
wierd. haven't seen the guinness draught bottles around here for a couple of years.... check the Best Before date :)
Was generally regarded as a failure to try entice more women to drink Guinness - along the lines of the alcopop market....
 

Dude

Well-Known Member
Lifetime Supporter
Joined
Jan 15, 2005
Messages
8,768
Reaction score
116
Location
Ramstein-Miesenbach
kenmc said:
wierd. haven't seen the guinness draught bottles around here for a couple of years.... check the Best Before date :)
Was generally regarded as a failure to try entice more women to drink Guinness - along the lines of the alcopop market....
We have the Draught bottles (and cans) all over the place here. I haven't looked on the bottle to see where its brewed though....I'll do that tonight.
Whatever Guinness is doing with this recipe and having all of these "versions", remains a mystery to me.....
 

kenmc

Well-Known Member
Joined
Apr 1, 2005
Messages
329
Reaction score
1
Location
Dublin, Ireland
Yeah we have cans a-plenty, although I don't normally drink them. I think all the different versions and stuff are attempts to claim back market share. At least over here Guinness has taken a bit of a battering amongst younger drinkers, with the alcopops, bottles of heineken et al and lager sales climbing. Girls also tend to go for wine or spirits ahead of pints, so the bottles were trying to aim at them as far as I know. Pity the bottles are not so common here cos I think that beer tastes a lot better from a bottle than a can. Must look in the offie next time I'm in to see if they have bottles of G

EDIT: Just back from the supermarket, here's what we have Guinness wise in my local anyway:
Bottles:
330 ml and 500 ml of Guinness Stout (4.2%).
330 ml Guinness Foreign Stout (7.5%)

Cans:
330ml and 500ml of Guinness Draught Stout (4.2%)
330ml and 500ml of Guinnes Stout (4.2%)
(i think the % are all correct).
No sign of draught bottles.... will make a point of keeping an eye out though....
 

NM68657

Active Member
Joined
Oct 7, 2006
Messages
32
Reaction score
0
I was in Ireland this past Summer and I think the Guiness in the states is a bit watery tasting compared to the GUiness in Ireland. I'd also say,most bartenders here do not know how to properly pour a Guiness and some of the bars serve Guiness before the bubbles settle and fill the glass again...which results in a 3/4 pint.:mad: Overall, I like the dry taste of Guiness...Brilliant!!

I'm also one of those who enjoy mixing beers like Guiness with Bass or Guiness with Harp. This is not looked upon so kindly in Ireland...I downright confused some bartenders. ONe told me it was a f.....n waste of Guiness to do that (mix beers)!:drunk:

Primary: Easy Wheat
Secondary: Irish Stout
Bottled: IPA
 
Joined
Apr 13, 2006
Messages
13,304
Reaction score
160
Location
Phoenix
NM68657 said:
I was in Ireland this past Summer and I think the Guiness in the states is a bit watery tasting compared to the GUiness in Ireland.
I was in Ireland this fall.
Did you get to taste Toucan Brew or Northstar?
Beginning about 18 months ago Guinness began releasing variations on its recipes called the Guinness Brewhouse series. There are to be 12 of these released every 6 months.

The first was Bew 39 which I did not get to taste.
The second was Toucan Brew, which I did sample. It was different, but It was hard for me to characterize.
The third was Northstar which completely eliminated the bitter finish and had the sensation of drinking chocolate milk.

These were not popular with everyone I talked to. I enjoyed them but I was not looking to get attached to a beer that in a few months would forvever disappear off the face of the earth.

Here are my observations about Guinness in Ireland from someone who previously only had them in the US (and it's one of my faves):
  1. I believe that the Guinness was different in that it was consistently always good as opposed to the US where you can get some bad ones. By bad I mean gritty tasting, poor temperature, lack of finish.
  2. My understanding is that this beer is best enjoyed if drank within 10 days of leaving the brewery. Turnover, then would be essential. In the morning you can see trucks are equipped with an arm that pulls 4 kegs off the truck at a time. This kind of volume occurs even at a corner pub.
  3. My wife, who does not like Guinness in the least because it tastes like coffee (her words), can drink Guinness without a problem in Ireland, which to me implies that the beer is less roasty bitter there.
  4. Given the tourist dollar there is a certain pride about pouring and serving that doesn't always happen in the States (but it does happen depending on the pub here).
  5. Given the marketing and recent experimentation with the Brewhouse series, we can imply that there might be a strategy in keeping the recipe slightly different depending on the destination. This is the anti-McDonalds strategy.
BTW the best stout I had was at the Porterhouse in Dublin. The Wrasslers 4X Stout:

Alcohol by volume: 5%
Grain: Pale Malt, Crystal Malt, Wheat Malt, Flaked Barley, Roast Barley, Roast Malt.
Hops: Galena, Nugget, East Kent Goldings.

Made to a recipe originally brewed by Deasy's at West Cork in the early 1900's. This was Michael Collins' favourite tipple - a stout like your grandfather used to drink. A fine fullsome stout, full in every way, a pungent aroma of kettle hops. A generous quantity of roast grain for flavour, bitter with flaked barley producing that body.
It was Hoppy like an IPA and dry and creamy like a Guinness.
 

disaffected

Well-Known Member
Joined
Aug 28, 2006
Messages
819
Reaction score
7
My favorite stout is Young's Double Chocolate Stout. It is the finest tasting stout I've ever had; certainly the best I can get here in Texas. I've never been to Ireland or England, so my experience is fairly limited.

I never drink any stout or other beer or ale that has a nitrogen widget in it anymore. It was a novelty at first, but I no longer care for the affect it has on the beer.

As for Guinness, the Extra Stout in bottles is the only one I drink. Correction: Used to drink. It's my second favorite stout. Correction: Was my second favorite stout. Honestly, there was a time when it was my top favorite. That all changed, though, when the taste of the stout went south. Or "North", as it were. Canada, in fact. I used to be able to get Guinness Extra Stout (or was it just Guinness Stout?) that was imported from Ireland, but that's been a few years. What we get here in Texas now is brewed in Canada by Labatt's. As far as I'm concerned, it isn't really Guinness Extra Stout. It certainly doesn't taste like what I remember from the past. It is weak and thin lacks the richness of the Guinness of my youth.
 

Chris_K

Well-Known Member
Joined
Oct 2, 2006
Messages
97
Reaction score
2
Location
Chicago, IL
All this talk of Guinness, I had to stop and get some on the way home today. Although it tastes decent (I've got the Pint+6oz bottle of Extra Stout) it lists it's country of origin as Toronto, Canada; and I was hoping for something more (it has been a while since I've had Guinness). I might stick to Young's until I can find some Guinness from Ireland, even if that means a trip there.
 

Buford

Well-Known Member
Joined
Oct 16, 2006
Messages
1,383
Reaction score
14
Location
Richmond, VA
A bar I used to go to years ago had an English bartender who had been pouring beers for over 15 years. He KNEW how to pour a Guinness, with the two stage pour, and he would even use the liquid flow to draw a shamrock on the head.

Occasionally I'd ask for a Guinness and black (black currant syrup added), but in general I stuck to Beamish Stout when they had it. It didn't turn over nearly as quickly, however, so they eventually did away with it.

Best stout I've had recently is an imperial stout, North Coast Brewery's Old Rasputin Russian Imperial Stout. It has a really good flavor that just kicks you in the face. That stuff can also lay you out if you don't watch it due to the high ABV.
 
Top